To think that the English state education is useless

[balotelli]

Having seen 2 dc go through the English state education system I have no intention of putting dc3 through it.

It taught me very little that I have used since. The vast majority of the useful info and lessons I need for my life to function and be enjoyed have been sourced from mu own initative since leaving state education.

My 2 dc have never been taught to budget, cook, parent etc at school. Everything they know on these subjects have been learnt at home from their parents.

The hours spent in the classroom were of very litttle use since leaving education. Both have jobs and have learnt well on the job and in fe but have never had to know,

how many wives Henry the 8th had, what the average rainfall in the Amazon rain forrest is, any algebra, trigonometry, physics, chemistry or biology.

While I know it is important to have a base knowledge of many subjects and an idea of what may be a passion that can spark a later carreer, I think that kids today spend way too long learning utter useless crap in school , being tested and stressed out of their developing minds for way too long and from a ridiculously early age.

There I feel better now.

Employers are more concerned with experience than grades you get from school. In every job none of the applicants know how to do it until they are trained anyway. So what the point is of education is anyones guess.

Are you living in the real world?
DS2 left school at 16yrs-but he needed his grade C maths, English and science to get his apprenticeship. DS1 wouldn't have got to university without the grades.
I have seen the blog of a HE mother who fondly thinks her DD is going to walk into university without formal qualifications. I think that she has a rude awakening soon. Of course it is possible-but not easy and I don't think that her DD is as wonderful to others as her mother thinks.

"I have seen the blog of a HE mother who fondly thinks her DD is going to walk into university without formal qualifications."

I've never actually come across a home educated child or home educator parent so what is the process for these children sitting exams etc.? Do they have to register to sit them at a convenient school? And what about subjects that require internal assessments? E.g. science investigations and the like which have to be written up and awarded a pass mark? How does that work?
And a University will most certainly require some measure of academic ability!

Whilst its true after maybe a few years employers are no longer interested in the fact up you got a "B" in woodwork in 1998, you still needed that b to open doors in the first place before you climb the ladder

Most of them do some exams Salmotrutta, if only A'level (missing out GCSE) It is possible to get to university without, but unfortunately some parents in HE sphere make it sound easy and it isn't-they need to be pretty exceptional to manage without. I keep reading the blog to find out what happens- I predict a steep learning curve for the mother.

What a sad idea that we should limit our children to only what they practically need to know in order to survive in life. Sounds like a great agenda for someone who would like an oppressive society to me. This is the sort of education that children from oppressive sects receive, with the girls learning how to be parents and the boys how to do manual jobs.

I want my children to have their imagination, skills and knowledge stretched at school, and happily that's what happens. My dd for example has been learning all about the ancient Greeks. She enjoyed the research (very useful life skill research, something that will bring value for the rest of your life) and was shocked to discover how very limited the lives of women were, which has made her value the freedoms she has and determined to fight for them that much harder (another life skill, fighting for you rights is again something most women are going to be doing for the rest of their lives).

I expect that the OP (and minimischief) think that learning about the Ancient Greeks is totally irrelevant, but then if you dismiss the importance of the past on the present (and future) your perceptions must be incredibly limited.

The problem is that if you are only educated to a very basic level - reading and writing and basic maths - you will almost inevitably have your life run by - and make money for - people who are more educated/privileged than you. This is why state education is there, you see. And goes up to 16.

Good post Nooka

DD1 has been He, albeit briefly. I had the devil's own job to get her into a grammar school up here as they had nothing to judge her on.

They most certainly weren't interested in experience, and neither will employers, unless you have very low expectations, or universities.

Fortunately, one did take a gamble on her and now she is expected to get As and Bs this summer.

Thanks exotic - I just wondered how home-educating parents go about registering their child for sitting the exams. And how they deal with internal assessments. Which all need to be verified and moderated etc.

I always wonder how the children feel too about being home-educated. Is it their choice or the parents? Do some of them wish they had gone to school or do they feel they had a great experience?

Ah, interesting Sarah - I'd imagine it's much harder to deal with the bureaucracy of exams at secondary stage for home-educators.

We can't limit them because we can't be 100% sure what they will be or want to do in say 20 years. One of the things we should do for our children is maximise their choices as much as we can. Choice is one of the things a broad education offers. Obviously choice will be limited by other factors but that's all the more reason to do what we can to maximise choice.

It was hideous, and not an experience I would recommend. If DD1 had been the child of a less, umm, vocal parent she would have sunk without a trace.

Gawd - sounds grim Sarah!

A lot HE students do either equivalent exams or access courses which are perfectly acceptable for many subjects but I cannot see dentistry or medicine accepting a GCSE maths equivalent tbh.

"The problem is that if you are only educated to a very basic level - reading and writing and basic maths - you will almost inevitably have your life run by - and make money for - people who are more educated/privileged than you. This is why state education is there, you see."

I've never thought of it that way motherinferior, but it's blindingly obvious now you've pointed it out.

"The problem is that if you are only educated to a very basic level - reading and writing and basic maths - you will almost inevitably have your life run by - and make money for - people who are more educated/privileged than you. This is why state education is there, you see."

I've never thought of it that way motherinferior, but it's blindingly obvious now you've pointed it out.

Equally the state has an agenda too

It's not easy fighting to get your child into an over subscribed selective school, when she has nothing on paper to prove that she is capable.

Fortunately her old Headmaster stepped in and gave her a glowing reference, and the Head of the 6th Year took a shine to her and persuaded the HM of the school to take a gamble. I can't imagine for one moment that he and I would have any success with a Uni.

Those 3 men, and DD1's determination changed the course of her future, and I will be eternally grateful to them for that.

The Op would hate me to teach her/his dc because I firmly believe in learning for learning's sake, and not to turn out worker drones or domestic goddesses. I tell pupils that they just don't know where life will take them, and the broader their education and knowledge of the world beyond their doorstep will prepare them. I generally believe that education can combat bigotry and intolerance too. Where is the OP anyway?

Flounced probably. or gone back under their rock/bridge

Well said, MI.

I may well have forgotten what an oxbow lake is (thanks for the reminder, Sarah) but being educated has been pretty handy in my path through life. And the fact that I did know an oxbow lake existed meant if I needed to know, I could look it up. Using the skills in looking stuff up I learned at school and university and have applied in every job since and widely in my personal life too.

I suspect you can take some credit too Sarah for pushing things forward!

@minimiss: Education is not about employability though. It is about helping children and young adults turn into fully fledged humans, able to think critically about what goes on around them, able to analyse fact and fiction, politics and science and understand their position in society - and to give them the tools to change that position and even that society if they so wish.

Without an understanding of history, philosophy, politics, religion, language and the natural sciences, they have no way of doing that and the people who DO have an understanding of these things, the highly educated elites, will carry on running the show.

Without mass liberal education, we would have no national intellectual life, no broad-based polity and eventually, no democracy and no freedom.

Is that what you really want?

That was in reply to the post about getting your DD into a school by the way!

... not about the OP flouncing!