to be shocked and sad - should I say something? What?

[throwawayforthisone]

We line up outside DS's nursery every day. The kids get their names out of a fabric thing with pockets for each letter (A B C etc), so all the A names are in A etc. The letters are lowercase.

One of his classmates, who has an older sibling in DS2's class, was looking for her name which begins with D. She reached towards D and her mum said "no, that's b". Older brother said "no mum that is d", and mum said "no it's b". Older brother pulled out the name and mum clearly recognised it and said "it's in the wrong place, what was that doing in b".

Now, she can clearly read as she recognised the name when she saw it and if she was illiterate she wouldn't've been so sure she was right, I think, in thinking the letter was wrong. But if she's (my guess), severely dyslexic or similar and KNOWS about it then she equally wouldn't've corrected her children (she'd know she got letters mixed up sometimes?), and might have been taught letter order at least, so she knew d was the 4th letter of the alphabet?

(DH is dyslexic and was taught similar strategies).

I felt like I wanted to say something, especially as her children were confused. But what and how not to sound condescending?

I can't believe that someone could've gotten to her mid-30s not knowing she has an issue with letters. Her older child (DS2's classmate), also has a name which she pronounces very differently to how it's spelt - with an o sound and it's spelt with an a - and I'm wondering if there was a mistake made there too, like (not the real name obviously), she meant to call him Jon and he's down as Jan by accident.

NO idea what to do. Don't want to upset her. Don't want her to be missing out on help she might need.

It's obvious! If you get a letter "b" and turn in over is becomes a letter "d". Think about it!!

What do you think talking to her would do? I don't really understand. You have no evidence to suggest that she isn't aware of her difficulties, or that she hasn't sought help in the past, or even that she really has a difficulty that functionally impairs her day to day life. She could have a neurodevelopmental disorder that is invisible like Specific Language Impairment (6% prevalence) or mild features of Autistic Spectrum Disorder. This really isn't anything to do with you.

Write out the conversation you think you might have. Can you make it sound reasonable and not condescending or interfering?

...No!! I det any money that the kib just hanbeb her the letter upsibe bown so the d looked like a b. All she had to bo was turn it over. It's so dlooby odvious!

...and this has to de the baftest dlooby thread I've ever reab

you'd be suprised how many people can't read and write, sadly even in this day and age. i have an aunt she must be about 45, she can't read and write, but she would be able to recognise words because they were so familiar, so for example she would know Tesco was Tesco because of the pattern of the letters, although she would find it easier when on the store iyswim.

She would also be able to recgonise the pattern of her children's name. So may well be he same with this mum.

Also my aunt would feel very uncomfortable if someone she didn't know asked her about it.

If this woman couldn't read or write I am absolutely certain that she wouldn't be this vocal and determined in view of other mothers. I think OP has just got her knickers in a twist and it was a stupid misunderstanding. I think "shocked and sad" with way OTT!

The only thing you could have said would have been there and then, and said something lighthearted to the mum - perhaps like, did you really think it was in the wrong pocket or where you just joking with your kids? But I'd have never said it, because as others have said she might have some medical condition etc etc.

Now that the moment has passed I think the only thing you can do is recount the story to the class teacher or maybe even the headteacher so that they are aware there might be an issue.

carpwidow don't really get your comments, it was a name on the paper not a cut out letter to turn the wrong way around.

I agree with the hangover theory. Has that effect on me.

Well I reckon the fabric thing had fallen off and someone had stuck it on back to front. OP said they were lower case letters - what's that teaching kids about capital letters for proper nouns?

and just humour me foreverondiet I'm enjoying myself in my own little world dottoms up!

carpwidow, please top up my glass :)

carp your postings look like really hard work!

Op the mother's error could have been made for any number of reasons, but I suspect she would be mortified if it was pointed out to her by another mother, no matter how well meaning. So many adults cannot read or write; it was easier for children to fall through gaps in the system years ago, and conditions impairing learning were not as well known or picked up on. She could have also been stressed/hungover; we've all humiliated ourselves in front of our confused children at some point

What you could do is have a very quiet chat with someone at the nursery, so that adult education can be better promoted locally. It's important this woman is not made to feel bad, but also remember that her children are in nursery, so the education of her children matters to her.

I still think that an adult that cannot read would not make such a public fuss. There has to be another explanation.

Argh I didn't want to mention but I think it could be relevent: could she be Gypsy? Alot of the adult Gypsies I know were not school educated, and struggle massively with literacy as a result. The Gypsies I know for the main part are so keen for their children to be educated and literate. Please do not ask her, as if she has not discussed her ethnicity and is Gypsy, she is likely to have reasons for keeping this private. Just a thought :)

Perhaps she's an alien from outer space. Many of the aliens I know have not been school educated. Don't ask her. She may aDBuct you!!

Is it possibly a cultural thing ? My daughter has a gaelic name which is spelt very differently from how it is pronounced. Some letters in the Irish alphabet for example have a different sound than in English or different sounds depending on which letter they are paired with iyswim. This is to compensate for fewer letters in their alphabet. Also as someone else said many languages have different sounds for letters to us or silent letters etc etc. Maybe thats where her apparent confusion comes from and her children would be aware of this but having been born here presumably wouldnt have same misunderstandings.

" i have an aunt she must be about 45, she can't read and write, but she would be able to recognise words because they were so familiar, so for example she would know Tesco was Tesco because of the pattern of the letters, although she would find it easier when on the store iyswim."

Not being sarky, genuiney interested - is that not reading? Recognising the shapes of the letters, and more easily in context? Or is that opposing the phonics scheme? Genuinely don't know this stuff

Yes stealth there are many strategies - sight recognition (for example for words like "why" and "sign" which you can't sound out phonetically); context and then phonic/letter pattern knowledge to help you sound out unknown words.

I'd be concerned that the nursery is using lowercase for names. tsk

mixing up lower case b & d is one of the most common forms of dyslexia. there are lots of people who do that, but can read other things fine. of course, those letters rarely stand alone, so people can still read pretty well - it shows more when they have to write, as they could randomly form either letter, regardless of which one it should be.

however, i would expect a very high % of people to know that the alphabet starts 'abc' and therefore know that d is after that.

not sure that you can do anything, though. if the children have no probs with reading, they'll just learn to ignore their mum

I still think she just didnt like her DCs telling her she was wrong and didnt want to back down.

Shocked and Sad is way OTT.

Sorry OP. You sound very nice an caring though.

In the nicest possible way, what the heck has it got to do with you? Mind your own business.