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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think that nurses who choose to strike over pensions will not get any sympathy from the general public??

305 replies

McQueasy · 05/11/2011 09:52

Unison have voted to strike on the 30th, this means that nurses within that union have the choice to participate. As a result of this the NHS may have to operate as an 'emergency only' service for the day. Cancelling routine work, clinics, operations etc.

The governments pension proposals are ridiculous, in essence the average worker will pay between £50-£200 a month more towards their pension in what is realistically a levy. They will not see a penny of that when they retire (if they ever are allowed to retire as the age or retirement gets pushed back and back)

However, as operations, clinics and routine work is cancelled in an already stretched system, I cant help but think that public sympathy for this strike will be minimal.

OP posts:
StrandedBear · 08/11/2011 14:57

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
McQueasy · 08/11/2011 16:40

Excellent post jj!!Smile

OP posts:
AnyFucker · 08/11/2011 17:05

thanks for that Jj

caramelwaffle · 08/11/2011 20:04

Good post Jj

pointydog · 08/11/2011 20:09

The government and the media will do their very best to ensure there is no public support.

But there are things more important than public support.

agedknees · 08/11/2011 20:17

Great post JJ.

ShellyBoobs · 09/11/2011 00:04

1. Without a single penny more in contributions, the local government pension scheme could pay all its liabilities for twenty years.

There's some cracking maths/economics on this thread..!

Meanwhile, back in the real world, more than a quarter of all council tax paid goes into paying local government pensions.

At present, contributions from council workers to their own pensions come to less than £2billion a year ? a third of the £6bn that taxpayers put in.

inhibernation · 09/11/2011 00:20

"Gold plated pensions" For the love of God Hmm I'm a psych nurse with continuous employment of 17 years, but only signed up to pension scheme for past 8 years (due to being unqualified initially and later studying). I've worked part-time approximately half of those 8 years due to caring for my pre-school children. My youngest child is disabled and the reality is that I will probably not be able to resume full-time work. Prior to the governments planned changes, I stood to earn about £6k a year at the age of 60. I resent the changes in principle, but in any case I simply can't afford to pay in more. Those who maintain that even with the increased contributions, delayed retirement age and decreased pension sum that it is still a good deal are spectacularly missing the point that some of us simply can't afford it. Many of my colleagues are in a very similar situation.

woollyideas · 09/11/2011 06:01

You are not alone inhibernation Many of my colleagues earn less than the national average but are expected to find approx £50-£70/month in order to stay in the scheme. I'm in the same situation. For me, that represents a week of groceries, or my gas/electricity for the month. As I struggle to make it to the end of the month with not a penny to spare, and frequently only have £3 or 4 left in my purse by the last week of the month, where is this money supposed to come from? I can see a lot of us coming out of the scheme.

As it is, part-time workers already pay percentage contributions based on their full time equivalent salary, so if you're on a 0.5 contract in a job paying £24,000 you pay % contributions based on £24K not £12K earnings, which I've never understood...

What will happen when tens of thounsands of people come out of the scheme I wonder?

JuliaScurr · 09/11/2011 09:04

They will get support because we can all see it's part of the attack on the whole welfare state, public sector, NHS etc. Most people don't think it's reasonable to have to pay more for longer to get less.

Sarahplane · 09/11/2011 10:05

What seems really ironic about all of this is that Rbs staff have a final salary pension scheme that they don't have to pay any contributions to and that pays out much better rates on retirement than any of the public sector pension schemes.

I'm not saying bank staff should loose their pensions because of the bank bailout but public sector workers shouldn't either.

JuliaScurr · 09/11/2011 10:22

Sarah you do realise that public sector and privatesector workers are meant to blame each other for this, don't you? Please don't mention bailouts, it frightens the horses

inhibernation · 09/11/2011 19:35

Woolly - gosh I didn't realise that part-timers pay proportionately more. I find it hard to understand how that isn't discriminatory.

Xmasbaby11 · 09/11/2011 19:45

I support them.

People in that kind of job do not take the decision to strike lightly because they do care about their patients. I admire them for sticking to their principles.

woollyideas · 09/11/2011 20:02

It's true, unfortunately. So if you are in a job that pays £24K for full time, but only work half that time and earn £12K, you pay the same percentage as someone on 24K. Where I work that means if you earn 12K full time you'd pay 4% of your salary, but if you earn 12K part time (50%) you'd pay 7% of your earnings in contributions.

I've never understood why, but I'm in this situation myself...

gaelicsheep · 09/11/2011 21:27

ShellyBoobs - since when were council workers not also taxpayers? And since when were council workers not employed by, and working on behalf of, taxpayers? Plus, of course, a quarter of all council tax (if indeed that has any basis in reality) equates to just over 1 percent of a council's budget.

lassylass · 10/11/2011 01:51

"You have choice too. Emigrate."

Ha ha! I think you have misjudged who has the public support gaelicsheep. Dont let the door hit you in the ass on your way out.

So because public sector workers pay taxes too, that gives them the right to dip their hands into the pot and take overgenerous pensions out? And you cant see that thats just a teeny tiny bit fucking selfish on everyone else?

No of course you cant. You'd rather the next generation pays. Wonderful selfless compassion, as befitting the nursing trade.

Nice post JJ. Pretty much says you and the unions have decided that the pensions are affordable. Well no shit. Unfortunately those who are paying them beg to differ, and they are in power :)

Dillydaydreaming · 10/11/2011 02:32

I say yet again on one of these pension threads (and forgive me if I shout)

IF YOU WANT TO SEE GENEROUS PENSIONS JUST CHECK OUT WHAT MP'S RETIRE ON!

Public sector worker
Nurse
Est pension - ooh a princely sum of less than 8k. Hardly fantastic is it?

I won't be striking but I won't allow people to make statements based on what they read in the DM or suchlike without challenging it either.

This is all chicken feed, those with the REAL gold plated pensions are smoke screening in the hope people won't notice. Some of us do though.

And selfless? Yes most nurses are pretty selfless from my experience. Certainly a career of caring for others, wiping bums, dealing with vomit, phlegm, urine, faeces caring for the dying, laying out the dead among other things - all done without complaint. Yeah I think they deserve a pretty good pension - in most cases they won't get this (despite what the media would have you believe) and some can look forward to a old age of poverty. Still - as long as the bankers and MPs get theirs then it's okay I guessHmm

JuliaScurr · 10/11/2011 13:35

woolly so p/t (women) workers get shat on yet again. Fabulous.

holidaysoon · 10/11/2011 14:03

they have my support

woollyideas · 10/11/2011 16:58

Yes, Julia. In the organisation where I work 97% of part time workers are female!

gaelicsheep · 10/11/2011 20:43

lassylass - what a lovely person you are. Hope you don't ever need the NHS and don't ever get me as a nurse (especially since I never said I was one).

ShellyBoobs · 10/11/2011 20:58

ShellyBoobs - since when were council workers not also taxpayers? And since when were council workers not employed by, and working on behalf of, taxpayers? Plus, of course, a quarter of all council tax (if indeed that has any basis in reality) equates to just over 1 percent of a council's budget.

gaelicsheep, I was responding to the post I quoted, quite obviously.

The quoted post said that the local government pension scheme could pay all it's liabilities for 20 years without any further contributions. That statement is patently bollocks.

So a comment like "Plus, of course, a quarter of all council tax (if indeed that has any basis in reality) equates to just over 1 percent of a council's budget" doesn't sit very well.

25% of my council tax bill is well over £500 per year.

Original poster
McQueasy · 10/11/2011 20:59

Lassylass, will an attitude like that they won't stay in power long.
And will be put back on the benches for another 20 odd years.

OP posts:
gaelicsheep · 10/11/2011 21:42

"The quoted post said that the local government pension scheme could pay all it's liabilities for 20 years without any further contributions. That statement is patently bollocks."

Can you please explain what inside knowledge you have to justify saying that statement is patently bollocks. Clearly it means without contributions being increased, rather than actually no further contributions. You do understand, I presume, that the local government pension scheme pays out from investments and not from the public purse?

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