internet troll jailed - a bit ott?

[netherlee]

Troll jailed

OK this man is depraved and he deserved to be punished, but AIBU to think prison is a bit far? Then again, MN trolls take note. There are consequences if you cross the line.

Kladdaka can't speak absolutely though. AS differs so vastly, it's almost its own spectrum in the same way there is also an autism spectrum.

His behaviour is not acceptable and it that it might be caused/aggravated by his having Aspergers doesn't mean that it can be excused.

The best option would have been him getting support as a child but that chance is gone. The next best option to me would be an internet ban and some form of intensive residential course to help him see the boundaries he's crossed and deal with his drinking. Incarceration but not in prison IYSWIM. Even if this were available though there is a chance that he might not have accepted it.

Prison without rehabilitation is about punishment and possibly a deterrent against future wrongdoing. If Aspergers is preventing him from appreciating consequences then imprisonment won't have a deterrent effect. So all you'll get is a man released in 9 weeks or less with even less grasp of acceptable social interaction (after time in a prison environment) and possibly having lost his home. That's hardly going to improve his drinking or his future behaviour.

takethisone I hope that your poor friend has reported to the police as well as facebook.

Thank you filibear.

I admit I don't know much about AS, and probably what I think I do know is wrong, but I do know a lot about grief and the hurt that abuse like this can cause.

And for that reason I really do think that there comes a point where we have to say that if someone cannot or will not stop doing something so harmful, something that is causing maximum pain to so many people, then sooner or later the authorities have to step in and act.

There are guidelines within the law to assess if someone is able to stand trial and face prison, or be removed for more specialist help.

There will be lawyers acting for this man who can tear his conviction to shreds if those guidelines and procedures were not followed.

So he must have been found fit to stand accountable for his actions and that is good enough for me.

Kelly2000 excellent posts.

Of course these matters should be considered on a case by case basis rather than making blanket judgements about what all people with AS are supposed to be like. But from the details available it seems he had clear intent to cause pain, and that therefore he also understood the consequences of his actions (mental anguish and suffering), therefore he should have to face significant consequences himself. Having said that, there also needs to be an effort at rehabilitation. The Guardian report (linked in the OP) says he spent most of his time at home alone drinking. That isn't going to encourage anyone, regardless of their neurological state, to live a productive and happy life. He needs to be encouraged to find another way to live.

Given that Kladdkaka has given us an excellent example of the capabilities of some people with AS, can we also avoid the infantilising as a way of excusing this? Various posts have referred to this person as a 'boy' or 'young person'. He's 25. The assumption seems to be that having AS automatically makes someone a 'young' person and therefore vulnerable on that score. His condition may account for some of his behaviour but let's be clear on the age front: he's not a 'boy'.

This is what people with SN and mental health issues are up against.

If it was the first time then perhaps I'd be more likely to believe it was the AS.
Being as he's been warned before though..... not so much

This is what grieving families are up against.

I've just had a look at the comments on the aspie forum about this case and the consensus is disgust at what he did and anger at the playing of the AS card and the impact that will have on others with AS.

PeneloPee: I can tell my dd a million times a day not to do something. until I tell her what to do instead, and replace the undesired, unacceptable behaviour with something which is socially acceptable/desirable, then I am on a hiding to nothing.

as Maryz has pointed out: sometimes it is the attention that is needed/wanted, sometimes it is complete non-understanding of why somethign is wrong, and therefore not seeing a need to correct that behaviour.

but simply telling him that his previous actions were wrong, and not to do ti again, while not educating him on how to interact appropriately, or how to tell the diffrence between his nasty videos and the other nasty videos that otehr people make which go unpunished - that is not going to work (as, potentially, has been proven)

People can be divided up into groups according to sex, skin colour, ethnicity, religion, sexuality, IQ, SN, talents and skills, height, weight etc. Every group will contain some people who are just shitty. This man may well be a shit.

Wasn't he autistic? I would like to hear more information on how this may affect his behaviour before condemning him, whilst I fully condemn his actions.

''This man may well be a shit.''

Well. Since none us have seen the psychology/psychiatric reports or probation/SW reports no-one here can really say if that's true or not.

I think he should be banned from any social networking all together or have to give his PC to a company for investigaiton every four months/1 month.

ThePosie I think you might find it helpful to read the link and then the thread, maybe?

no i think it serves himself right

yes, Narky, it is possible.

as everyone on this thread has agreed. and there is also agreement that what he did was abhorrent, and there is no suggestion he should go uncorrected.

but, from knowledge I have on how people with spectrum disorders are treated, both in daily life and in dealings with the police - I find it highly unlikely that his As was taken into account in the way it shoudl have been. It is far more likely that just about eveyone who had dealings with him has thought the same way as the majority on this thread, namely:

As does not mean unkind
AS does not mean unintelligent
He must have understood what he was doing as he had done it beofre
My brother/child/I have AS and I do not do this, therefore he must just be a shit to do this.
and so on.

There is no precedent for how to deal with this. and there is almost certainly no policy for how to deal with this man, and others in similar situations, and how to even begin to start educating him. he will most likely have been failed throughout his life (otherwise why is he living alone, drinking most of the day and not understanding social norms to the degree that he is doign what he did?), and will continue to be failed.

while those around him clutch their skirts in horror at what "those people" can do, and the general public specualte that "AS is not an excuse, he knew what he was doing", all the hwile demonising and belittling a very debilitating (to some) disorder.

What I'm saying is that it's possible that his Aspergers was at least partially to blame for his lack of judgement (added to the alcohol) and that he may be a shit too. The two things are not mutually exclusive.

I wonder how his family feel? If he were my brother or son, I think I would be glad of the jail sentence and hope that it was a chance to get him sober and give him a chance of rehabilitation.

How else do you get through to someone who has ignored a caution and spends his days home alone drinking?

Apparently he was diagnosed with Aspergers at a young age. I haven't got time for a long post here but would like to say that I agree with MaryZ pretty well word for word throughout this thread.

no, you are right.

but I stand by my post - I doubt tha the extent to which he is disabled by his AS was not even thoguht about, let alone fully investigated. and I expect that there was a lot of "well, he is clearly a highly intelligent person - look at what he was able to do" type thoguhts. which may have resulted in a glossing over of his difficulties.

It can be extremely hard ot gauge how much a person is affected by ASD. and it can be equally hard to even begin to imagine living with that level of incomprehension, lack of empathy, misunderstanding of the way the world works. I have lived close by it all my life, and can still be floored by omehting my brother (or my dd, if it comes ot that) does or says which highlights jsut how little s/he understand what is actually going on, despite (my brother especially) being seemingly in full control, high funcitoning etc.

x-posts - my post was answering Narky's last post.

Whollyghost: I would only be glad if it came along with a proper rehab plan, with full education and social stories etc as MAry has already described.

I doubt it does.

I get that SilverFrog. I just think that it's a tricky situation. If he has that level of incomprehension, lack of empathy etc then it might be very difficult for him to see that he needs help or should change his behaviour.