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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To hold on to my council house?

237 replies

Memoo · 17/12/2011 11:56

10 years ago I fled a very abusive marriage. DD was 2yo and ds was 3 months old. I lost my home, my savings and all dc's clothes and toys. Basically dc and I were left with nothing.

After being homeless for 3 months I was given a council house and I slowly built up a good life for the dc and I. I went to college and got a job. I supported myself and my children and I was really proud of that. Not being dependant on anyone was the best feeling I've ever had.

6 years ago I met my now 2nd DH. He moved into my house and although things have been tough at times we have got through it. I've also had another baby and dd is now 2.

The problem is we live in a really crap area. Crap schools, anti-social behaviour, drug dealer a few doors down, you get the picture.

DH is adement that we should give up this house and try and rent privately in a better area. I hate the idea of this. The way things are at the moment I know whatever happens with dh and I, this is my house and no man can take that from me. It gives me a sense of security knowing the dc and I have a home for life. If we rented privately I would once again become dependent on somebody else and the thought of that scares the crap out of me.

OP posts:
Kellogg · 18/12/2011 19:14

We looked at a scheme for part buying, we were really pushed into it, not least because we were at the top of the threshold so we only had a few months to complete.

However the houses were all overpriced tiny new builds. Not a good deal at all. We could get something nicer and bigger for about 100K less.

Kellogg · 18/12/2011 19:17

Mrsscoob I think you are wrong, just because you are from a council estate it does not mean you are devoid of any ambition. As I said you may need time to gather together the money but if you earned enough you probably would want to move on.

ThisIsNotMyLife · 18/12/2011 19:18

Patronising or practical?

The market rent for my home is double what I pay for it. If when I took this job I'd known I would be evicted from my home, I would not have even applied for it.

NinkyNonker · 18/12/2011 19:18

The couple who are (fingers crossed, touch wood) are moving out of a shared ownership scheme, they own 40% which they are selling, and the HA (I think) own the remaining 60% and kind of administrate half of the sale. Apparently there has been loads of interest as housing in our area is really extortionate so it is seen as a good way to get on the ladder.

MrsOzz · 18/12/2011 19:21

Of course you wouldn't. You'd have taken all the benefits you could instead. Because you're entitled too. And why work if you can have everything for free/cheaper.

Sense of entitlement exactly.

Obviously this attitude is not held by everyone in council housing!

MrsOzz · 18/12/2011 19:22

I should add, if you can afford to pay the private rent of your house. Then you are exactly the type of tennant that is wasting a valuable home in time of a shortage.

Kellogg · 18/12/2011 19:23

Perhaps they threshold needs to be set quite high, possibly at a household income of about 60K, which is the cut off for right to buy scheme.

If I had been given a council house ten years ago as a single mum to ill to work and with no income other than benefits would it be right if I was still in that house with a household income of about 70K?

kirrinIsland · 18/12/2011 19:24

kellog I don't think it is patronizing to suggest that - if you like where you live, you're on good terms with the neighbours, the kids like their school and have lots of friends just down the road etc etc then why would you want to move? Surely, you would consider that when deciding on a career move / job offer that would effectively force you to move because you'd have to give your house up? It's not necessarily to do with lack of ambition.

ThisIsNotMyLife · 18/12/2011 19:25

Would you take a job that would immediately make you poorer (by paying a market rent) and force you to uproot your family? Really?

Kellogg · 18/12/2011 19:26

Absolute nonsense Mrsozz, I was on benefits and gradually went back to work until I worked full time. At one point I worked at a loss as I was desperate to pay back the money I had taken from the state and support myself.

My dp was also on benefits for a period and had the same attitude, as did my Mother.

ThisIsNotMyLife · 18/12/2011 19:26

And do we really want to create ghettos of the poor? Even more so than we already have?

Kellogg · 18/12/2011 19:28

I think lots of people move because of work. Myself and dp have had to do just that to get on in our careers. I am not talking about even turfing people out who earn average wages or even slightly above average.

ThisIsNotMyLife · 18/12/2011 19:29

Of course they do. However they choose to move, they are not forced.

Kellogg · 18/12/2011 19:29

No I don't want to create ghettos of the poor, I have made a point of saying that, one of the reason I said there should be a threshold of about 60K.

Ideally we would have very mixed estates but the sale of council houses means that we have a shortage of houses and therefore we cannot be idealistic.

mrsscoob · 18/12/2011 19:29

Kellogg, I am not suggesting for one minute that people from council estates lack ambition. I am just thinking that practically it would be very difficult for people to just move out of their homes due to the reasons I mentioned before. Its not like there are loads of well paid jobs out there at the moment either. So for someone who isn't working, what would be the incentive to go out get a job or retrain if they knew at the end of their hard work they would lose their home?

Mrs Ozz if you are implying that I have a sense of entitlement due to what I posted I think that is quite rude! I was only making a suggestion Confused

Kellogg · 18/12/2011 19:31

And I also said I was uncomfortable with forcing people to move, if we could incentivise them that would be a better option.

ThisIsNotMyLife · 18/12/2011 19:31

(I think the entitlement thing was aimed at me - as I have a council flat AND a job. Most of the people in our building have jobs too. Shock

Kellogg · 18/12/2011 19:32

I think we are agreeing mrscoob. I am not talking about peopel going straight from being on a low wage in a council house to then earning an average wage and being turfed out.

SebastionTheCrab · 18/12/2011 19:35

Oh, the point somebody made about in theory you could be a millionaire and get a council house- bull. There is a limit to your income as to whether you can apply for HA housing where I live and I imagine most places.

MrsOzz · 18/12/2011 19:37

I made that point Sebastion. Because I also thought it was bull. It followed a comment another poster has said thy council housing isn't dependent on income/employment.

MrsOzz · 18/12/2011 19:38

*that getting council housing isn't dependent on income!

ThisIsNotMyLife · 18/12/2011 19:38

It's not dependent on income here - seriously it isn't.

squeakytoy · 18/12/2011 19:40

So for someone who isn't working, what would be the incentive to go out get a job or retrain if they knew at the end of their hard work they would lose their home

I suppose ideally, it would be that they save some of the earnings that they have, and use those savings to put down as a deposit on a house, but in the current economic climate that is virtually impossible to do.

I CAN see both sides of this argument. When people are working and paying a mortgage need repairs to their house, they have to foot the bill, yet people who are in council property and earning the same amount of money get essential repairs done for free. I dont agree with that, and think that is something which should be looked into.

SebastionTheCrab · 18/12/2011 19:44

When I put my name on the list I had to state my income. When I was offered my home the housing association wanted to see my DHs previous 5 wage slips as proof my income was what we stated. They said there is a limit although I don't know what that limit is. Maybe not all councils/ H/As are the same.

ThisIsNotMyLife · 18/12/2011 19:46

Here's the allocations policy of a randomly selected council:

Who can apply?

Any UK resident aged 16 or over may apply to join the register. People will not be accepted if they are subject to certain types of immigration control or they fail the legal test of acceptable behaviour.

Unacceptable behaviour could be:

a high level of debt owed to landlords, with no repayments being made
serious anti-social behaviour
certain unspent convictions

Applicants aged 16 and 17 (and care leavers) will only be accepted if they have support to enable them to sustain a tenancy and a trustee who can hold a tenancy on their behalf until they reach the age of 18.
How do we assess housing need?

Under the Housing Act 1996 (as amended by the Homelessness Act 2002) local authorities have to ensure, that when allocating housing, reasonable preference is given to the following groups:

people who are homeless
people occupying unsanitary or overcrowded housing or else living in unsatisfactory housing conditions
people who need to move on medical or welfare grounds (including grounds relating to a disability)
people who need to move to a particular locality in the district of the housing authority, where failure to meet that need would cause hardship (to themselves or to others)

How will we prioritise applications?

Applicants are placed in one of 4 bands according to their circumstances. These are:

emergency
gold
silver
bronze

A summary of these bands is shown below.

Full details of the North Yorkshire Housing Allocation Policy can be found on the right of this page or go to North Yorkshire HomeChoice for more information.
Emergency band

This band is intended to meet the needs of applicants in extreme circumstances only. It will only contain a small number of applicants at any one time and is subject to a time limit.

unable to return to their home from hospital because their current home is permanently unsuitable
unable to access key facilities in their home without major adaptation works

Only applicants with a local connection to the partnership area will be considered for the emergency band.
Gold band

care leavers, with an agreed support package
applicants who need to move on from an approved accommodation based supported housing scheme
under-occupiers of a local authority or housing association property in the partnership area who want to move to a property with at least two fewer bedrooms
applicants who are statutory homeless or at risk of homelessness and in priority need
applicants who are overcrowded and require 2 or more bedrooms
applicants who are classified as a good neighbour
applicants with a serious and enduring illness whose health and/or wellbeing is significantly compromised by their home or environment
applicants who need to move to relieve a proven hardship

Silver band

applicants who have a health or well-being issue, which will be removed or improved by moving
applicants who are statutory homeless or at risk of homelessness but with no priority need or are intentionally homeless
applicants who are overcrowded and require 1 more bedroom
applicants whose home lacks basic amenities or have to share facilities with other households
under-occupiers of a local authority or housing association property in the partnership area who want to move to property with one less bedroom

Bronze band

all other applicants

How do we decide who is successful?

At the end of the advertising period a short-list of eligible applicants who have bid (expressed an interest) for a property will be produced.

Bids will be placed in band order as this is a measure of housing need. Applicants in Emergency band will be ranked first, followed by those in Gold, Silver and Bronze bands.

There are five tie-breakers in total used to help determine priority between bids. They are

banding
local connection
occupation (number of bedrooms required)
debt
time

The tie-breakers are only used as necessary.

For example, if only two applicants bid for a property, one in Gold band and one in Silver then the offer goes to the higher Gold applicant. If both applicants are in Gold band then the process moves to the next tie-breaker, which is local connection, and so on.

Full details of how we shortlist can be found in the North Yorkshire Housing Allocation Policy on the right of this page or go to North Yorkshire Home Choice for more information.