Being "passive" in relation to the grandparents

[vanillacinamon]

Is it reasonable to be "passive" in terms of facilitating "grandparenting" experiences for your parents / inlaws
In this context I mean as follows:

• both sets of parents (mine and inlaws) are not ill and are mid 60s. They are both active although they dislike long car journeys (very reasonably)
• we live about 3.5 hours drive from each respective set of parents
• before we had our two children by and large we used to visit them although they did come and visit us occassionally - now our house struggles a bit size wise with visitors (or certainly overnight visitors which is likely to be appropriate given the distance)
• my husband and I both work full time
• both sets of parents have implied that they would like to be "copied in" on their grandchildren but dont really want an active role in terms of looking after them or anything similar. Both are mildly eyebrow raising about our parenting (it is fairly normal) but not excessively so. For example mother in law wrote a very lovely thank you letter for photos i sent her and said she was going to go and buy photoframes to display them

Is it reasonable based on the above, namely that they dont really want to be involved on a practical level but might want to see the grandchildren occasionally, for me NOT to make a massive effort to take the children to see each respective set of parents very often if at all. In other words is there a "duty" to allow non-hands-on grandparents regular meetings with their grandchildren at their home (ie we travel to see them).

Or is it ok to just not set anything up and send the occasional photo and leave it at that.

This link was kind of what I am thinking of although neither have said they definitely dont want to be involved but they are this end of the spectrum

www.telegraph.co.uk/lifestyle/8876420/How-can-I-be-Granny-without-becoming-an-unpaid-nanny.html

Am I being unreasonable just to smile and think I do enough, I am happy for my children not to see you very often if at all (maybe a photo of granny would suffice instead)

Am I being unreasonable and is there a duty to make the time and effort and travel to take young children (1 and 3 years) to see their grandparents

We see my parents and il's about 4-6 times a year, but they only live 100 miles away. The family are very close and we email and phone (well I phone my mum ) quite a bit.

I would probably make the effort to go and see them about 3 times a year, plus any special occasions.

My children love seeing them, but our lives are quite busy.

YANBU - been theer and moved abroad - they have to make the effort to get to us now as they are retired (in ils case).

I would continue seeing grandparents as much as you did before having children. If they want more they will soon say but it sounds as though they are content take a back seat. Growing up I probably saw my grandparents 4-5 times a year and I still had a close relationship with them.

No I don´t think that there is any duty.

If they aren´t that interested, I can´t see how d´children miss out by not seeing them very often tbh.

I think it depends just how often you mean - if you mean they'd see their grandparents a few times a year, that seems fine to me. If you mean they'd see them every second or third year, less good! Though that said, I don't think I saw my mum's parents more than that until they retired and moved house.

Try to stick with it a bit (say 2-3 times a year for each set), even if they don;t make much effort in terms of visiting you.

Not so much from a 'duty' pov, but because it is, ATEOTD, quite nice for gps and gcs to get a bit of time together, and if they start to build a relationship now, they might even go and stay with them (without you!!!) as they get older.

Btw, one way of keeping the relationship 'current' without lots of work is to let/help your dcs make 'cards' (drawings, random scribbles, bits of sticking, whatever) for their gps now and again, not just for birthdays. It encourages the gps to think about the gcs and really does help with relationship-building over time.

Another way might be to use skype with webcams to have a 5 minute 'chat'/waving session once a month.

thanks fillybuster
do you think if children NEVER see their grandparents (or only say every other year) it is damaging to the grandchildren?

I think as the children are very young and grandparents are fit that you should encourage them to visit you more than you visit them. Would they be able to afford to stay in a b&b near you if there's not enough space at your house? I think it would be a shame to not see them fairly frequently though. Also they will get more quality time with the kids when they are a bit older as they don't need the intense care they do when young.

I only saw my mums parents every couple of years - it didn't harm us at all, but we had no meaningful relationship with them until they moved and we saw them regularly. From an emotional point of view, I don't think you can be close to people you rarely see, though things like Skype and emails make it easier. But not being close to them doesn't harm children - there are plenty who don't have a full set of grandparents, or don't ever meeat some of them, and they don't miss what they've never known.

It's got bugger all to do with 'duty' and everything to do with wanting your kids to have a relationship with your parents. Assuming that you don't love them and want to see them for your own sake.

OrmIrian
Of course the sub text to my post is that relations with both sets of parents is not brilliant, but it is cordial in as much as there are no blazing fights. It is just the subtle message I have got (rightly or wrongly) is that they don't want to do anything in terms of caring for either of my children. This is genuinely fine and the less we meet up the more I feel confident of my parenting abilities, my support network (nursery school etc). The only issue is that there is also a subtle subtext that they would probably quite like us to travel the 3.5 hours to visit each respective set of parents 2 or 3 times a year and stay with my little ones for as long as they find it entertaining at which point we go home.
I find this quite an oldfashioned notion and am resisting the guilt trip I am feeling (maybe I am imagining it) as a result of feeling too exhausted at the notion to make that journey. In terms of my mother in law she is divorced, pre children came to us every year for christmas, now has decided it would be far better for us to visit her but has made it clear she dislikes the waking in the night/ mess/nappies involved with young children (although she also professes to love young children).

In terms of my mother, when I was in early pregnancy with my first baby she told me she did not want to help out with any children I had, which I said I was fine with.
But since she has made it clear she would like us to trek over for an hour or so afternoon tea so she can see my two little ones before we go home.

Hence my question - in this situation is there a duty. And am i unreasonable in saying, I work full time, my husband works full time, we are both totally knackered pretty much all the time, no we wont do this. is it depriving our children of something significant

3 times a year per set means you are going away on a visit every other month, which seems a bit much actually.

What are they like when you visit? Do they seem to enjoy your company? Do you enjoy theirs? Do they ask you to visit? I mean, what happens if you don't organise anything, are they bothered?

I think I'd be aiming to copy their level of interest/effort, really. If they invited me to visit, I'd visit, and, later, invite them back. If they don't want to return the visit, they can wait a year for me to make the effort again. If they don't invite me to theirs, I'd just wait on that, too. If we made a lot of effort to visit and then they seemed uninterested in us all I'd be less enthusiastic about revisiting. That kind of thing.

You can send photos, occasional emails detailing things they've been up to etc. As the children get older things may change.

It isn't going to damage the children not to have a relationship with people who aren't very interested in them, just because they happen to be related to those people. It's a shame, they miss out on a loving relationship with people who could be fabulous for them - but while you can take the children to the gps, you can't force the gps to act like grandparents. I'd say it was more damaging to be continually dragged to visit people who don't really want to know you.

x-posted.

No, you don't have a duty. You have a relationship. Relationships are two-way. Your mother and MIL both want something (quite a lot, actually) from you. What are they giving back?

(and I don't go for "they looked after you when you were small, now you have to do what they want" - that kind of giving goes down the generations. They looked after you, and now you do the same for your children).

I'd visit each set of gps twice a year, maybe more if you can tie it in with other visits or make it an overnight stop en route somewhere.

I would make it very clear to both sets of gps that they are very welcome to visit as often as they want, but maybe also give them the option of staying at travel inn or b&b if they find it too cramped.

I would absolutely not be trekking my children 3.5 hours for christmas. You have young children and work f/t explain to your MIL she is very welcome to come as always but you will absolutely understand if she prefers to stay at home.

Why don't you get skype and use that at least once a month with them, that way they can see what their gcs are up to without it being too imposing. I would also be very honest with them that you both work f/t your time with the DCs is precious you can't travel with them all the time as it is tiring for everyone.

Sorry that they don't want to be fully involved, but I don't think you are depriving your DCs of anything, children are very good at sussing out who actually wants to spend time with them and will give their love and attention accordingly.

Bertha thank you
The end of your post is what I have been feeling but never managed to articulate. It is the exact opposite of their feelings on the situation I anticipate

rookie
used to get on well with MIL before children
Now I feel a gap between us. Sometimes I feel guilty for taking her son away from her. she is divorced. She has a gentleman friend who visits her every week and drives her whereever she wants to go (he brings her down to see us). She looks after him (cooks for him & cared for him when he was ill) but has refused countless proposals of marriage from him. none of my business. but the idea that the children are now taking up space in the marital home where it used to be quiter and more "visitor friendly" is starting to weigh on my mind. My husband is her only son. She has one other daughter who lives in south america

If it's just for an hour or so, afternoon tea, then is it possible to get into the habit of meeting at a mutually-convenient place, such as a child-friendly pub for Sunday lunch, or a hotel for afternoon tea?

As far as your larger question, I think if they are not prepared to meet you halfway in the broader sense, helping sometimes, coming to you sometimes, then you are perfectly entitled to make the arrangements suit you, and as often as works for you.

If you cut back on the visits to them, you may find a renewed willingness in them to have more contact in places/times that suit you.

No, you don't have a duty.

Your only duty is to your children, and they will not miss what they have never had.

My children have two sets of grandparents. They see one set. They make an effort and we make an effort. The other set don't make an effort and either do we. This decision was arrived at between my then-partner and I, as we realised that sometimes the stresses of trying to accommodate some people outweigh the possible benefits.

The kids are not suffering because of the lack of knowledge of their other grandparents, so I don't feel you are unreasonable.

I'll go against the grain and say YABU.

We had 4 children in 5.5 years. My parents have always lived 4 hours drive away, apart from 4 years when they lived on the continent and it used to involve an overnight ferry plus a 4 hour drive to see them.

We went to them every Xmas, every summer, every Easter and usually one other time as well. They very rarely visited us.

The children had a very good relationship with my parents. Sadly my dad died when they were 10, 8, 6 & 4. The eldest 3 remember him. The youngest doesn't. He was only 62 and it wasn't expected, so I was pleased we had made the effort and he got to know his grandchildren.

When I started reading this I thought you were being a bit unreasonable - Grandparents aren't obliged to actually be carers for their grandchildren. It would be nice if they were, but not obligatory. But.... they should actually give a damn, and it seems they don't really. They just want the 'image' of being grandparents - see the children running around for a short period of time then off you go.

I'm astounded that your DM wants you to see her for around 1 hour, yet it would take you 3 1/2 hours driving each way to get there!!!!! I'm sorry, but has your DM completely lost the plot??????

Never in a million years would I drive a 3 1/2 hour journey to only see someone for a short period of time. That trip is minimum whole weekend if done with young DC, and actually preferably a long weekend.

They really want it to be a distannt relationship, don't they?

But just as they have no obligation to care for their grandchildren, then neither do you have any obligation to see them all that frequently. I would say it would be nice to see them 2 or 3 times a year, but only if one of the times you go to them, and the other they come to you.

"Your only duty is to your children, and they will not miss what they have never had."

So you don't think they could ever feel sad at not having a relationship with their grandparents? Bonkers.

FWIW our family view (incuding both sets of gps) was that the onus was on them to visit us when DCs were small. As my MiL put it : "Darling, you may have to do a lot of duty visiting when I'm old, fragile and gaga".
Happily both sets of gps preferred to stay in a local B&B. They found a whole day of family life exhausting and liked being able to retreat completely. We could have accommodated them.

grovel your DPs and PILs sound ideal!

The frequency of contact, and the lack of interest in "childcare" that you describe is very similar to the situation with my grandparents when I was a child. Possibly I saw my maternal GP more. The onus was very much on us to visit them, and they never babysat. That said, with my maternal grandparents, each grandchild spent a special weekend with them in London. We also spent Christmases with them and my aunts, uncles and cousins. Family was very important to us.

Looking back, there were difficult complicated relationships between my parents and my GPs. That said, I am very glad we had the visits we did, and it's a credit to my parents that they did visit. I loved my paternal GM very much, and even though I struggled with my relationship with my maternal GM as a child (she preferred boys to girls), in the few years before she died we became close.

I suppose you can't miss what you don't have, but I do think the relationship with GP is a very special one.