To wonder if domestic violence is seen as more acceptable than it was a few years ago...

[rosycheeksmum]

There are a few things that have got me wondering this.

Firstly, the whole Chris Brown thing. I was really disturbed at the Twitter trend that emerged after his appearance at I think, the Grammies, girls saying basically that he could beat them up any time.

Secondly, Natalie Cassidy's appearance on This Morning, excusing and downplaying her own domestic abuse situation.

Thirdly, I have just finished a book called Fifty Shades of Grey, which I was intrigued to read after seeing that it had gone to the top of the New York Times bestseller list and was marketed as a book that will 'make you want to have sex with your husband'! After having a baby recently that sounded good so I downloaded it on my Kindle - apparently all the NY housewives are raving about it.

It's basically the story of a completely abusive relationship! The main character is into bondage and sadism and treats his girlfriend worse than a dog, she's required to kneel submissively and not look at him, sign a contract agreeing that she is his to 'fuck when he likes', he turns up wherever she is when she tries to have a life of her own, punishes her when he feels like it by spanking her so hard she is left with marks....not erotica for me but domestic violence dressed up to look sexy.

Since when was all of this ok? Is DV now acceptable again, as long as it's dressed up in a certain way or carried out by someone famous? I find it all very depressing!

Of course not. Don't be ridiculous. Also a pretty offensive thread, actually. Have you read much of Mumsnet - as I see you're a newbie? Or are you being deliberately provocative?

I had heard of that book, but didn't realise the content. Will give it a wide berth.

I am hoping that people are more open about it, at bit, anyway, rather than it being more acceptable. Hope I'm right, but rather afraid I'm not

The rising DV is sons aggressive behaviour on mothers.

Never see many threads about that.

I'm sorry...offensive? I'm not a newbie, I have changed my name a few times. I'm not trying to be provocative, just interested in other people's views!

Yabu. Domestic violence is never acceptable but individuals caught up in the situation react differently.

Re Chris brown the whole thing Is ridiculous and girls screaming out for twitter attention, I doubt any of the would willingly be beaten up.

I don't think that DV is becoming more acceptable.

To some people, it was never acceptable, for others, never unacceptable, iyswim, they would consider themselves lucky, if they get a man who isn't violent.

The book is fiction. I was quite shocked the first time i read a Mills and Boon that i was given, about twenty years ago and to me , what was happening was sexual assaults dressed up. Dodgy fiction has always been around.

I haven't read the book but BDSM and domestic violence are miles apart from each other.

With BDSM, both partners get a sexual kick out of the sub/dom relationship.

Thought it was quite an intelligent thread actually and whether the op is new or not is irrelevant...

Can't say I've noticed it myself, but the examples you've given do sound disturbing. Has anyone ever seen the film "unfaithful"? It was on late last night. A scene where the female protagonist is almost forced into having sex despite clearly saying no is dressed up as being erotic. Made me feel a bit nauseous.

BIWI-any question is a valid one, MN is not a good reflection of what goes on in some sections of society.

I am amazed by posters who don't seem to know what life is like for many people in the UK.

The threads on MN show that some women live with DV and refuse to recognise the damage done to children living with it. I keep off the relationships board because of it.

I think your first two points are valid. 50 shades of grey is a Twilight-y rip-off, complete fiction and a bit crap about BDSM which is not DV. And your description of it is identical to the Jezabel email I read the other night

Why is the thread offensive BIWI?

Perhaps there is a leetle too much info about the book but there was a long-running thread about Natalie Cassidy in AIBU at the time which raised some interesting points.

The twitter comments reminded me of when I was seventeen and a girl I knew was telling a group of male friends that she would love to be raped. Specifying the location, the time, what they were wearing, even the weather so basically NOT a rape. What did it say about rape myths and how she was unwittingly perpetuating them?

The Chris Brown fans would probably not enjoy being actually beaten. Nothing sexy about a wired jaw, but maybe DV is the new fantasy. Then again, it has always been seen to be a bit romantic. Old Hollywood movies full of hysterical women being smacked around and then pathetically grateful to their masterful lover

I guess what disturbed me about the book is how popular it is, I know BDSM is a sexual fetish and some people are into that kind of thing but it struck me reading the book, surely it's just DV by another name?Maybe that's another thread though.

I don't think for a second that it is more acceptable now, but I wonder if now it is more openly talked about, women who would previously have stayed and never talked about it, talk about it now IYSWIM. And therefore it could appear that more people are choosing to accept it.

I 'm not sure I'm making my point very clear but hopefully you know what I mean.

No it's not DV by another name because both partners love it...that's the difference.

Some women (and men) get sexual kicks out of pain and domination...it's just the way it is.

It's suprising what a tender and loving relationship some BDSM couples have outside of the bedroom.

It's not for me, but I can totally see the difference.

what oreocrumbs said. It is more openly talked about now and I think that's the thing that's accepted, not the actual act of DV.

All campaigns start off to right a wrong, but at some point the more enthusiastic campaigners push it too far and lose public support (asserting BDSM is DV is an example), high tide is reached and the pendulum starts to go back.

I'm not sure DV is at that stage, but I think oreocrumbs post can be read as suggesting the debate has moved on from the campaigners to the general population, who are likely to be more moderate.

Also, the overall lack of money means government resources are reduced, as it is in so many other areas.

I would say the exact opposite. Much less accepted, much more in the public consciousness.

So YANBU to wonder about it but YABU if you believe it.

I don't know. I get that BDSM is a consensual thing. But this book has the psychotic male lead hitting the female lead till she cries. She admits she only lets him hurt her because she wants to be with him so much, but she doesn't like it. So, to me, that's an abusive relationship. Then you read shite like this
www.guardian.co.uk/books/2012/mar/14/fifty-shades-of-grey-erotica-trilogy?newsfeed=true
With some idiot publisher calling the books romantic and liberating...seriously, wtf???This is a book that depicts a horrible fucked up man abusing his girlfriend and it's erotica and top of the bestseller list, and publishers are paying huge sums for it?

And Chris Brown should be a social outcast...he beat a woman so badly she was hospitalised....yet he's feted and given awards and is lusted after by young women, again WTF??

I guess the Natalie Cassidy thing is more of a cause than a symptom, she's on TV excusing DV, it just concerns me that a new generation are more accepting of it and that it's been glamorised. My teenage daughter has a poster of Chris Brown up and when I tried to talk to her about his DV charge she said, he only hit her once. Obviously I tried to put her straight but that's a concerning attitude.

www.guardian.co.uk/books/2012/mar/14/fifty-shades-of-grey-erotica-trilogy?newsfeed=true

sorry here is link

Yes the Chris Brown thing does bother me. As does the way teenage girls seem to idolise Rihanna completely without a shade of worry about her choices.

I sincerely hope not

I'm nearly middle aged and back when I was growing up it was sweapt under the carpet. Now women seem to have far more of a voice. There's still a very long way to go but it's getting better slowly but surely.

Yes the Chris Brown thing does bother me. As does the way teenage girls seem to idolise Rihanna completely without a shade of worry about her choices

I don't understand that really?

How would you know whether teenage girls worry about Rihanna's personal choices?

I can only speak for my experience of teenage girls - my daughter and her friends - but they do not seem concerned about Rihanna's choices as far as i can see.

DV I think is far less accepted now than it was say 20 vyears ago. But the examples you quote are vey disturbing. I sincerely hope that DV is not becoming more acceptable though. I have also seen films that I think have basically featured rape scenes that are instead presented as rough and passionate sex. Basic Instincts for example. And it saddens me greatly that some young boys/men and girls/women will see this and may assume that this is then fine.

Maybe that's because she's a singer and they simply like her music?

I haven't asked any teenagers what they think of her choices in men but I doubt many of them would agree that beating her up was ok IYSWIM.