To think friends DD shouldn't be driving these children around?

[Bohica]

My friends daughter passed her driving test last week. She went for a job interview today at a local childrens nursery and was offered a job which she starts on Monday.

One of her duties is to do school runs in her own vehicle (she has buisness car insurance) for breakfast and after school club at the nursery.

Myy friend thinks this is perfectly acceptable as do the staff at the nursery, they are aware she only passed her test last week.

I'm that they think this is ok and if I had a child at this nursery I wouldn't want an inexperienced driver taking my children to and from school.

AIBU?

shel be fine. if anything over caustious

I am involved with driver training at work. If this girl is involved in a fatal accident while driving on behalf of the nursery (i.e. while ferrying the children around) the nursery itself could be liable under the Corporate Manslaughter and Homicide Act. As a bare minimum, the nursery needs to organise an independent driving assessment that specifically addresses the skills this girl will need for this particular job. This would not have been covered in the generic driving test. They also need to examine her insurance, which I am sceptical that she actually has - I would be concerned that she has not declared to the insurance company exactly what she will be doing, and that she has confused 'driving to and from your normal place of work' (or whatever the wording is) with having business insurance. Obviously, they need to do this for all their drivers, not just this girl.

I am shocked at the naivete and complacency at some of the posters on this thread. Passing your driving test is just the beginning of learning to drive. It's one thing choosing to ferry your own child/ren around a week after learning to drive, quite another to be responsible for other people's children when you have next to no driving experience.

You are definitely NBU.

a week after passing your test

OP are the nursery paying for the insurance? Because it will be astronomical, and hard to manage on a nursery assistant's salary. I think (possibly unfairly) that if she is paying for this insurance herself she hasn't got the right level of cover.

And I don't think you are being U - what you do with your own children is your business, what you do with my children is my business. I would not expect any kind of professional driver (for that is what part of her duties make her) to have one week's experience.

Honestly don't see a problem. I drive a bus and the day I passed my bus test I drove 53 children home from school, and pretty much every day after that too.

the day you passed your bus test - how long had you been driving a car for before you were able to sit that test Dolce?

I passed my test and my nursery owner asked me to check how much business insurance would be on my car and it was already part of the insurance because dh sometimes used the car for his work. We had to change it slightly but it didn't cost us anymore.

But it was 6 months before I was allowed to drive children to and from places. Now the nursery have 2 people carriers which certain members of staff are put through pass plus or whatever it's called.

Most learning actually happens after you pass your test, through experience in reading road conditions and, most importantly, building up the instinct that tells you that another road user is about to do something daft, and reacting before they actually do it.

You don't build this up after a week.

"Is there legislation against new drivers having pre school passengers?"

For employees, there are Local Authority guideline and also Ofstead guidelines.

For bus and taxi drivers it is usually a year, the same applies to thiose employed by statutory workplaces.

The manageress would have had to have seen a copy of her insurance and may hold a photo copy as well as a photocopy of her CRB check, that is usual practice, now.

I'm not sure tbh, how i would feel, it depends on how much driving experience that she had, my DD is learning to drive and is driving her DPs car daily (with him in the car).

I wouldn't be happy with it. It's quite different driving your own children to driving other people's children professionally. Do the parents know she's only just passed her test? Bet the nursery hasn't told them.

When ds was little our nanny used to drive him very occasionally. She was only 19 but I knew she was a responsible, careful person with two years of driving experience (and the right insurance, and a mechanic boyfriend who is equally responsible and knows quite what arses some drivers are as he has to fix their cars). It was my job to check that for my own child and make a decision. I would NOT be impressed had a nursery decided off its own back without telling me that someone who passed their test the week before could ferry my child about.

trois - you only need business insurance to be covered for driving students to/from school. It only costs me an extra £10 per year, so I always include it as you never know when you need to in an emergency (the last time I did have to drive a student however was about 3 years ago)

Thank you for all the replies, I do understand that most people pass their test and then immediatly start driving other people around and HeresTheScaryThingBooyhoo read my first post correctly.

I'm very suprised that the nursery staff think it's acceptable to make driving duties a main responsibility for an inexperienced 18y old.

I thought that would be something to work towards after getting to know the children and gaining every day driving experience.
Our school run is really tight, nightmarre parking and then dodging around the cars parked outside school and lots of children and parents trying to cross the road.

Bohica, they only think it's acceptable because they haven't done a proper risk assessment and they don't know the implications if this girl, or any of their other drivers, were to be involved in a fatal collision.

Birdsgottafly Sat 29-Oct-11 11:34:59
"Is there legislation against new drivers having pre school passengers?"

For employees, there are Local Authority guideline and also Ofstead guidelines.

For bus and taxi drivers it is usually a year, the same applies to those employed by statutory workplaces.

I don't know where you got this birds, but for bus/coach drivers there is no such guideline. Once you've passed your test, you can drive, age of passengers makes no difference.

Wilson, I'd been driving a car for 18 months, but there is no law stating you have to be driving a car for a certain amount of time before you can drive a bus.
And just to add a bit more info, I was 19 when I started driving a bus. Actually that's reminded me, the day I passed and did a school run, the local council had a complaint about my company using an unlicensed driver, they rang and checked, and we explained that the driver had passed their test earlier that day. The council said that was absolutely fine, and they would expect new drivers to be driving professionally the same day.

In everything we do we get better with experience. So if I were employing someone to drive I'd want someone who had been driving for some years.

The other purpose of course is that a driving licence says that you have the ability to drive safely. It doesn't say if you are normally reckless or cautious. A clean driving licence that you have had for a few years demonstrates that you are a safe driver.

Onagar, I completely get what you're saying, but I do think that brand new drivers are often way more cautious, have more up to date skills and are less likely to take risks.

With regards to professional drivers, a person who'd just passed their test would have no chance of ever getting a job if you were hiring - a vocational driving test is an awful lot harder than a standard car test - it is a qualification in itself now, renewable every 5 years. Plus if an employer has just spent an awful lot of money training a driver, then they would be satisfied that their driving skills are up to scratch.

Although it the person in the op may be a new driver, I would imagine (hope?) she drives with an awful lot of care and takes it very seriously.

great post maple murble. New drivers are not good drivers; they simply can't be, however technically good they are (and the test is hard, so in reality they are technically good. However nothing they have been taught/ tested on can replicate RL driving experiances)

children don't make a decison to get in that car; they have no choice. Adults can (and do) choose not to be passengers in the car of a new driver.

Dolce
I do think that brand new drivers are often way more cautious, have more up to date skills and are less likely to take risks
Why do insurance companies load them then?

With regards to professional drivers, a person who'd just passed their test would have no chance of ever getting a job if you were hiring - a vocational driving test is an awful lot harder than a standard car test - it is a qualification in itself now, renewable every 5 years. Plus if an employer has just spent an awful lot of money training a driver, then they would be satisfied that their driving skills are up to scratch.
The thing with PSV or LGV licences is that you have to drive immediately because otherwise you'd never gain experience... and the very nature of the vehicle means it will be for reward/hire.

Driving a car is different. You can gain experience driving yourself and others who choose this. The above guidelines I quoted regarding driving a minibuswith a normal licence, specify NOT for hire /reward and ask for a certain age/experience.

YANBU - my colleague has just passed her test at the 6th attempt - she is the scariest driver I have ever had the misfortune to be in the car with. The thought of her having my children in her car is scary. Agree that there should be a minimum mandatory period of having to prove that you a safe and competent driver before being allowed to di it as any part of your employment.

My lovely, lovely 17 year old babysitter passed her test first time with no minors possibly due to all the money I pay her going for lessons and now drives my children around on the odd occasion. She's a very safe driver and I trust her judgement 100%!! Never occurred to me not to ask her to drive them occasionally. YABU.

My mum took driving lessons with us four children in the back! The car didn't have any seatbelts either! (back in the early 70s). Probably couldn't do that nowdays though.

I would think though that a person driving passengers as part of a business should be more experienced than a person who only passed the test last week.

"I don't know where you got this birds, but for bus/coach drivers there is no such guideline. Once you've passed your test, you can drive, age of passengers makes no difference."

To get a PCV licence you must have held a ful drivers licence for two years. Arriva in the North West don't take drivers on to train unless they have held their licence for at least a year, the same applies for taxi drivers. The DVLA states this.

The statutory guidelines apply to those employed by Local Authorities, who will be ferrying other peoples children around.

A girl we know works part time as a nanny. One of her duties is to do the school run in her own car. She puts her charges and a couple of other kids in without seatbelts and lets some of them travel in the boot because they think it's fun. The parents have no idea she does this, and she doesn't think there's any reason not to as its not a long journey. She was genuinely astonished to be told its a) illegal b) dangerous and c) not insured. That hasn't stopped her doing it though....