AIBU or was i re grandparents

[rootietootie]

Ok, bit of a long story, please stick with me, will try not to drip feed :) When i found out i was pregnant dc's father made it clear he was not interested (and has never paid a penny to dc) and moved to another country, coming home to visit his parents a couple of times a year, which i accepted. Once Dc was born, dc's fathers mother (dc's grandmother) said she wanted to play a part in dc's life and i was more than happy. She was a bit pfgc at times and not in a cute way (at one point she "offered" to raise dc for me, which was refused, she tried to convince me to change dc's surname to her married name (which was refused) and a few other questionables, but i trudged on because she genuinely did love dc). When dc was four i met someone who i am now engaged to and my dc (now 11) considers and calls dad. However when dp first moved in he made clear his disapproval of dc being around his biological father for the brief times he came home to visit. (Dp believed that if he could not so much as do the decent thing and at least contribute to dc's upbringing, he did not deserve the joy of seeing what a wonderful human being dc is). It did not really bother me, but it meant a lot to dp, and i asked dc grandparent and she was v. unhappy with not getting dc for the 2 occasions her son was home. I decided to respect dp's wishes and it resulted in grandmother cutting dc out of her life full stop. Cue 5 years later, she decides she would like to see him again, so i arrange for a get together for her and dc and this goes well. Dc sees her at her work (he can drop in and see her) and all goes fine for a few months. Dc then asks if he can visit her house and grandmother then drops bombshell that she thinks this is "too" much, dc is not welcome at her house and now just wants to give birthday/xmas presents and wait until dc is 16 when he can make up his own mind? Dc was v. upset at this and has not contacted grandmother since. Was i unreasonable in complying with dp's wishes initially and opening this can of worms? If grandmother sends gifts would i be unreasonable to send them back on the basis that if dc is not good enough to be welcomed at her house, then she has got a cheek sending gifts? Also in the last month dc's biofather expressed an interest in starting a relationship with dc, but dc made it crystal clear he did not wish this. I could have perhaps tried harder to convince dc to at least hear his bio father out, but tbh i just dont feel that way inclined. Is that also an unreasonable way to feel?

Just my opinion, but I do think you were being unreasonable bending to what your DP wanted, it's punishing your lad by not letting him have even a small relationship with his dad just because his dad is shit at contact.

I feel really sorry for your exs mum as well, her relationship with her GS is up to how sensisitve your DP was feeling at the time.

That must have cut to the bone.

You can't blame her trying to protect herself a bit from being hurt if she gets close to your DS.

Sending gifts isn't cheeky, it's being nice isn't it?

Could your DS be saying he doesn't want to see his dad because it's been made clear (either implicitly or explicitly) that it wouldn't go down well with you or your DP? He sounds totally stuck in the middle to me.

I think you should probably allow your DS to decide for himself. Pass on the gifts. You don't want to be accused of being obstructive.

Every situation is different, but from what you posted, I think your dp and yourself were wrong in stopping your ds from seeing his bio father. It is nothing to do with the bio dad "deserving" to see the boy, but the boys right to at least know his bio father.
I would try and start over, and allow the boy to see his father. Although your dp is raising him, that doesn't mean he had the right to dictate the boy seeing his bf and bgm.

I think YWBU to agree to DP in the first place as your DP is not the referee of relationships. However, what's done is done. You all sound like you are trying to make a point rather than really thinking about what's best. You want to send the presents back, DP wants to stop ex seeing DC. DGM won't see DC under these circumstances.

You all need to start thinking about what's right instead of how you can get prickly and snotty with each other.

The unreasonableness started with your DP. Prior to him being on the scene, it seems as if you and the grandparents had come to a working arrangement and relationship. It could never be a cozy relationship but it was working along.

I am not sure if you encouraged contact with the grandparents even if no contact with biological father. You didn't say.

I think the grandparents then became unreasonable afterwards. They could have still maintained contact, if you had allowed it, instead of cutting him off.

In this new development, I wondered if something happened to cause this about-face. If things were moving smoothly for several months, what caused it to change. I don't think its just the visiting of her home. Something else have to have occurred.

With your son's biological father -- I think the best thing to do is let your son decide but keep the channel open. Someday, he might want to contact him.

I think you were wrong to give in to your new dp in the first place and that decision has put you in this position, as well as deprived your dc of the love his gm had for him, and also prevented him from developing any sort of relationship with his dad.

Having said that, gm was unreasonable and spiteful to cut him out, and again in what she is doing now.

TBH, I think you need to apologise to her and see what you can do to mend this. You have now got a very upset dc and also an upset and angry gm on your hands, and all because your dp decided that you should do what he wants with regard to your child.

Is your dp this unreasonable about anything else? how does he behave generally?

Yep, totally unreasonable to let your new partner dictate your sons relationship with his father. What were you thinking??

As for now, I think the very least you can do is be as unobstructive as possible and allow your son to try and rebuild a relationship with his grandmother and his father's side of the family. Like it or not he is entitled to a relationship with them that is not your business to control. It would be aggressive and antagonistic of you to send presents back. The very least you owe your son is to step back and stop interfering.

He has never had a relationship with his biodad. On the twice yearly visits that he and dc were in the house, my dc was ignored by him with no interaction, (it was usually xmas and biofather would usually be drinking or hungover.) Its not that biodad was shit with contact, he denied parentage until I eventually got a dna test (he was an arse and knew fine well dc was his!) and deliberately left the country so that he could avoid paying csa. I was stuck in the middle between gp and dp. We did offer compromise, that she could have dc as long as biofather was not present (e.g he could go down to the pub or visit friends while dc was visiting) or she could come to our house. I need to stress that this only applied for 2 days out of the year, and all the rest of the time she had pretty much unrestricted access to ds. I do feel bad, for grandmother and my dc, but i never asked her to cut off complete contact. When i asked Ds if he wished to see his biofather, he went so far as to call him a useless arsehole (dc is 11 going on 16, not an excuse for swearing but he felt strongly on the subject) and made it clear he did not want any contact. I have an amicable relationship with Dc's biodad on the very rare occasions i see him and dc knows this. When grandmother recently reestablished contact, me and dp made it clear to dc that it was up to him, as he was older and able to make his own decisions regarding this. Bio father also lives back in the uk with mother and we let ds know that he had our approval if he wanted to go visit his grandmother at home, which he did want to.

also i have to mention that dp has since legally adopted dc so in all respects, afaic, does have some entitlement to opinion on dc's upbringing.

Did you let grandmother know that you and your DP have rescinded the standing order of no contact with biological dad since he does live with her and that was the reason for the stoppage in contact 5 years ago?

Yes, she knew that. When she first started seeing ds again it was just us meeting up at park etc and she said she hoped that in time dc would be able to come to her house. I told her we were happy with that and so was pretty surprised when after a while my ds asked to visit her at her house, she was abrupt with me and said he was not welcome there.

Well, I would want to talk with the grandmother and see what this " is "too" much" talk was all about?
Maybe there is something else going on at home, that is over whelming her. You said your ex is living there, perhaps he is the problem? Whatever it is, you should find out so you can at least explain something that makes sense to your son.

I wonder if she thinks you and your DP, not your son, are the ones preventing him from seeing his biological dad. She might have encouraged him to seek some type of relationship and was turned down. He might have told her it was you/DP that stopped it from starting.

If he told her that, its not a stretch for her to believe that is the truth since there is form.

Do you think she could be protecting your ds by not allowing contact with his father? Or it could be your ex who is stopping him coming over to visit his gm.

I would try again to initiate contact - could she come over to you or could you regularly meet up for a meal?

I dont know if I could call her again. She was explicitly clear in regards to her wishes to the point of being, i felt, rather rude to me. I asked her what explanation I should give to ds as to why he was not getting to visit her at her home, and she couldn't answer me, just that she felt that he wasn't her little boy anymore, they would not have anything to talk about and as he was older there would not be anything for him to do. So when i went home i told ds what she had said, afaic he was old enough to hear her explanation and tbh i would not want to lie to him, or know what lie to tell him. Of course, at this point he was absolutely inconsolable. It was since then ds stopped visiting grandmother at her work (i have not stopped him, he went to see her on his own, when he was passing). I dont understand Hugh when you say that my dc's relationship with his gm is not mine to control. I never stopped contact between them, it was gm, on both accounts. Neither do i feel inclined to force a relationship between them.

I would recommend talking to her once again and re-iterating that you and your DP have no problems with your son having contact with either her or the biological dad or going to her house.

Past mistakes/errors in judgements by you and her have not served in the best interest of your son. You do want him to have a relationship with the grandmother and will not stand in the way. She can choose what type of contact/relationship she wants. If she only wants to do only presents on Christmas and birthdays, then that's fine. You will pass those on to him. If she wants no contact, that's fine. Her choice. But you want to make it clear that its not you or your DP that's obstructing the relationship. It would be her and she will be missing out on a knowing a great grandchild.

I dont know, when i mentioned to her that her son has suggested getting to know dc, she scoffed at the idea and blamed it entirely on him being drunk ( he was not drunk when i spoke to him, although we did meet in the pub and he had been drinking) and basically in the cold light of day her son would probably not want any contact, and since dc did not want contact with him, i have not pushed the subject.

Can I also just say that before i was with dp, i worked to make sure that dc never went without, and my ds know this, and is fully aware that his biofather has never contributed. My dp treats my ds as though his own, so much as to adopt him and not only makes sure that dc is not without, to the extent that he probably spoils ds a lot little. Ds is 11, and knows the circumstances in which his bio father left and I will freely admit I am not too much bothered that ds does not want contact with his biodad, as given the facts, I can't blame him. I will probably give him any gifts from his gm, and let him decide what he does with them.

Reading your post at 4:8:55, I think maybe those 5 years are too difficult to bridge. What they once had was gone and its hard to get it back. Maybe the best relationship your son and his grandmother can have now is the sending of presents.

What is done is done. I really do feel for your son as his best interests were not served by the adults in his life a long time ago.

Good luck and hoping the best for you son.

Thanks mynewpassion for your views. I was put in a difficult position when my son was younger, although i would say with hindsight, i did what I thought was best at the time and has worked out best for my son. At the unnecessary expense of his relationship with his gm (which I do regret)he now has a solid and loving relationship with his adopted father, and a very close relationship with dp's extended family. I wish my dp had not felt the way he did initially about my ex. and I equally wish that the gm would have allowed a little leeway without feeling the need to cut dc out of her life completely. With regards to my ex, I don't there was any hope of him coming round to the idea of my dc, although I am eternally grateful to him for giving me my dc :o

No one said being a parent was easy. You have to make these tough decisions and hope that it was the right one. Hindsight is 20/20.

Its good to know that he has other supportive grandparents who love him very much.

I do think it was the wrong way to go about it to begin with but what anyone thinks about that doesn't really matter now.

If you son wants contact then yes try again. It could just be that now she realises how old he is that she doesn't know what to do/how to talk to him as they did miss out on those 5 years. Maybe ds could invite her to do something with him? Try and find something the two of them can do together.

If she can't think of what she could possibly have in common or what she could do with an 11 yr old boy, no wonder her own son turned out to be such an arse!

Reflect a little on how you would feel as the paternal grandparents being told after several years they were no longer allowed contact.

Human beings can be so nasty to others and when you are on the receiving end of it, it is incredibly difficult to pull oneself up from it. I would guess you caused enormous hurt to your son's grandparents and as a consequence to your son too.

I don't think you should have allowed your DP to dictate your sons relationship with anyone but surely your sons dad knows that by signing over his rights which is what he would have to have done for your DP to adopt him that he has little ground to stand on regarding visiting/getting to know him.
I think your sons grandmother was a little off to completely cut access but we don't know the circumstances of what was happening and yes now a lot changes in five years and she probably doesn't want to get hurt again and I think you should offer that as an explanation to your son.