to say this to all the teachers who are striking next week

[Memoo]

As a parent I am 100 % behind you.

I really appreciate that you put your life and soul into your job and im sorry more people don't get just how hard you work for the benefit of our children.

Don't let the bastards grind you down!

It's about £80 a month for most. To get less, not to maintain.

For a moment let's assume the monthly figure is correct. On it's own it would seem incredibly unfair. But when you look at the BIGGER PICTURE the employer (ie. the government) cannot afford to pay what was promised by another government who doesn't have to worry about actually paying it.

So in effect you are demanding that someone else pays for a promise which can no longer can be kept just so you can continue to benefit from a promise which with hindsight should never have been made.

Alder like all sectors of work some put their life and soul in and some don't.Fed up with the entire teaching profession being held up as paragons of virtue.

Surely if you're putting your heart and soul into teaching it's neither here nor there if OFSTED are around,OFSTED is a snapshot of what should be happening all the time.

MrsHeffley

every course that I went on in the private sector was paid for by my employer.

"we should all be fighting for our rights rather than begrudging the few who've retained them"

Well said YouKnowNothingoftheCreditCrunch.

The politics of envy?

niceguy if you work on that premise then every promise or contract made ever made can be broken and the whole of society will collaspe!

Niceguy2 thanks for the links on the bbc website, very interesting.

MrsHeffley you sound quite bitter about public sector workers. If your DP is fed up of getting home at 7pm and paying for his own courses, perhaps he should find himself a cushy little job in the public sector instead. If he can find one that is. Most of my colleagues work during evenings, holidays and weekends and training courses are pretty much vetoed these days.

I'm afraid I haven't read the whole thread, but wanted to add my voice to say that I agree with the OP, I'm behind the teachers 100%. Yes, dd's school will be closed, yes it's inconvenient and yes, I will lose a day's annual leave. But we're talking about a day, and the teachers are striking because the changes that this short-sighted government are trying to push through will affect them for the rest of their lives - and it would be a lot more than a minor inconvenience.

From what I have seen, teachers work bloody hard, and I think it's fair to say that most really do put their hearts and souls into it. I am deeply grateful for all that they do for my dc and I think they have every right to decent terms and conditions and a decent pension.

I just hope that enough of today's children can afford to become teachers in the future, so that there is someone still around to educate the next generation. We should be encouraging the brightest and best to consider teaching as an attractive career - not doing all in our power to drive them away.

Mrs H,

I refer you to Michael Gove and the ministry for Education as well as to a previour post - more time is being demanded.

Non contact time, is lesson time where the school can not dictate what you do in it. However, this time can be used for marking, planning, organising trips, meetings, calls/meetings to parents, research and yes some admin. It is not time to put up your feet and drink tea.

Mr Gove and the Ministry are focused on cretating an inclusive learning environment where all students get their required A* - Cs. In an age where statitcis and tables are key, teachers are expected to provide for a child from 8 - 6. Yes, I know not all teachers do, but with extra curricular activities and special teaching activities this is becoming more and more the norm.

I applord your dp. But teachers do stuff after 3:30 as well.

Employers aren't sending employees on courses.My dp works in IT in a highly skilled area for a company that is doing well.They've completely cut back on training even though they all need it to keep at the top of their field.I dread to think what other companies not doing well are doing.

Soooo dp goes in an hour earlier and stays later projects permitting on top of the extra hours he does for work(unpaid)in his own time to study.This is why we have the heartbreaking youth unemployment figures because companies aren't willing to spend money on training.

Some comments suggest that teachers go into teaching 'knowing that pay is less than what they could get in the private sector' (another argument) but they accept it because they look forward to a good pension. Sorry, am I the only one who doesn't believe people look 40 years into the future when taking a job...

I am all for people having a collective voice but from what I can understand there was a very poor ballot turnout. Unless there is a majority of overall members voting for a strike, a strike is not representative.

Public sector workers - including teachers accepted the low pay,in return for a reasonable pension ( although the average teachers pension is actually £10,000 - hardly a fortune). Everyone has a moral right to strike for fair pensions for all .

Nice,

Yep: WE CAN NOT AFFORD IT. Neither can teachers or other public sectors, who also pay taxes and are effected by everything that is going on.

Matana my dp would love a public sector job with it's rather nice pension pension but like most people he has to get work where it is.He has a job which although the conditions have changed is still a job and a good one in the currant climate-kind of like teachers really.

butterflies you asked whether there are actuaries in the public sector, yes there are, salary levels, most would earn more in private sector, with some of the changes that are going on with EU legislation for insurance companies salaries have increased a fair amount in the last 2 years, a bit like IT with Y2K. T & C 's, generally less holidays in private sector and very rare to have a defined benefit pension scheme.

Someone ask how much to get a 10k pension income earlier, depends on what assumptions you use, but a 25 year old female, retiring at 65 would need to make a net contribution of between 250 and 330 per month, the higher amount to get an index linked pension. Private pensions charge, so you need to take those charges into account, there is no guarantee of fund growth nor that annuity rates will provide the level of income you were planning for.

Beccatheboo, when public sector workers in previous years pointed out that their salaries were lower, they were told they shouldn't complain because their pensions were higher.

so even if they didn't think ahead ( I must say I did, so you are saying I am lying?) it was forceably pointed out to us

Also I'm not bitter just in the position of seeing it from both sides and with teaching friends who don't support the strike.

Bit late on the thread but right behind the strike!

Mrs H,
Am I to understand that because teachers have a job they should not complain about any changes, that in the private sector, would not be allowed? Remember, this is a change in pay and conditions.
I know, it sounds like we are all suddenly having a go at you, but I'm afriad I'm struggling to see where you are not sounding bitter or angry at teachers. Teachers are demanding that the government stand by prmoises (a lesson I'm sure we would wish for our own children).

Can't comment on teachers really, i work in policing MrsHeffley where jobs are being shed quicker than you can point a stick at. My point is that all in the public sector garden is far from rosy. Like your DP, they work bloody hard and get precious little recognition. Your DP's job sounds secure and i'm pleased about that. Many in the public sector don't have that luxury, so really the pension argument is irrelevant.

A really interesting thread but sadly, I'm not sure that either side is going to change the other's mind here!
I am, and always have been a bit of a lefty. Always been supportive of the public sector and supported worker's rights.
However.......... in this case I'm afraid I can't support the strikes. We need to take action to address the inequity in the pensions for public / private sector workers and to address the economic situation in this country.
It is grossly unfair for private sector workers to subsidise and prop up the public sector pension scheme. It is only fair that workers in the public sector make that contribution themselves, in the way that those in the private sector do.
There are many careers where those going into it, or even part way through their careers feel horrified at the thought of still doing those jobs post 60 / 65 but that's simply the world in which we all now have to function, no matter what sector we're in.
The public sector, and teachers in particular need to get over this victim mentality and appreciate the fact that they're (for the most part) in secure jobs for life. When was the last time anyone knew a teacher get made redundant? Look into the private sector and you'll see families in constant fear of the next "restructure".
Quit whining ffs!!!!

Thanks Thisisasign, so as in many professions, the lower salaries were compensated by higher pensions and in some (but not all) cases better holidays etc.

If I'd known about this in advance (isn't hindsight wonderful!) I would have been happy to pay more into my pension but would have had to start much earlier. Now too old for this to be feasible, really.

Errrr Craig those of us in the private sector have been putting up with changes(and job insecurity Matana) for years,nobody in the public sector minded then.It's called the real world.Yes it's not nice.Yes it's scary but it's it's life.Kind of resent the fact we've had to put up with it for years but the minute the public sector are involved too they seem to think they're above it all-they're not.

Great post Dotty
This segregation can't continue.
And the Gov't need to also address the layers of management and wasteful temp/overtime/layers of useless management use in the NHS as well.

Good post Dotty.