Being "passive" in relation to the grandparents

[vanillacinamon]

Is it reasonable to be "passive" in terms of facilitating "grandparenting" experiences for your parents / inlaws
In this context I mean as follows:

• both sets of parents (mine and inlaws) are not ill and are mid 60s. They are both active although they dislike long car journeys (very reasonably)
• we live about 3.5 hours drive from each respective set of parents
• before we had our two children by and large we used to visit them although they did come and visit us occassionally - now our house struggles a bit size wise with visitors (or certainly overnight visitors which is likely to be appropriate given the distance)
• my husband and I both work full time
• both sets of parents have implied that they would like to be "copied in" on their grandchildren but dont really want an active role in terms of looking after them or anything similar. Both are mildly eyebrow raising about our parenting (it is fairly normal) but not excessively so. For example mother in law wrote a very lovely thank you letter for photos i sent her and said she was going to go and buy photoframes to display them

Is it reasonable based on the above, namely that they dont really want to be involved on a practical level but might want to see the grandchildren occasionally, for me NOT to make a massive effort to take the children to see each respective set of parents very often if at all. In other words is there a "duty" to allow non-hands-on grandparents regular meetings with their grandchildren at their home (ie we travel to see them).

Or is it ok to just not set anything up and send the occasional photo and leave it at that.

This link was kind of what I am thinking of although neither have said they definitely dont want to be involved but they are this end of the spectrum

www.telegraph.co.uk/lifestyle/8876420/How-can-I-be-Granny-without-becoming-an-unpaid-nanny.html

Am I being unreasonable just to smile and think I do enough, I am happy for my children not to see you very often if at all (maybe a photo of granny would suffice instead)

Am I being unreasonable and is there a duty to make the time and effort and travel to take young children (1 and 3 years) to see their grandparents

both mine are 3.5 hours away. I try to visit for a week or so in the summer hols. we also have a mid way cottage xmas time.

sorry - then they pop down easter time usually too and sleep rough in our lounge

WidowWadman, of course children could grow up and feel sad that they didn't have a relationship with their grandparents. But the point is that you can't force the grandparents to build that relationship.

I used to take my children to see my parents regularly. Eventually I gave up. They showed so little interest in us when we visited that it seemed a waste of our time. A few months later, none of the children seemed to have noticed that we hadn't seen their gps. I asked if they'd like to go visit them. They said they'd like to see their gp's dog.

You can take a horse to water ...

Have you thought of arranging a midway visit? See where each IL lives and pinpoint a central spot for the three factions of the family. Meet there and it would mean about 90 mins drive for you all. That's not bad for a lengthy lunch, is it?

YANBU. My MIL lives 11 hours away and only met our DS a week before his first birthday, and my parents are pretty much just not interested. We have to put in all the effort with my side; they haven't been to see us for over a year. They are 2 hours away and want us to drive to them, stay for an hour or so and then go. No offer of accommodation has ever (or will ever) be made. The relationship isn't great tbh and although there's no screaming rows, I never feel like we're welcome which is a real shame.

I doubt I'll be driving to see them for Christmas; I've made it clear we will happily receive them and even put them up. This has not been accepted.

I think they want to be seen as being good grandparents by seeing our DS, but they just don't want to put the effort in. It is a shame; my DS will never have what I had with my lovely Nanny and Grandad growing up. I am upset they don't want to build a relationship. But there is nothing I can do. I can't force it.

I hope they don't live to regret it. I honestly do. Because he will never be this age again, and they are missing it all. His first words, first steps...

I'm starting to wonder if people even want to be gp's in the sense that I remember anymore, maybe it's just not done? It seems quite common amongst my generation of parents who I know; the gp's just aren't really arsed.

tallulah I think the difference s tat even though you made the journeys, when you got there there was an actual relationship taking place. In the case of vanilla and others, the grandparents don't desire to interact and build a bond. In that situation I think it's fair to just let things fizzle out:)

Maybe I am being selfish, I dont know. In my case there is other family politics and stuff which is maybe blurring the issue. Ironically there is one set of family members, my husbands own grandma who is 93! and her son (my husbands father) and his new partner - who make an effort at least once per year to make the mamouth journey 4 hours or so to see us, staying in a hotel etc.
I have always been impressed and loved them for it even if they only stay for a few hours, great grandma in particular loves to see the little ones. But then my husband hates with venom his fathers new partner (quasi step mother but they are not married). I got on well with her until I realised that was not politically correct especially as husbands mother regularly bitches about her too. So on that front I have gone into retreat mode. it is not my family so it is not my business. It makes me sad but I feel paralysed.
In terms of my parents there is also history, I was the first of four, my mother was very weary of parenting by the time the last of us 4 had left home, she wanted me out (as the oldest, fair enough) asap to free up space in my childhood home. As mentioned above she said she did not want to do any hands on caring for my children when i was pregnant with my first baby. But since then she has made her "hurt" known that we don't bring the children over to her 3.5 hours drive as mentioned above for an hour or so afternoon tea. She has also accused me of being vengeful in with holding the children from her. This is not true. It is more that I feel I have no energy whatsoever to do it.

Op tbh your parents and ILS sound a bit unpleasant and a little toxic to me. They want everything on their terms. I wouldn't bother taking kids to visit to them, I'd be worried about my DC feeling unwanted or awkward if they made mess etc. My dad can't be bothered to visit DD and so he doesn;t see her. His loss. She's fine!

The only day my inlaws will visit is a Saturday as they have joined so many retiree clubs. We are busy nearly every Saturday. They will not be flexible then guilt trip us big time. They are not hands on grandparents and a visit from them involves all day, me giving them lunch and dinner etc. and they mostly ignore ds. They have never helped, never changed a nappy, criticised our parenting constantly but now he is 3 and a bit more interesting to them they are guilting us into seeing him but only on their terms. I want to step away and ignore it but it gets to me. It's like there's a mini power struggle going on.

I think it is the grandparents that are keeping themselves from their gc rather than us stopping it. Feels shit though. If your mother truly wanted to see them she would come and visit you. It would be different if your parents weren't fit enough to come. I think she is being wholly unreasonable expecting you to schlep all the way up to her with 3 kids for a cup of tea.

Where my inlaws have moved to they have learned a new mantra from their new geriatric mates which goes something along the lines of " You decided to have children so it's up to you to look after them. Of course we'll be there in an emergency( not) but we aren't helping out as we have our own lives to live".

My mother is great with ds and helps out a lot and he loves her. Quite frankly ds will not be happy when he realises we're going to his other gp's at the weekend despite my attempts to jolly him.

My gps were fantastic and I have very very happy memories of them. I don't think my ds will have the same memories of his. I feel sad about this but that's something I can't do anything about.

You decided to have children so it's up to you to look after them. Of course we'll be there in an emergency( not) but we aren't helping out as we have our own lives to live

Paddy
The above mantra sounds like one my mother in law has probably adopted (although never said it outloud probably not even to herself)
The problem I have is i have sincerely got to the stage where I am happy with that. I would like to like her from a distance, hear about her life she is leading etc but not have the confusing guilt trip which seems to go along with it which is that she is not seeing her grandchildren enough.

In terms of my mother there is similar confusion. She emails me fairly regularly asking what the children want for birthdays etc but I struggle to think of anything, how do you guide someone who has no day to day contact with young children as to what they might (sincerely) like. She buys books like "Peter and Jane" learn to read books which are nice, she had them to learn to read and I had them to learn to read and no doubt I will read them to my children. It is what she can get from the local book shop.
I feel guilty when the small birthday parcel of 2 peter and jane books arrives and I cannot tell whether that is her intention (to make me feel guilty) (she is comfortably well off financially, i am not saying peter and jane books are not enough, it is more about the effort - she has a laptop and we have all showed her many many times how to use amazon but that is very confusing for her. she is not ill physically or mentally/memory wise)

"Hence my question - in this situation is there a duty. And am i unreasonable in saying, I work full time, my husband works full time, we are both totally knackered pretty much all the time, no we wont do this. is it depriving our children of something significant"

Well IME it is. Regardless of 'how' they choose to be grandparents. I only saw my grandmothers 4 or 5 times a year but those times were significant. It not only gave me other people to build a relationship with, it gave depth to my life in that it added another generation who had lived through times so different to mine.

If you had said you couldn't stand them or vice versa I'd have said no. Nothing to be gained for the kids if the atmosphere when you got together is toxic.

But only you can say whether the hassle is worth it. And if they don't have this relationship I guess they won't know they missed it.

For example mother in law wrote a very lovely thank you letter for photos i sent her and said she was going to go and buy photoframes to display them

I don't really understand that. Do you mean she was being stroppy that you hadn't bought frames.

I don't think it is duty exactly, that's seems a strange way to think about it, unless you hate them of course. I would visit as often as you want/is possible but invite them in between. If they don't want to come then that is their choice.

I had one set that lived further away and I am a little resentful that we weren't taken to see them more as I feel I didn't know them at all.

I know what you mean about the lack of thought or any appreciation of what a child would like. In fact I'll take your books and raise it to a pair of socks from Lidl (my il's are well off I hasten to add). Yet it appears they wants to see him at their convenience and they have taken to turning up on a Saturday and letting themselves into the house when we're out despite the fact we've told them we're busy. Then they start "Oh we haven't seen him for ages" and then get bored of ds in 5 minutes. I think I'd prefer guilt from a distance.
I think unfortunately if your mother is a guilt user there's not much you can do other than lay it on the line -we're busy, we work, you're retired, if you really want to see the kids then make an effort. Apparently that's what dh is going to do this weekend- but somehow I very much doubt it.

I know where you're coming from OP. When we announced that DD1 was on the way (1st grandchild for ILs) MIL said "oh I hope you're not expecting us to babysit".

Once DD1 had arrived they were more interested, and were even quite good for a while - til SIL had her first when MIL said "it's much more exciting when it's your own daughter having a baby".

We had DD2, SIL had her 2nd and the relationship with ILs has gone pretty much downhill since. In our case, it's that SILs children are perfect while ours are somehow lacking (no idea why, I think they're bloody fantastic!).

So, to get to the point (!), the relationship with ILs is much less important than it could have been, but I feel it is their loss really. They are not prepared to put the same effort into seeing their son and his children as they are his daughter and hers - even down to stuff like chatting on the phone.

Our girls, now 15 and 12, really aren't that bothered whether they see ILs or not - they're quite happy to see them but don't ask after them, dont question why ILs see so much more of the cousins etc.

My mum, on the other hand, is a stalwart in their lives (and my Dbro had 4 kids before mine appeared on the scene, so she'd done her bit!).

To me, what makes the GP relationship special is when that GP puts in the effort with the child. The rest is just social convention really.

Eyebrows
For example mother in law wrote a very lovely thank you letter for photos i sent her and said she was going to go and buy photoframes to display them

I don't really understand that. Do you mean she was being stroppy that you hadn't bought frames.

No sorry my initial post with the above was confusing they way i typed it.

The background to that was that MIL has historically been very kind to us and me in particular and let us stay at her house for various reasons not connected with children (my husbands business dealings). Throughout she was lovely to us. She is a very very independent person and me being over sensitive occasionally got the message that she was doing it out of duty to her son but never has she openly said that. She has excellent manners and always writes lovely thank you letters. We live 3.5 hours away from her. When DC1 was born we probably visited her 3 or 4 times with DC1. She was kind but there were frequent conversations about whether DC 1 had woken her in the night or not, whether the children were dropping food on the carpet when they ate, and a slight eye on me as to whether i was being a supportive wife to her son/good mother but nothing overt.

Earlier this year with pressure from husband i sent invitations to a family get together at our house. I then cancelled it for reasons I wont bore you with. When the invitations were first sent out it was at a time when MIL spent a lot of time bitching about "stepmother" (i.e new partner of her ex husband) being bossy controlling and interferring and having the cheek to arrange family events to which she was invited but she would NOT be attending (stepmother being ursurper i suppose)

At the time i cancelled the party i was getting the jitters a bit about whether my invitation might also be seen as daugher in law getting too big for her boots. MIL had accepted the invitiation initially but said that she would be travelling down and back in the same day (4 hour journey there and back). She could afford a bed and breakfast. Previously she has stayed with us every single christmas (including last christmas with our two children under the age of 2 years).

So in answer to your question, I sent her about 30 photos under pressure from my husband after MIL made it clear she felt it very very unfair that the party had been cancelled. All of the photos were of the children with many being my husband (her son) and the children. They were nice photos.
MIL displayed perfect faultless manners and wrote me a very very nice thank you letter for the photos and said she would buy photo frames.

If distance is involved, I think it becomes less and less feasible to visit often as DC get older and have endless sporting activities and homework. Reasonable GPs will understand this.

I have always promised myself that when my own DC are adults I will put no pressure on them whatsover to visit and I will visit them as regularly as I'm wanted. And I will always arriving bearing bottles of good wine and apple crumbles.

Also, lots of old people don't actually like having DC in their home.

wordfactory "arriving bearing bottles of good wine and apple crumbles"
what a lovely "grandma" you will be
good wine and apple crumbles would be so welcome to parents of a new baby

I have lived through the winter years of hours on the M1 with babies, and GPs visits for endless days where they mark their territory like cats ...

I shall be an impeccable Granny.