Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Protection built in.

Meet the Other Phone.
Protection built in.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think Julian Assange should grow a pair and just go to Sweden?

81 replies

AnonyMaw · 05/12/2011 17:28

I know for sure if I was accused of a crime I would want to have my opportunity to defend myself.

I think Assange should just stop weasling around, and go to Sweden now, to put his side of the story to court.

Or am I missing something?

OP posts:
Kladdkaka · 05/12/2011 20:55

If your only concern is the legal process, why on earth would you post that?
Because the legal process shouldn't be exploited to exact revenge.

Prolesworth · 05/12/2011 21:05

The US hasn't charged Assange with anything - or are you talking about Bradley Manning now curlyboy?

As for the remark about not using the legal system to exact revenge, WTF? How about using the legal system to exact justice?

MollieO · 05/12/2011 21:10

I would assume that the US govt has sounded out the UK govt to see if they would extradite him and met with a negative response. There is no point therefore filing charges against him in the US now. If they did then it would be expected that the US govt would ask the UK govt to extradite.

If the Swedish govt are viewed as more US sympathetic then, if I were the US prosecutor, why not wait until he is extradited to Sweden and then file charges to see his extradition to the US?

dancingmustard · 05/12/2011 21:10

You'll find that the Swedish prime minister has as the telegraph reports "Used toxic remarks" against Assange.
This will prevent a fair trial.
Extradition should fail until the Swedes get their house in order.

Kladdkaka · 05/12/2011 21:13

Exacting justice is right and proper. Will there be justice if he extradicted to Sweden? I wouldn't bet on it.

ShellyBoobs · 05/12/2011 21:25

I'm another one who thinks that there are plans afoot to get him to Sweden for the purpose of further extradition/rendition to the US.

I can't help but think the rape/assault allegations are a front for something else.

Of course those allegations should be taken very seriously and the investigation treated as such, but I think there's some serious smoke and mirrors involved and it's about getting him to the US.

CurlyBoy · 06/12/2011 02:08

Yes, I believe is is the Bradley Manning thing. I certainly don't know any of the reasons why it'd be easier to extradite him from Sweden than here, I just know what he's said publicly.

Crabapple99 · 06/12/2011 04:37

No idea who Julian assange is , but would be ver ygrateful if someone could explaon to me what "grow a pair" means

Whatmeworry · 06/12/2011 07:05

This has got nothing to do with rape, and everythingbto do with nobbling him.

thunderboltsandlightning · 06/12/2011 08:05

That might be true Whatmeworry, apart from the small fact of the two women who say he raped them.

I don't see why people believe the Swedes are more sympathetic to the US than the UK. We were their allies in Iraq. We enabled extraordinary rendition. We can't do enough for them.

Whatmeworry · 06/12/2011 08:30

Yeah Thunders, 2 women who were happily bonking him suddenly pop up and decide they were raped just as a lot of governments around the woorld want him. Funny that....

thunderboltsandlightning · 06/12/2011 09:51

Neither of them said they were "happily bonking" him:

"Aug. 14: The woman, identified by Swedish officials only as Miss A, returns to Stockholm, 24 hours earlier than planned. The two go out for dinner, return to the apartment and have sex during which a condom breaks. She would later tell police that Assange used his body weight to hold her down during sex and that she was a victim of "unlawful coercion.""

"Aug. 16: The second woman, identified only as Miss W by Swedish officials, calls Assange and they meet in Stockholm. They go by train to her hometown and to her apartment, where they have sex. According to her testimony to police, Assange wore a condom.
Aug. 17: Miss W later tells police that Assange that morning had unprotected sex with her while she was still asleep."

today.msnbc.msn.com/id/40551118/ns/today-today_news/t/assange-charges-center-two-women-sex/

So pins one woman down so he can penetrate her, and penetrates another whilst she's asleep.

You seem to have odd ideas about what constitutes happy bonking WMW.

He's a predator who used the hospitality of women who supported him to sexually prey on them.

lottiegb · 06/12/2011 10:01

Yes you are missing something. The primary concern is that Sweden might extradite him to the US, which might charge him in connection with leaked documents, potentially for something akin to treason, which could carry the death penalty.

Still think you'd do the decent thing and defend yourself?

We can have no idea whether, if the fear of extradition was not an issue, he would voluntarily go to Sweden to defend the sex charges.

I don't know whether the US will press charges, Sweden will extradite, what he thinks or was thinking and I don't get the impression he's someone I'd want to spend time with but I can understand why, given any possibility of the above, his legal team are doing everything possible to resist extradition to Sweden.

Whatmeworry · 06/12/2011 10:03

He's a predator who used the hospitality of women who supported him to sexually prey on them

Thunders, your ideological need to see everything as a rape problem is clouding your ability to see the bigger picture here and to be very slective in what you look at.

thunderboltsandlightning · 06/12/2011 11:02

My ideological what?

Who exactly are you WMW, that you're making comments about me like that? This isn't about me, although you're trying to make it personal and thus start a fight, this is about what Julian Assange is accused of doing to two women, and the fact that he fled Swedish justice.

As for seeing everything as a "rape problem" - thinking that the descriptions of what happened to them by two women who reported being raped sound like rape, is hardly seeing everything as a rape problem. It's just ridiculous of you to say it is. Maybe it's you who is struggling with ideology if you can read what are two descriptions of rape and pretend that they have nothing to do with what is going on here.

He could be extradited from the UK. Do people really not get that? Sweden doesn't have the special relationship with the US - we do.

Kladdkaka · 06/12/2011 11:16

He could be extradited from the UK. Do people really not get that? Sweden doesn't have the special relationship with the US - we do.

Yet only one of them has already been condemned by the United Nations Committee against Torture for their willing involvment with CIA rendition to Egypt and the subsequent torture of people within their jurisdiction. And I'll give you a clue ... it wasn't the UK.

Whatmeworry · 06/12/2011 11:17

Thunders are you really saying it hasn't occurred to you that the reason this has all come up at this particular time with both of them may have more to do with political machinations than anything else?

AnyFuckerForAMincePie · 06/12/2011 11:21

WMW has it not occurred to you that these women have come forward because they now think that people may actually take their claims seriously now ?

So many sexual crimes go unreported. we know that. Have a think about the reasons why that is, and perhaps you will see another side that has no pure political motivation at all

Ghoulwithadragontattoo · 06/12/2011 11:29

He should go to Sweden to face the rape charges. The Swedish authorities can then decide whether to agree to extradition to the USA. As they are signatories to the European Convention on Human Rights they won't extradite him if there is any chance of him facing the death penalty.

lottiegb · 06/12/2011 11:36

Just life imprisonment then? You can see why his legal team will feel compelled to seek to avoid that and why, given that he clearly believes the web leaks were acceptable, he will choose to avoid any possibility of facing serious charges for them.

This still tells us nothing about whether, if potential charges in the US were not an issue, he would voluntarily defend the charges in Sweden.

slug · 06/12/2011 11:41

Offs!! I've had enough of his "I'm a warrior for truth who is the victim of a massive conspiracy" schtick.

You do kind of wonder why a man like him, who is so sure of his personal myth is so reluctant to face his accusers in court.

Go and face the music Assange, I dare you.

Ghoulwithadragontattoo · 06/12/2011 11:55

I can obviously see why he's trying to avoid going. Doesn't mean I have to think he's right. I also think his leaks could have put many lives in danger and had an adverse impact on global diplomatic relations. There should a penalty for that sort of behaviour.

ElephantsAndMiasmas · 06/12/2011 12:01

I really don't understand this logic that the crime of choice with which to "set up" a political opponent is rape. Because everyone knows that rape is ALWAYS never seriously and NEVER ascribed to malicious allegations. Hmm

Oh no, wait, that's UTTER BOLLOCKS. It's probably the least likely crime accusation to result in a conviction, plus the only people you really get on your side are feminists. And sadly as we all know they are not running the world.

ElephantsAndMiasmas · 06/12/2011 12:02

*ALWAYS taken seriously.

Ghoulwithadragontattoo · 06/12/2011 12:06

That's a fair point Elephants although I guess the behind closed doors nature of rape means it could be relatively easy to manufacture. Plus even if charges are never brought / don't stick in court there will still be a whiff of scandal about the individual. Not saying I think it's a set up at all just musing on your point.