To have refused 2 year old dd cake because she threw her tea on the floor

[GColdtimer]

My previous "eat anything" dd2 is becoming a pain at meal times. Dd1, her friend and dd2 sat down to pasta and dd2 said "don't want it" and flung it on the floor. I got her down from the table, the others ate their tea. Dd's owns had been to a party so bought cake. I wouldn't let dd2 have any unless she at least tried some tea. She refused and I held firm. Did I do the right thing? This was an hour ago and have just given her a banana which she wolfed down.

YANBU! Deliberately chucking food on the floor even at that age, (unless it's an accident) means they are not THAT hungry. You offered the meal again so you covered off the possibility she was ravenous but having an attack of the sillies. Defo NO CAKE!

I dunno Blu - they learn fairly quickly. DS2 went through a phase of throwing his food on the floor - I think he was younger than 24m even - and I just put it in the bin without a fuss and without replacing. He soon stopped.

YANBU. I would have done the same.

I have learnt the hard way not to even let DD get a sniff of dessert until she's finished with her main meal.

I probably would have just stuck with giving her the pasta dish and not the babana and bread. Nop pasta equals no cake. She is old enough to know.

I would have had her help clean it up. And put it all back on the plate in a mushy mess to show her that when we throw our food we cannot get it back nice, it has to go in the bin and it is a waste if we have a hungry tummy.

To me the cake is something seperate and pretty arbitrary, in the grand scheme of things. I guess I don't like the idea of making someone (anyone) eat something they don't want to. Surely it's up to them. Clearly throwing is no good, and the above clears that up (literally) but I don't see how insisting on one mouthful of something she'd already clearly rejected would actually help anything - is there a message there that I'm missing?

Yes coffee, you are missing quite alot I think

For a start, rewarding bad behaviour with a treat is never a good idea. And asking a child to try one mouthful of a food when they have a) an empty stomach and b) eaten the food before, is not in the slightest bit unreasonable.

YANBU I also would have done the same thing.

I did exactly the same with breakfast a while ago with dd1 who is 2.6. Also gave her a banana later.

I think she was demanding chicken nuggets for breakfast. And why not.

She hasn't thrown her toast across the room since.

YANBU. Maybe I am though because I enforce the same rule on a 20 month old- no taste of dinner = no pudding (though I except fish as she has fish-issues). I do wonder though how much is a taste. So I give pudding if she's scoffed down a more than 2 mouthfuls, or if she's not had the meal before I give pudding anyway.

You should NEVER punish by withholding pudding. You will make her crave sweet things even more and give her an eating disorder

is this for real?

OP - I do exactly the same thing with my middle aged 2 yr old. (He of the poo fest, currently). He is a tantrum head and a thrower, I anticipate our repetitive discipline will ensure he soon learns NOT to throw as it equals withdrawal of a privilege (book, game, toy). He has only just begun to throw in the past couple of weeks.

I know many people say under 4 yr olds don't understand consequences (similar to dogs), but that type of behaviour I cannot ignore and my DS has to learn it is unacceptable. Just as learning to say please and thank you through repetition, so is learning how to eat properly IMO.. perhaps I am just victorian mum!

Good for you for sticking to your guns

Throwing food on the floor is not on. It might have done her good to go to bed a bit hungry, having chosen not to eat her dinner. One night without dinner would do her no harm. I don't think I would have given a banana later.

Who suggested rewarding bad behaviour with a treat?

I suggested making her help to clean up and realising she has wasted her dinner.

Who says cake is a treat and pasta is not?

Asking a child to try food is one thing. Punishing when they do not do something you 'ask' by denying them something everyone else is having, well that's not 'asking them to try it' is it?

We ask them to try it by putting it on the table. From then it is their choice, surely? Not to throw it, but it's not up to us to control how much anyone else chooses to eat.

I would never send a 2 year old to bed hungry. A couple of hours later and it wont connect to what had happened earlier. I probably would have calmly cleared away (or possibly shown her as a previous poster suggested) but not turned it into a big issue and made a huge show of it.I'd never make my daughter finish what is on her plate though either. We did a blw approach and she eats most things now and at 3 if there's something she really doesn't like I won't make her eat it.

I'm obviously in the minority here though! I decided early on that I didn't want to make a fuss over mealtimes and its worked in our case.

I do exactly what you do.
First up, I insist she tries something. I can usually tell at this stage (just turned 3 yo) whether she genuinely dislikes something or not.
Nothing more is offered unless she at least tries. If she tries and really doesn't like then I will sort out another meal - but this is rare since I have a fair idea of what she is likely to like or not. She mostly eats what we eat but if there is something we are having that I think she may not like I give her a small spoonful of it alongside a separate meal I know she does like, just to see what she does with it (a sort of mix of trying something new but still setting her up for success by eating something tried and tested!).
If it is something I know she likes and she refuses then she gets nothing else. We also basically ignore her. She announced at the table yesterday she wasn't going to eat anything. I said "Oh, ok" and carried on talking to my husband. She watched me for a few minutes then picked up her fork and ate a few mouthfuls, whereupon we turned to her and said "Oh, lovely, you've decided to eat with us. Now, what did we all do today?" Worked a treat and she polished off the meal.
But you certainly don't get pudding until you have at least made a stab at your meal - otherwise the lesson learnt is "If there is something you fancy more than this, then all you have to do is upend your plate on the floor and you will get it faster, without having to bother about the meal."
I would also have given the banana at that age - you don't want them being super-hungry as they are not old enough yet (I don't think) to remember why they are hungry, or associate the hunger with the meal thrown away an hour before. But they are certainly old enough to learn the immediate lesson of 'Throwing food means no pudding'.

Ah just seen CoffeenWine - I too wouldn't make a big deal of cake being a "treat" that is taken away. I don't want to create those ideas around food myself its just a different type of food.

2 is very very young for behaviour control too. Obviously we shape that as parents but I wouldn't try to do that through restricting food.

I think YWBaBitU

Only because you may be making food more of a battle ground.

I mean saying - you can only have this if you eat this can lead children to ignore full feelings having forced down something they didn't want to get to the more desirable food and using food to punish/reward can lead to all sorts of problems.

It sounds like this is a one off though so I can't see that it would do too much damage children do have to learn about consequences. But, she may not understand that's what it is if she didn't understand that no cake would be the outcome of throwing her pasta on the floor before she threw it.

Coffee - the only thing is that if given the option, my dd would exist on chocolate and ice cream. She's 3 and doesn't get the concept of a balanced diet. So yes, I can put things on the table for her to try, but if she consistently refused and then proceeded to fill up on cake, because everyone else had it and I didn't like to refuse her, I don't think I'd be doing well as a parent.
So I have rules - I make it, you try it. That means eating a mouthful of it, not just looking at it. If you don't like it, genuinely, then fair play and you can have something else. She tends to say 'no' as a starting point to anything she doesn't recognise so needs a bit of persuasion and sometimes a slightly more firm approach. My dd is 3 - it is totally up to me to control how much she eats, and of what foods. I don't mean she has to finish everything on her plate - we've never worried about that. She eats what she wants to with regards to quantity, and she doesn't have to finish everything to merit pudding either - she just has to try something on her plate especially if it's new. But I have the final say over whether pasta or cake is a decent dinner.

pseudonym - we did blw. Still have a 3yo who is suspicious of new foods (something which developed at about 2.5 - before that she'd been brilliant and ate anything and everything we gave her to taste). I don't make a fuss about mealtimes either, but if your child refuses something and demands cake instead, do you give in? I just say 'No, sorry - you need to try at least a bit of xyz first.' It's not an argument because I don't argue, I just repeat the same answer. If she chooses to get down without eating, well, fine. She'll come back to me when she's hungry and we'll figure out a decent snack (or return of meal, depending on what's appropriate) then.

YANBU - based on the fact she threw it on the floor. She needs to know that is not OK.

If she had simply refused and said she didn't like it, then I would have played it by ear. Sometimes when DS is overly tired he doesn't fancy savory food, and running around with 2 older children may have tired her out.

And I think a 2yo knows that is not OK, and doesn't need a warning that if they throw their food on the floor there's no cake. Let's be honest we don't usually hand out meals with warning - as we don't usually forsee these sudden behaviours.

I suppose I disagree babybythesea although I actually think we have a similar approach, oddly. I believe it's our job as parents to provide a balanced diet - just that. To provide it, to put it on the table. And then it's the child's job to eat what they require as and when they require it. I am happy to let children self regulate. I don't think it's down to us to comment on or control amounts that go in in the same way it's not down to us to comment on or control the amounts that come out If you're providing a balanced diet, then that's where your responsibility ends and theirs begins.

Yesterday my DD ate all of her jacket potatoe with cheese and bacon and nothing more than a cucumber stick from the salad. Today she ate every scrap of the sweetcorn, peas and carrot portions she served herself, served herself seconds, and had little more than a spoonful of mashed potato or steak pie. It evens out. Do you think it would be better for me to insist she eat equal amounts of everything? What would be that purpose? Will I still be insisting on it when she is 10 when she's cooking the dinner? Or at 15 when she is buying her own lunches and dinners with regularity?

Both pasta and cake offer nutrition just different nutrition, the best way of telling what kind of nutrition your body currently needs is to stop and listen to it, I'm very wary of drowning out that voice in DC and replacing it with a healthy eating, clean your plate kind of mantra. I think a lot of problems come with the inability to self-regulate and realise what you need and when.

I think you did the right thing, keep strict on that or she will through absolutely everything on the floor on your face, like a spoilt brat. I never make any other dinner to mine, if she does not eat what it is on offer, there is no main meal. i do not let her go hungry anyway, she can eat bread, cheese and fruits as many as she wants. She ate a banana, so she should be ok. It will teach her a lesson.

Thanks everyone. It's very interesting reading your responses as I am quite torn by this (also did blw with both girls). . I am in agreement with the "you don't have to finish your plate" school of though but equally if she had her way at the moment she would just push away all savoury food then demand yoghurt (or cake). Normally she does eat her dinner after an initial shout of "ninished", the throwing her food away is a new thing which ivthink needs to be addressed.

I also wouldn't send her to bed hungry which is why she had a banana an hour later as she had complete forgotten about cake by then. In fact, I might go and eat hers now (I did eat all my dinner).

Yes totally the right thing and a regular argument at meal times in hour house.

You have made food and it's been refused so why should they then get a reward for their actions. It's difficult especially if you have another child tucking into cake opposite them , but your doing it so they grow up to be respectable and good people. What children learn early in life carries over in adult hood,and while refusing them cake may seem minor it will lern them respect for others feelings Dont feel bad we all do it !! :)

YABU

Puddings shouldn't be conditional. We only have a sweet treat for this reason - to avoid getting into the whole "eat your dinner then you can have pudding" madness. If DS doesn't look like he's eating his meal, we won't offer pudding at all.

I don't think it's a good idea to encourage someone to eat so they can eat more.

If DS rejects his food I'll leave him. No attention, just an ok while I finish mine then clear up. He's been doing this recently (he's 2.4) and he's started eating again. We're having more success if we ignore or let him choose some things eg sweetcorn or peas or the pasta shape for example. If he hasn't eaten I'll give him something a bit later and will not offer him his cold meal again. He's too young to male the connection. And anyway he's eating fine again now without having to do that.

I don't like using food as punishment. I remember eating out with someone who insisted on finishing their enormous meal - they were saying they were full about 2/3 of the way through but felt obliged to clean the plate as they had to as a kid. WTF??

Not we only, we don't have a sweet treat. D'oh.

CoffeenWine - that's what I think and do but you've expressed it far better than I would. Iggly - we don't always have a sweet treat either. Often its yoghurt or fruit if she asks for it but its only when we have cake for some reason we have it (birthdays/ fancied making one for some reason). It has helped.

I am glad I'm not the only one with my view... even if I am in a minority! I don't think I'd ever think of "teaching my 2 year old a lesson" with food but that just shows we all come from different parenting approaches.