To think families on free school dinners should not be expected to make voluntary contributions to school outings

[reallytired]

I think that schools should use the pupil prenium for children on free school dinners to pay the costs of a child who is entitled to free school dinners to pay for school outing costs.

I think they should get rid of voluntary contributions. It is wrong the current system where someone on 50K can refuse to pay for the cost of an outing, but their child still gets to go, but someone on a low income will struggle to find the money.

We need a fairer system for funding outings.

It's VOLUNTARY - you don't have to pay it.

your not wrong
but I hate that every thing is done of if you get free dinners.
schools should fund raise for trips

I agree.

I think that everyone should have to pay for social things or have the option to have their children not attend, (with assistance for those living below poverty line etc!) but that all things that take place during school time that are part of the curriculum should be free as they are part of your child's education.

Ideally.

Now that just leaves the question of how the hell schools afford that!

and restrict it to fairly inexpensive trips, not ones to New York, for example. For people on 50k these are also a struggle to fund.

What about children of low income working families bringing home less than benefit levels for free school meals then? Why is it fair that these families have to pay for meals and other school related things, when IS families dont

But people like me can afford to pay. I don't mind chipping in, and I don't mind if other people can't. And I don't care if other people can afford it but are just too mean because frankly life is too short. Karma will probably get 'em anyway.

Should schools be better funded on the whole, definitely.

So are you saying that people who aren't on free dinners should pay, and people who get the free dinners shouldn't? Or that no one should pay?

Because on the flip side, is it really far that I pay for my own kids to go on a school trip - plus a bit more - to subsidise your children's place, just because we are not on free dinners?

That's why it would be fairer to have a 'level of income below which you are entitled to assistance', rather than an 'if you are on x benefit you are entitled to assistance' system.

Yabu.

Not everyone who doesn't qualify for free school meals is on 50k.
And as someone else has said it's a voluntary contribution - if you can't pay it, don't.

I got told (at our last place) by a member of the board of governors for the school

"we are lucky with this school as the financial situation of parents is evenly split between those in the military and thus in full time employment and those who are families on benefits or single aprents, and we find that if ever there is a school trip then the parents who are in the military will pay so teh ones on benefits don't have to - a fair system as no one loses out"

I just stood there like . I did point out that a junior rank in the armed forces just out of basic training with a wife and 2 chidlren didn't neccesarily make a fortune either.

Yes but in reality how many people on 50k refuse to pay for a school trip? I bet it is a drop in the ocean. I always pay double for a school trip, they are cheap and I can afford it and know of some children's families t school struggle to find it.

What I DON'T think is fair is what happened at ds's primary school which was lone parents automatically qualified for free residential trips - so my friend didn't have to pay even though she earns a lot and doesn't qualify for free school dinners. That seems utterly bizarre.

My kids qualify for free school dinners as I get working tax credits. But it's because they DO get free dinners that I can then budget paying for trips. I wouldn't dream of not contributing - and think there is a fairly nasty undertone on this thread suggesting that people who get free school dinners are free loading scroungers.
I can't however afford to pay for the 5 night residential trip next year. DD knows that and is happy to accept that she can't go.

pinky our trips are a lot - one next year is £75 for an over nighter and day trips tend to be anything from £10 - 15.

YABU. There are always families in the middle, who don't qualify for much/any help from the state but who don't earn enough not to struggle with things like this. They are the ones who lose out every single time.

At our school, parents whose children are in receipt of free school meals are exempt from paying for school trips and for after-school activities such as football club and art club.

AKMD oh yes, that middle income bracket where everyone thinks you have shed loads of money but reality is very different - I know it well!

FSM are a shit way of deciding support levels.

If you work you do not get FSM: that would include someone who is self employed and on below minimum wage level or even making a loss, surely not unusual in these financial climes?

Criteria for fsm:
Your child may be entitled to receive free school meals if you are entitled to receive one or more of the following:

Income Support
Income Based Jobseekers Allowance
An income-related employment and support allowance
Support under part VI of the Immigration and Asylum Act 1999
The Guarantee element of State Pension Credit
Child Tax Credit, provided they are not entitled to Working Tax Credit and have an annual income (as assessed by HM Revenue & Customs) that does not exceed £16,190

It'ds the bottom criteria stuffs it for quite a lot of low icnoe famillies.

We've always paid for every trip: this is likely to change and I cannot see ds3 joing his class on the trip away next Spring. that's just as it is and ahrd luck but we will have to keep him home as that's school rules if teahcers go on trip and that means either DH or I cannot work so...

Sapphirefling - what county do you live in? Working families tax credit isnt a door opener for free school meals. I do wish it was, that is my gripe that families with a total income of around £15K including the credit, don't qualify.

I REALLY hate the letters home which guilt trip into paying by saying the only way this trip can go ahead is if EVERYONE pay - really rotten for those that are struggling I always think.

sapphire are you sure? Becuase actually 1p in WTC disentitles you- check the admin, they can ask for money back.

My dd has free school meals and I always pay for her trips- I'd feel too bad not to, thogh a few times it has been a struggle. I've noticed though, since her move to junior school from infants, that the word 'voulntary' has disappeared from the letters.

At my son's school there is terrible pressure to pay the "voluntary contributions", almost to the point of bullying. It is a ridicolous system. It is "voluntary contribution" but with menances from the school secretary if you are late paying.

My family are not on free school dinners and we have no problem paying for outings. I have always paid the voluntary contribution willingly.

However I know people who do struggle to pay for outings. I also know a woman who will not make contributions on principle even though she can afford outings easily.

I want a system that helps those who really struggle. It is not rocket science to think that someone on benefits is going to struggle to find £14. I realise that some people above the threshold for free school dinners also struggle, but it is easy to tell if someone is registered for free school dinners. The pupil prenium that the governant is paying for children on free school dinners could be used to fund school outings.

Last week was a constant stream of letters asking for money or donations for the school fete.
If I had the money, which I don't, I'd have ended up £232 less well off.