to think that it's not for the nhs to pick up the bill to remove potentially faulty breast implants?

[wannaBe]

There are calls today for women who have had the faulty French breast implants to have them removed on the NHS. Apparently 40000 women have these implants, and to remove all of them would cost the NHS £150 million.

Now, if a woman has had these implants as part of reconstructive surgery following mastectomy then I agree that she should be able to have them removed. But other than that, if you choose to buy yourself bigger breasts (and let's be honest, leaking implants are not a new thing), then it isn't the nhs's responsibility to pick up the tab if there might be a problem.

If your life is in immediate danger then you would obviously need to have surgery on the NHS, but just on the off-chance? I think the company responsible should be the ones picking up the bill and don't see why the taxpayer should shoulder the responsibility for other peoples' vanity.

bebybebe,
I think the science actually says the chemical in them is potentially carcenegenic, which is why France is having them removed. However in the UK the drug safety watchdog MHRA is saying they have no evidence that cancer is occurring. However the MHRA bases its data only on cases reported to it, and as the doctors involved have no legal obligation to report to them the data is not going to be unbias, since a doctor that is made aware a patient with these implants has developed cancer is doing nothing illegal if they refuse to inform the MHRA

It has always been the case that 'complications' in the private sector are left to the NHS to sort out. At the first sign of urgent medical issues patients transfer from the private hospital to the local NHS.
This silicone implant fiasco is a scandal & it shows what will happen if the Health & Social Care Bill is passed.
The Health & Social Care Bill will give private companies a much bigger role in healthcare - they will only release information selectively as they will need to preserve their profits and reputation.

i dont think breast enlargement should be done on the nhs its all for vanitys sake i only think its ok if its reconstructive surgery, for cancer or you have very large breasts and its causing your spine to curve. people abuse the nhs far too much.

The implants were faulty.

The women are at risk.

The NHS should serve EVERYONE whether their suffering/illness/risk is self inflicted or not, it should be for all without predudice. Its a National Health Service, not a Sensible People Only Health Service.

Once the women have had the faulty implants removed, the NHS should then chase those responsible, all involved to recoup as much of the cost as possible. The 'victims' (because that is what they are, vain bitches or not) should also be able to persue compensation.

Not sure who should be sued, and I doubt the NHS or the women will recoup many costs at all if any, but that is the right course in my opinion.

Of course the NHS should help these women.

kelly2000 the MHRA have tested the filler in PIP implants and said it is not carcinogenic or toxic.

I think the NHS should remove the faulty ones.

But they are not obliged to put in new ones IYSWIM.

The thing is I don't think people realise that we are going to be in this situation much more often when the NHS is privatised, as it will be once the Health & Social Care Bill becomes law. I work in the NHS I can see very clearly what will happen - more people use private hospitals for care, they botch it up - and we won't even KNOW they've botched it until something catastrophic happens.

Quite agree with you in principle.

But I suspect there will be no choice. If women start to suffer major health problems as a result. I just wish there was a way of getting the money back from them or from the companies that caused the problem in the first place.

Incidently the MHRA advised in 2010 that these implants not be used yet this recomendation was not made law and appears to have been ignored. Now the MHRA are saying they have not had reports of cancer (despite the fact there is no legal obligation to report side effects to the MHRA or any agency in the UK) and are saying there is no need to have them removed the government and doctors are listening. However they have still not approved the use of PIP implants.
At the end of the day if someone is ill or at risk of illness then the NHS should treat them, there should not be a right to refuse women treatment if they became ill as a result of cosmetic procedures. I am quite certain if those saying these women should be barred from help would not feel the same way if they expereinced an allergic reaction from their hair dye, make up, face mask, or broke their ankle in high heels. Do we really think that those slagging off these women never do anything that could affect their health.

"there should not be a right to refuse women treatment if they became ill as a result of cosmetic procedures"

iirc not ONE post here suggests people should be refused treatment if they develop health complications due to any factors, including faulty breast implants

some suggest that the removal of faulty implants should not be financed by the state as a matter of routine and without any evidence to them affecting the health and i agree with this approach

That isn't the argument though kelly.

There is a suggestion that the NHS fund the wholesale removal of these implants, even where there is no rupture and no evidence of illness.

In an ideal world, yes, that should happen. If the funds were endless I'd have no issue replacing the implants on the NHS, I don't hate these women or wish to punish them for their choices. Where rupture has occured and treatment is needed, I say treat on the NHS.

But I do not support the call for a wholesale removal at an estimated cost of £150 million when existing cancer patients are denied the same peace of mind for no other reason than lack of funds.

But I suspect there will be no choice. If women start to suffer major health problems as a result. I just wish there was a way of getting the money back from them or from the companies that caused the problem in the first place.

What Ormirian said.

Yet another unregulated industry seems to be a scam. Odd that.....

Midori,
Boobs must be an important part of your life if you want them enlarged.
Following a mastectomy I can understand - but just because you want bigger boobs ? Its surgery for goodness sake !

Important in the sense they can feed my baby? yes. Important in the sense they impact on my every day life? No.

I did notice it was surgery at the time. In my case (then) the surgery was consider minor and very low risk, so I decided it was something I wanted to do.

If they can afford to have them done in the first place, then they can afford to have them taken out if they are that worried...surely their health is more important than their vanity

Agree with LittleMoosh completely.

Funny how folk manage to find the thousands to pay for them in the first place but can't find the money to have them taken out when their health is at risk.

If the NHS had a huge budget to cover everything then fair enough. It doesn't. Treat the people who had their original operations on the NHS.

Everyone else should go back to the clinic that treated them. If they won't treat for free then they should foot the bill themselves.

kelly - I agree - if the breast implants are faulty they should be removed - no question - and women's health needs protecting whether the breast impants were cosmetic or for medical reasons.
Taxpayers fund the NHS. PIP are a private company and are no longer trading so they cannot be chased for the money. The public now have to pick up the bill because PIP were profit-chasing and cut standards (ring any bells anyone? banks? hmmm)
The government is busy privatising the NHS. This type of story will be commonplace in a few years time if the changes go ahead and (the juicy, profitable and easy bits of) our healthcare is handed to lightly regulated private contractors.

Midori
I thought people wanted enlargements because it did impact on their every day life. I didn't know it was just an impulsive whim ?

I hope that all the fears surrounding the danger of these implants prove to be minimal. It would scare me to death if I was in that position.

littlemoosh & molschamber - I don't agree with you - its not like getting work done on your car. The NHS will always pick up the tab - that's what its there for - its free at the point of use.
What gets me is that this government (and Labour before them) are making it easier for private sector cowboys to make a quick profit out of our health and then disappear

The Government needs to take a look and see how many millions they are wasting to patch up people being given faulty drugs, implants and treatments.

The private sector cowboys will be doing a lot more of this in the future. The free NHS, combined with our adversarial legal system, means the UK will become a kind of pharmaceutical testing ground - if it hasn't already.

A private NHS will mean that pharmas will have an additional 'edge' to push people into accepting the treatments they want them to, rather than the treatment that is the best.

Sorry for the rant, but why don't the NHS have the balls to sue any of these incompetents that cost them so much?

Davsmum, like you said, you don't understand why women have breast enlargement surgery. I doubt anyone has surgery on an 'impulsive whim', but even if they did, surely that's their business if they are paying for it?

To be fair, it does seem that a lot of women are panicked by the typical media scaremongering and therefore want their implants out as a preventative measure. Most of these want the companies/surgeons to be liable for the costs of replacement, since the companies/surgeons marketed these implants as 'top of the range' and although I doubt they had any idea what was filling these implants, they did know they were considerably cheaper than other implants (something not divulged to patients) and yet still marketed them as 'top of the range'. I do think implanting surgeons and private companies need to accept some responsibility and that includes at least removal of implants if women want that, regardless of rupture.

i agree greenishmum and littleben and is really worth checking out this article in the guardian today - there's going to be many more of these sorts of problems once Cameron and Lansley's plans go through..

here's the link - www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jan/05/silicone-implants-blunder-private-healthcare

And what about the people who have had the surgery done for other reasons...breast cancer etc..Its not just vain bitches you narrow minded stupid woman

I wonder if there is any basis for a massive action (private/NHS) against France, which completely failed to regulate the producer. Also, if France decided there is enough moral and medical reason to offer replacement implants to the french citizens' (or whatever is the criteria), why this offer should not be extended to other patients of EU member states. After all they (other EU member states) national regulators had no jurisdiction over that particular manufacturer.

I also do not agree that this is private health providers vs NHS. Everyone was caught up in this mess and the more I look into it the more it seems that ultimately it is France's responsibility to put it right.