Academics using 'Dr' - wankerish?

[RevoltingPeasant]

On the day I got my PhD, the first thing my mum said to me when I rang to say I'd passed was, 'Oh, I do hope you won't call yourself Dr, it's so pretentious...

...and congratulations!'

Anywho, I never get called Dr except on my office door and in rejection letters from journals. But I think most academics do use it in civilian life. I kinda want to. Does this make me a smug git, especially because my subject specialism is in something entirely useless to humanity literature?

Okay, I actually need to do some work now....

Yes but I still don't get what you mean - if a crazy person wanted to pretend, they just would. I don't see what it has to do with titles. They could pretend to be a nurse or a consultant, or a paramedic.

I don't know whether banks actually ask to see qualifications - I don't think they do - so presumably someone could easily e.g. get a bank card with Dr on it, no matter whether the bank thinks they might be a PhD or a medic.

Yes of course if you asked most people 'What does a doctor DO' they would answer 'medical stuff' - that's the use of the title which is most familiar. Again, I don't see what your point is, really. If you showed someone a picture of a donnish looking figure, books under arm, captioned 'Dr. X', and asked Person In Street 'What does this person do?' they'd probably say 'teaches at a university'.

Funny to see several medics also seeming to have a problem with the non-honorific Dr. referring to PhDs. I don't get it. A 'real' Dr.? No, in our set-up there are two distinct groups to which this title commonly refers. As said upthread, in e.g. Germany, it simply refers to PhDs and medical 'doctors' can't use it. But I'm sure that if you asked, in Germany, 'What does a doctor do?' they'd still say 'medical stuff'.

We're into semantics here!

'I would rather be defined by my actions rather than actual qualifications.' - Don't you think that's quite a strange, and chippy, thing to say? What are you actually getting at there? You're essentially saying that you don't really like the fact that PhDs use the title Dr. You're trying to put it down, subtly. I really don't get why. Because it's just what it is, a title, that is the traditional, recognised way of referring to that group, just as Mrs. is for married women.

EssentialFattyAcid so someone who is a Mrs. uses 'Mrs' when filling in a form- it is her preference regarding how she refers to herself given that option, someone who is a 'Dr' does the same- ditto.

What IS the problem with that? Please tell me, because I am quite confused about what you are objecting to specifically. I think this is a different issue to someone approaching you at a party and saying 'I'm Dr. Ancient Greek Literature', which plenty of people on this thread, with/without PhD's are ALL AGREEING would be a bit wanky.

When you leave the services (as long as you retire rather than resign) you can keep your rank as your title. It's generally accepted that only those who reach OF3 (Major, Lieutenant Commander, Squadron Leader) will do so although notable exceptions include Captain Mark Phillips, father of Zara and Peter Phillips. You don't have to drop a rank, that (along with going up a rank if you wear uniform to get married in) is an urban myth.

Of course, full Generals (the four stars) never retire so they are called eg General Sir Richard Dannatt and always will be.

Thanks for clarifying! Doesn't count for dad as that wasn't how he got it, but clears up all the behind hand murmuring about my other friend!

The problem is jealousy. Plain and simple jealousy. I admit to it myself but at least have the option of living vicariously through my husband's Phd.

Ah Wottinger. You won't get an answer to this one. And that is, because, this is one of those issues that brings out the chip in those that have the chip.

They have a problem with it because it makes them feel inferior, and annoyed that someone has been 'elevated' (as they see it) to a stage where they have a title that they can use which gives them the opportunity to 'show off' - to publicly proclaim themselves as educated professionals. As they see it.

Crap of course!

More surprising are the number of medics who also clearly have a problem with it. I can only guess that they would like to stake a sole claim to the Dr. title and are narked that actually, it's them with the honorific.

Also crap!

You won't get a soul to admit that, but there's really no other logical reason for this thread to even exist. Am amused at the lack of academics weighing in to insist that 'medics shouldn't use the title for xxx spurious reason'. Perhaps they are a more philosophical bunch (boom boom)

Wives can use their husband's title?

What fresh madness is this?

Shouty

It's really a response to the suggestion that medical doctors are NOT allowed to use Dr because technically we don't have a doctorate. That did annoy me. I am a doctor, it affects every part of my life and I am a doctor to my very soul. It's hard to explain but I love being a doctor and it's more than just a job to me, more a way of life. I hope that doesn't sound silly

I don't mind PhD dr's using Dr but I am definitely a doctor too even if I don't have a PhD. I hope that makes sense. As you say there are 2 distinct types of doctor and both groups should feel able to use that title as they like.

In Germany iti s not that wives can use their dh's title but (more in the past) a woman was defined by what her dh did, since for the most part women did not have any job with status - same as the UK

So if your husband was a doctor but you were not, you would have been Frau Doktor for instance

Nowadays a Frau Doktor is a female doctor

"Snagging a husband when you already have a doctoral thesis is the greatest triumph of all. Bluestockings are rarely seen as good wife material and thus only the supremely fortunate and wily can hope for a proposal. That's why married Drs should draw a veil over their bookish tendencies and favour Mrs in public."

That made me laugh out loud!

I was Dr Unmarriednotateacheryet, then Dr Marriedstillnotateacher (as my somewhat ramshackle career went academia, industry-but-with-an-academic-link), then with2kidsnotitlewhateverexceptchild'smum, now in school I am Mrs Teacherwith2kids (I'm in primary, to insist on the Dr bit would be extremely pretentious and seen as threatening) but to my bank and to unwanted telesales calls I am and have always been Dr.

It helps because my late MiL was the only 'real' Mrs Teacherwith2kids, so I can cheerfully tell unsolicited callers that I'm afraid Mrs Tw2k is dead and unable to come to the phone...

So much angst over a title if you have a PhD and want to use it, then do! Anyone who thinks it is wankerish need to get over themselves. The only time I can think of where this would be inappropriate is if you are in a patient facing role and can accidentally misrepresent yourself as a medical doctor.

Someone's up thread suggested medical doctors calling themselves physicians and not using the title Dr. This won't work in the UK or other Commonwealth countries because physicians specifically refer to doctors in internal medicine as opposed to surgery, obs and gynae etc.

I do think it is a bit wankerish really but I sometimes use it when it suits me

I did get 'Dr' added to my passport when I was younger and visiting a country for research reasons where it was very unusual indeed for women to be academics. 'Foreign' women especially were consigned to categories of alienation, and given additional questioning upon entering and exiting the country, as well as by armed police and guards when simply moving about the country.

It did lend assistance to my ability to do my research.

I think the passport says 'holder entitled to be called Doctor.' It's in a cupboard somewhere ...

I have deliberately kept my maiden name, though, otherwise we would have two Dr Somethingotherthanhardgoing's in the house. Now that would be confusing. I also answer to Mrs, am Miss on my bank card.

Dr is a cool way to get out of the Ms/Miss/Mrs dilemma on forms, and elsewhere, most academics refer to themselves as Firstname Secondname on introduction as everyone assumes you have a PhD.

"Ah Wottinger. You won't get an answer to this one. And that is, because, this is one of those issues that brings out the chip in those that have the chip.

They have a problem with it because it makes them feel inferior, and annoyed that someone has been 'elevated' (as they see it) to a stage where they have a title that they can use which gives them the opportunity to 'show off' - to publicly proclaim themselves as educated professionals. As they see it. "

Oh dear you are so wrong, Shouty. I do not feel inferior to any phd holder, neither do I think anyone else on this planet should. But by all means believe this about me if it makes you feel better about yourself.

I only suggest that everyone should call themselves Dr to avoid gender and marital discrimination - I would be just as happy with "Pleb" tbh. I have no need to try to claim any special enhanced status in the world. This doesn't mean that I don't value the contribution of scientists towards making the world a better place to live.

Well, I'm a Dr, but neither a medic nor a PhD. And I don't use it outside of work.

Other half is a PhD and uses it EVERYWHERE, especially at the GP, when Dr Sharkie'sOH appears like a big read banner on the flashy automated calling thing, and everyone looks at him.

Ooh, are you a DLitt?

A DD??!

A DPhil?

I know someone whose letters-after-their-name read MA DPhil.

It would be even better if it were a Phil.

Phil Lastname MAD Phil

:o

A Doctor of Drudgery from the University of Hard Knocks (mate)?

psychologist, not a medical one though.

EssentialFattyAcid why do you believe that people with PhD's are 'trying to claim special advanced status in the world'? If you have a PhD you have the RIGHT to call yourself Dr if you choose, if you are married you have the RIGHT to call yourself Mrs.

If you personally are married/ believe in marriage how would you feel is someone came along and repeatedly was quite snotty about you using 'Mrs', accusing you of trying to claim special status?

And I repeat my question- both are titles you gain a right to use, why is 'Dr' wankerish and Mrs isn't?

sharkie do you hold a doctorate? Do you use the title?