to be getting alarmed at how Catholic the Catholic school is?

[ButterP]

I know, I know...

I really didn't want DD1 to go to a faith school. If other people want to bring up thier children within a faith, that is thier choice, but it is not ours. While we teach them to respect other faiths and belief systems, and of course we want them to have a good knowledge of the bible etc for cultural reasons, I really was not keen on sending her somewhere where she would be taught it as fact. But then I didn't want her at school full stop, so there you go.

However, we applied, on time, to the eight nearest schools (all the ones within a half hour bus ride) and none of them had a place. Eventually, just before the schools broke up for the holiday, we got a phonecall to say a place had come up at the outstanding-ofstead, right next to the ILs (who do a lot of childcare for us), academic reputation (which would fit with our family - not that we are all clever, but we are bookish) and loads of green space school where DH went to nursery. He didn't however go to the actual school, because it is Catholic, and his parents are not. In fact, nobody in our families is.

DH was very keen for her to go - he admires the work ethic that he says catholic schools have, he thinks she will get much better teaching in public speaking, the classics, latin and so on. I doubt that any primary state school does this, but the school does seem really nice, and it was pretty much the only option without her being sent to the other side of the city.

I asked on our visit about the catholic aspect, and the teacher reassured me that it is just two prayers a day. We prayed at my secular school, so that is fine, and I really don't mind her learning to cross herself etc. According to the admissions data, only about 40% of each year is Catholic anyway.

We decided that we would just not volunteer for churchy things (mainly because I wouldn't know what to do if required to do anything beyond bowing my head respectfully, and would feel a bit insulting towards the Catholics if I was to fake it, iyswim). With DD, we have gone for a "some people believe the bible is true, some people call God different things like Allah, some don't think he is real, and they are all fine" kind of approach.

Apart from that, we are fully behind the school, we go in to read, help with the fete, everything.

But this week, the homework was the usual reading book, sharing book, maths game, sound book, flashcards (sounds like a lot put like that!) and a letter to ask for the child to bring in something from their baptism. DD1 keeps crossing herself randomly, and there seems to be much more praying than I expected. The involved parents - PTA etc - all seem to know each other from church.

AIBU to be a bit, well, alarmed is the wrong word...wobbly...about all this? Does it carry on like this through the school? Should I be reading a book about Catholism to find out what on earth they do? I admit to knowing very little outside of TV.

[VoldemortsNipple]

Don't shoot me for not reading the whole thread. This is just a little note to the OP about my experience.

Most Catholics don't have a clue what to do in church either. With respect I mean at school masses. Some parents are plain rude and talk the whole way through. Bowing your head would be respectful enough.

When DD first started school, she loved crossing herself and singing hymns at the top top of her lungs on the bus. She joined in plenty of masses throughout her primary school. Dispite all this she is now a self proclaimed athiest.

[onagar]

religion and education are inseperable to some people

Yes that's why in future kids will only be allowed in tesco and the local library if they can prove their parents attended mass last week. It makes as much sense.

Worshipping gods in school is either important or it's not.

If religious people claim it make no real difference then what's wrong with having schools for all children and keeping the actual worship for church (just teaching about all religions).

If the religious people are claiming that it's absolutely vital that kids learn the truth about god in school and that it will affect them forever then what are they doing teaching Jewish/Muslim/Atheist/Hindu kids to be catholic or vice versa.

[onagar]

if the catholic schools werent there there wouldn't necessarily be a non faith school in its place, there'ld just be less in the pot!

Really? so you'd get a letter from the local authority saying "little jimmy will not be getting an education at all - tough!"

[LucaBrasi]

And did you think that being in Catholic school meant nothing at all?

I am a Catholic, Brought up a Catholic, left it for years and returned on my own terms. I don't do the anti homosexuality and other nonsense. I am very anti abortion but this applies only to myself . DH is not RC. We were married in RC church. Kids are in a RC school. I am firmly of the belive that they are having an education.

My children will make their choice when the time comes. Freely and after discussion with us. It will be interesting

Education means that children are told about the world. Secularist say, 'Ooo, some people believe this shit but really why would you?' Is that choice? And where I live, in Scotland, there are no secular schools, there are only non-denominational schools which are in fact Church of Scotland, and the kids are taken to the services there. Am I unreasonable to object to the Establishment Church?

If all the schools are to be secular then fair enough, but in the meantime, lay off the Catholic schools.

[onagar]

Secular is where you tell them the facts and let them make up their own mind. Religious is where you tell them your religion is true.

State funded Faith schools are where you tell other people's kids that your religion is true.

Catholic schools are no worse than Jewish schools, Hindu schools, CofE schools and Scientology schools.

[libelula]

My son goes to a Catholic school in Spain and is really happy there. We're not at all religious but couldn't get him into the secular state primary school. I had quite a few misgivings about him going there at first especially when he came home reciting prayers and telling me about Jesus. He's been there for three years now and i'm not nearly as worried about it as I was. There's a lot of communication between the school and families and they are always ready to help with any problems that arise.
I don't think going to a Catholic school will mean he will be drawn into the faith, in fact probably quite the opposite. They do seem to be more disciplined than other schools and expect them to do quite a lot of homework, but whilst he's happy there I won't move him to another school. He's made some really lovely friends and so have we.

[onagar]

libelula, I'm glad you're happy with that school, but if it doesn't encourage him to be catholic you have to wonder why the Catholics feel it would be outrageous to not have catholic schools.

They are sure it has a huge effect or they wouldn't make such a fuss.

[Gotarty]

"My children will make their choice when the time comes. Freely and after discussion with us. It will be interesting"

Very interesting - freely, with your dicussion, so your child will know that you disapprove, you are kidding yourself that your approach is liberal.

I grew up as a Catholic, I escaped! Many of my friends stayed, they couldn't cope wth the guilt of leaving...it was almost cult-like.

[cricketballs]

onagar - the catholic school I work in (I am not catholic) does not focus on Catholicism but more of the values that they believe in; everyone should think of others before themselves is a major one!

Before I started to work there I was concerned myself but I must admit that the ethos of the school is amazing and all students (which include many students of other faiths) respond to this ethos in a way I had not experienced before

[LucaBrasi]

ah I'm sure you feel fine then if you escaped

Ah anyway, I have been misunderstood. My kids can do what they want. The 'Disussion' bit was just that its what we do. Sorry. We talk a lot. We enjoy the debate. My boys listen to the news and question. This is life.

[foreverondiet]

OP I haven't read the whole thread but what you say sounds to me quite tame (ie learning about baptism), and it sounds like your DD is at a great school and is very happy there AND that you are not opposed to finding out a little more about catholicism. So whats the problem?

[mrszimmerman]

YABU, and you seem to know that you are. I'm surprised that you were offered a place when there are so many real Catholics and plenty of 'pretend' Catholics gagging for places in these state funded religious apartheid selective schools.

grrrrrrr (lapsed RC here, all the disadvantages of being a Catholic and none of the advantages....!! )

[mrszimmerman]

V sorry for using 'apartheid' in this context, wasn't thinking, just came out.
Meant to imply a vicious and intolerant regime sort of thing.

[onagar]

cricketballs I'm pleased to hear it. So no praying to god then and worshipping him.

[grumplestilskin]

"Really? so you'd get a letter from the local authority saying "little jimmy will not be getting an education at all - tough!"

errrr yes! there is such a shortage that some people where I live get NONE of their choices or get a school that's not that near to them, so, err yes that is what would happen! y'think theres the resources to replace all the church subsidised schools? you really think that?

[Pan]

tbh OP, you really don't know which side your bread is buttered. First class education with a strong lilt toward having a spritual life?

I am not even sure why you bothered putting it in AIBU. It should be in the "How lucky is my dd?" section.

[Pan]

just reading some of the above posts, the culture of Catholic schools can often depend on which order teaches there. My school was predominately Fransciscan, which can be quite different to Jesuit. For eg. But either way, you seem to have landed inadvertently on your feet, and should be v. grategul for it.

[Pan]

sorry, for got to add...FFS.

[onagar]

grumplestilskin don't be ridiculous. Of course if every faith school disappeared tonight there'd be a shortage tomorrow, but as soon as possible they would be replaced. In the meantime we'd have larger classes. We wouldn't just abandon 1000s of kids.

You probably won't be able to imagine this but think how you'd feel if the school your kids are in changed hands tomorrow and became Muslim. Imagine them coming home and saying that they can't pray to Jesus only Allah. That Catholics are not proper believers.

Try and imagine how pleased you'd be.

[grumplestilskin]

actually if I couldn't get a catholic school for them I'ld rather another religious school over a no faith school as a second choice. I think faith schools are better learning environments in general.

and if there isn't enough to go around NOW you think it'd be found if the subsidised schools needed to be fully funded? if so why aren't they spending all that extra cash now on the existing shitty run down overcrowded schools we have????

[cantspel]

muslims pray to the same God that catholics pray to. Allah is just a different word for God.

[Pan]

cantspel - it isn't that easy at all. It isn't just a different word. But that def. is another thread.

[cantspel]

Pan no it is not that simple and it is always the differences that divide us.

The basis of my catholic faith is of course the trinity which is denied by the islamic faith but then if i accept that the Pope is Gods representative on earth and his infallibility on church doctrine . And was it not Pope John Paul II who stated
We believe in the same God, the one and only God, the living God, the God who creates worlds and brings creatures to their perfection'

[cantspel]

whoops sorry i am going off on a tangent that is probably not what the op of this thread would have wanted. Ignore me

[onagar]

Faith schools contribute the land and in some cases part of the costs, but the main part of it is already paid for by tax payers. It would be hard to replace them all at once, but eventually we would and as I said we'd increase class sizes in the meantime. That wouldn't cost as much and we'd have all the money we were giving to the faith schools.

If we were really sensible we'd get the difference too by treating religions equally in the matter of taxes.

grumplestilskin I am glad to hear you are open minded enough to let your kids worship other gods. Especially as the Christian god forbids that. Imagine if next year your choice is between a Scientology school, Mormon, Hindu or Pagan.