Please or to access all these features

Add post

Watch this thread

Save thread

Start a new thread

Flip thread

Hide thread

My feed

Active Unanswered threads

Getting started FAQ's

Unanswered threads Acronyms Talk guidelines

Hide shortcut buttons

Talk

AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Flip

1 2 ··· 33 34 35 ··· 39 40

Original poster

to say this to all the teachers who are striking next week

999 replies

Memoo · 24/11/2011 14:18

As a parent I am 100 % behind you.

I really appreciate that you put your life and soul into your job and im sorry more people don't get just how hard you work for the benefit of our children.

Don't let the bastards grind you down!

OP posts:

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 19:20

Read the report noblegiraffe tranparency had been a real issue. The 6.4% (percentage is that of wage) employee contribution of a teacher is subsidised by up to 33.6% state contribution (ie the pension is up to 80% state funded).

I reiterate that most negotiations will be based on this report the Unions do not want it publisized.

BoneyBackJefferson · 26/11/2011 19:25

organiccarrotcake

"And yes, I am furious that the school is closing and yet if I take my child out for a day I have to get permission or risk being criminalised. NOT on."

So your mad at the school for upholding a what you consider to be a bad government policy.

doesn't make much sense to shoot the messenger

BoneyBackJefferson · 26/11/2011 19:29

iggly2

"I reiterate that most negotiations will be based on this report the Unions do not want it publisized."

A report that has not been validated and is very low on figures.
its not exactly transparent.

sofadweller · 26/11/2011 19:37

No support from me. And I don't believe these strikes will achieve anything.

You cannot expect private sector workers to continue to fund final salary schemes they have no hope of ever enjoying themselves.

Only 1 in 3 private sector workers currently has any pension provision at all. And overall, wages are now lower in the private sector.

ShellyBoobs · 26/11/2011 19:38

My private sector friends say no.

Oh well in that case then, the millions whose employers couldn't afford to keep their final salary schemes and so had to transfer them into a definined contributions scheme must be mistaken. Those people include my best friend, my brother and my SIL, to name a few of those who are mistaken.

Your friends really are living in a different private sector world to the one most people are in, aren't they? Huuuge salaries and guaranteed pensions. Wow.

Do these friends actually exist?

noblegiraffe · 26/11/2011 19:44

iggly, my entire wages are state funded. 100%. The state pays for me to do a job which is to educate the next generation so that when they leave school they have the education and qualifications to meaningfully contribute towards society.

Therefore the fact that the state pays for my pension too is hardly surprising news.

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 19:51

Oh government has plans to tax the pensions of higher rate earners:
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/8543505.stm

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 19:56

Oh that £2.50 is the tax relief everyone gets when saving into a pension and as you can see they are curbing it for higher earners.

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 19:59

£770 billion-£1,176 billion shortfall in public sector pension payments. please read the report as I say most negotiations will be based on it the Unions would not publicise it.

VivaLeBeaver · 26/11/2011 20:06

Your friends really are living in a different private sector world to the one most people are in, aren't they? Huuuge salaries and guaranteed pensions. Wow.

Do these friends actually exist?

Erm, yes.

And not huge salaries either. These are people working in the call centre and admin offices for one of the big water companies. Company has shut it's final salary scheme to new comers but not changed it for existing employees. I'm not saying this is the same for the whole of the private sector but I am saying it is the case for some of the private sector. I certainly know people in the private sector with much better pensions than me. I work in the nhs and do not have a final salary scheme.

ShellyBoobs · 26/11/2011 20:12

Viva, Sorry.

I thought you were the poster who said earlier in the thread that her private sector friends earned between 3 and 10 times her public sector salary.

VivaLeBeaver · 26/11/2011 20:20

No not at all.

Dh is in private sector and earns maybe twice what I do but he is a highly skilled and specialised engineer so is in some demand from companies. Which is something else the private sector get which I can't get as a midwife. I can't get a pay rise by going for a job with a different company, etc.

FontSnob · 26/11/2011 20:21

Shellyboobs, just how many different worlds are there and what do you have to do to be in the actual real one?!?!

FontSnob · 26/11/2011 20:22

I should imagine the border agents easily earn 3 to 10 times less than a lawyer!

thetasigmamum · 26/11/2011 20:23

viva the water companies - and other ex publically owned utilities - had to agree to keep their public sector stylee pension schemes when they were sold off.

VivaLeBeaver · 26/11/2011 20:28

As do porters, hospital cleaners, basic admin staff, nhs support workers.

When I worked in the private sector I earner more as an unqualified administrator than I do now as a midwife. But I appreciate there are also plenty of administrators in the private sector who earn less than a midwife.

You can't really compare private and public sectors and this isn't what it should be about.

It should be about,

Are the public pension schemes really unaffordable? I would say no if they are £2billion in credit per annum and predicted to be so for the next 20 years.

I would say say that they're not unaffordable if they were only reevaluated and changed three years ago to ensure they stayed affordable.

So they are in profit and they are sustainable.

In which case how can it be fair to make a nurse or teacher pay between £45 and £65 a month more for a smaller pension? Especially when the terms and conditions are set out in people's contracts.

FontSnob · 26/11/2011 20:30

Could that be why the govt are making current services much more attractive to buyers once the current pensions have been slashed?

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 20:33

Nope not affordable.We need to be seen to be doing something about it (pesky deficit, debt, pension liabilities).
The report
www.public-sector-pensions-commission.org.uk/wp-content/themes/pspc/images/Public-Sector-Pensions-Commission-Report.pdf

Damn circa 80% of public pension costs met by the state.

clutteredup · 26/11/2011 20:35

Thank you OP.

I haven't read every post but it does seem to me that a lot of people's objection to the strike is not about public sector workers but about teachers in particular as if the schools are closed they might have to look after their children or make arrangements for someone else to do so or have to lose a day's work. teachers are losing a days pay for this they are not doing it lightly.

I also saw the post where someone said that teachers can resign and someone else can do the job instead. As a teacher I trained to become a teacher for some years and have built and developed my experience over time. In school I teach children - that is what I believe they come to school for so we can raise a future generation who are able to take on the jobs we need them to do in society in the future - including becoming teachers doctors firemen binmen etc - all public sector workers - WITHOUT WHOM society would not function. Schools are not in fact free childcare for people who are working - we provide an essential function in society without which society would fail. If that was such an easy thing for anyone to do why do so many people work in the private sector doing other jobs - could it be the pay is better, or they don't want to face classes of 30+ challenging children everyday - or would rather do a job which benefits just themselves rather than sociey as a whole........

Yes public sector pay and pensions cost money but thats what we ALL (yes as a public sector worker I too pay tax justlike everyone else and my DC go to school aswell) as taxpayers pay for - it is not the public sector workers fault that the economy is in the state it is in - we just happen to be something the goverment is prepared to hit to pay back the money. If they did something about the bankers and those problems there would be a bit more money to go round. Everyone seems to want to have everything society can give them without having to pay for it - including appearing resentful that they should have to pay for teachers at all.

Rant over - sorry just needed to put my opinion across as DH is public sector worker too and his private sector equivalent pay would be 6 figures - he doesn't earn a fraction of the that but brings in a lot of money into the economy in his job!

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 20:35

We have to be seen to be doing something (Greece/Italy/Ireland anybody....)

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 20:36

DH public sector will NOT be striking

thetasigmamum · 26/11/2011 20:40

clutteredup what equivalent would that be? Why would he work for so much less in the public sector? How do you know he could get a 6 figure salary job in the private sector?

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 20:42

We need to show we can do the maths, be accountable for our debt.

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 20:44

"Yes public sector pay and pensions cost money but thats what we ALL (yes as a public sector worker I too pay tax justlike everyone else and my DC go to school aswell) as taxpayers pay for".

But circa 80% of your work pension costs are met by the tax payer as well!

iggly2 · 26/11/2011 20:45

Our children are in deep trouble.

Flip

1 2 ··· 33 34 35 ··· 39 40