To get really angry about gender stereotyping?

[exBrightonBell]

I'm 15 weeks pregnant and am now in the process of letting everyone know that I am expecting. AIBU to get really cross when people ask "are you going to find out the gender" and then immediately say things like - how will you know what colour to decorate the nursery, or, how will you know what colour clothes to buy? Why does the gender of my baby affect what colour choices I make? Why should we all be forced to conform to the inane stereotype of blue for boys and pink for girls?!

Loving the sister who was outraged at the baby boy wearing a cardigan with ducks on! Have ducks been sent to the female side then? Gosh, it's so complicated.

I think all this you are over thinking/reacting stuff is rubbish.

The gender stereotyping starts so early and it is damaging. It really is... clearly whatever the gender of the OP's baby it will be lucky to have a mum like her. At least she is aware of what she has to fight against, the sea of pink, the violent toys, the prejudices.

I am making my son a kitchen and you wouldn't believe the 'that's a bit gay' comments I have had. Apparently men don't go into kitchens!

It gets a lot worse when they get older!

For the moment, ignore it - they are most likely making polite interested-in-your-pregnancy small talk :)

I do agree fanjo (just think in this case it's more about making conversation IYSWIM)

Tell you what is weird though, my 2yo took a toy buggy out through town the other week with me, it's bright pink. I saw NO dodgy looks at all throughout 4 bus rides etc - lots of adoring grannies though.

And yet when DH takes DS out with same buggy, he gets lots of weird looks... WTF?

I am making my son a kitchen
Oh no! Do you want his every other word to be f* ? I mean, have you heard these chefs?

YANBU, it gets worse. At this stage they are just making pregnancy small-talk.

FWIW I think the whole 'decorate the nursery' and buying outfits for babies (as opposed to plain sleepsuits) thing is a con.

I did find out my kids sex though when I was pregnant. Just one less surprise.

Can you not just reply "we are decorating the nursery in ender neutral colours?"

Well no, of course you carn't, your pregnant, this is the first in a long list that will annoy you, use this as practice, to learn how to ignore other people.

Fwiw i don't see why this always has to turn into an attack on pink. I was delighted that my last DD suited pink (and purple). I never expected her to be more feminine than my other DD's, i just liked the colour (and wear pink myself). Dressing a baby in a certain colour isn't gender stereotyping.

I agree birdsgottafly, the problem comes when people think you can't possibly dress a child in a certain colour because it's "wrong." Usually people are against boys being dressed pink or playing with "girls" toys, because it's not right for a boy to be seen doing embarrassing things like behaving in a similar way to an inferior being, ie a girl.

You might like the book 'There's a good girl - Gender stereotyping in the first three years of life: A Diary' by Marianne Grabrucker.

Interesting reading (well, I thought so!)

FWIW I think the whole 'decorate the nursery' and buying outfits for babies (as opposed to plain sleepsuits) thing is a con

well yes. The room is a 'nursery' for very short period of time during which the baby really won't give a monkeys about much except mummy and the odd mobile. Decorate neutrally, put up posters/stickers which can adapt as the child's tastes develop and mature.

Little babies need clothes that are comfortable and washable and ..er.. thats it really.

If you read it and think it's all crap, it's still handy to have to throw at people who annoy you

do people really worry about rubbish like this.

Just reply,

I'll probably do what people did for thousands of years before gender scans were availible!

Birds - nowt wrong with pink/purple per se. My DD won't wear pale pinks for love nor money now, but we still manage an entire fuschia pink/purple/red wash between us fortnightly. What is wrong is the notion that a baby's gender should have any bearing upon your interior design or clothing preferences.

I do sevenfold. Go into any shop and see the marvellous array of pink and blue clothes for babies with very little in between.

Then go and find a toy thats pink and I'll bet you'll find a nice ironing board and kitchen set.

Isn't it good that you can brainwash your girl from an early age that pink is for girls and so the shit begins...

We have cultural clothing preferences, though.

I agree that there should be no gender toys. I oversee a PALS session amongst others.

How you conduct your household/life and the whole 'wifework' set up will be a bigger influence, though.

I just get annoyed that people who dress their DD's in pink are accussed of wanting a 'pretty princess' who rely on men to provide them with an income, or dressing them in pink will disempower them.

YANBU to get annoyed but getting annoyed is only going to harm your own peace of mind and not get anything done - I think the thing to do is to work out your replies in advance and be prepared for the next time you are met with assumptions.

I still really struggle with this. The pink and the blue is the least of it really. It's the assumptions about what children 'can' and 'can't' do and 'will' and 'won't' like that really gets to me.

I can't remember where I could find the reference now but I remember reading about a study where adults were shown the same babies (of both sexes) either dressed 'as boys' or 'as girls'. The language used to describe the SAME babies was completely different. And the kind of activities and amount of risk the babies were encouraged to do/take was completely different.

It's really hard to know even how much you're seeing your own child just as their individual person, and how much you're projecting onto them ideas borne of gender stereotyping.

I think the only thing to do is to educate yourself and challenge other people's assumptions whenever you are quick enough to do so, so that they might start to think differently too.

It does actually make me "really angry" although I am someone who doesn't vent this internal anger on others. I responded with the question "why does the gender make a difference to what colour I choose for ..." and was met with initial confusion, and then the inevitable argument that these things are unavoidable. Like it or not I will end up with a girl in pink playing with kitchen and cleaning toys, or a boy in blue bashing blocks together.

The reason it makes me really angry is the thought that the majority of society is warped in this way, and that I will be facing a constant struggle to stop my child from becoming restricted by society. The idea that my child might be put off a career or hobby, or that they might suffer abuse for being "gay" or a "tomboy" is horrible and depressing. I am also really disappointed that this is the reality for so many people - and disappointed for all the children who have had their horizons narrowed by this attitude. But, maybe I'm being unreasonable...

at Grimma.

sorry - xposts.

You really aren't being unreasonable and I think your baby will at least have a good start with you as a mum

It's like the whole world is conspiring to make your pregnancy a living nightmare.

I'm spitting mad on your behalf.

My DS at age 3 asked for a pink tutu for his birthday, which he duly got, and which for weeks he wore on top of his clothes when out and about. The amount of comments I got from random strangers about the 'inappropriateness' of what he was wearing was astounding, including an elderly gentleman who asked me if 'she' liked dancing, and when it was pointed out (politely) that DS was a he. Said 'What? What do you mean it's (yes 'it's') a boy. Are you sure?'

DS has always asked to wear pink since he was tiny, and at his request goes to ballet which he loves. I regularly have to fend off comments about this, many in outraged tones clearly within earshot of DS. He is now 4, and I'm dreading the day he feels he has to stop because 'boys don't do ballet', or some other rubbish he hears, because he absolutely loves it and I would hate for that to be spoiled for him.

IMO YANBU, but I would not waste time getting angry, there are too many out there who worry about it. Just say you don't want to do the pink/blue thing and leave it at that. Congratulations, and enjoy your LO when they arrive!

exBB - YANBU, and it isn't inevitable. So long as most of the choices you make are what you want, and when old enough what your DC wants, the odd bit of gendered crap given to DCs isn't going to matter too much.

For instance, my DD has been given much sparkly fake jewellery over the years. She has very rarely chosen to wear any of it (though she could have if she wished) - but was always happy to add it to her 'pirate treasure chest'.

BrightonBelle, next time you come up against a block, point out that until fairly recent history, it was pale blue for a girl (a soft, gentle, sky colour) and vivid pink or pale red for boys (blood and masculinity and GRR).

It got swapped at some point (probably those damn Victorians) but was certainly the case in Henry VIII's time.

I do think it's harder for boys, in that being a tomboy is ok for girls but being girlie is considered awful for boys. But they do also stereotype themselves - DD is the granddaughter of farmers and has been in tractors and herding sheep since she was 3 months old and she markedly prefers the 'tiny baby lambs' to the tractors and combine harvester, and has started to refuse to wear jeans, much to my exasperation (she is 2 and not under any other influences).

permanently - if anyone gives you grief you should hand out flyers for Billy Elliot

IMO this gender stereotyping of DCs has got a lot worse in the past few years.