AIBU to be pissed off with 'voluntary contributions' for school trips?

[Chundle]

dd came home today with school trip form. It costs £19. They won't be able to go if enough people don't pay this voluntary contribution but those that don't pay still get to go blah blah blah. I'm totally not a snob- I live in a council house so don't have a ton of money but I always pay for my kids to go on trips yet it seems to me there's always a group of parents standing there laughing there tits off that they didn't have to cough off!
When I was a kid if you didn't pay you stayed at school and had a fun time anyway that was that and what's wrong with that???
I had to miss out on school trips as a kid and wasn't overly bothered.
My tin hats on I'm ready for a bashing

IME it"s the lack of notice that"s the hardest thing.

The money is often required at short notice and if it"s between pay days,it can be hard to find that money because it hasn"t been budgeted for.

A bit more notice would solve a lot of problems....

Teacher- agree with the 'handful of coins' senario.
Those on lower incomes are most definately as likely to support as those on higher incomes.
A non- contribution can come from high/ low earner equally- it's about attitudes rather than affordability.

We never have letters saying the payment is voluntary. And I don't think the letter should state it that way even though it is, if you see what I mean.

Here's the trip, here's the cost.

mercibucket, talker says they don't charge at all for the curriculum based trips. It's for the frills type trips that children might be excluded. Even then she says if there's a problem the parents can choose to pay a contribution or by installments.

kittyfane I couldn't agree more, our local school is mostly middly class people who are financially doing okay... the reason for non payments is rarely about affordability, but more often than not a case of "why should we pay when we support the PTA and its a state funded school?"

Pointydog,

From Surrey County Council on school trips (it's not where I work, but it's the first i found with a quick google)

"All requests for voluntary contributions must make it clear that the contributions would be voluntary, and that if you do not contribute your child would not be treated any differently."

In other words, you cannot just state trip and cost, you have to state clearly that it is voluntary and that non-payment will not affect what happens to your child (ie the trip is either on for all children or off for all children, depending on whether the level of contributions makes it affordable)

It's also in the School Admissions Code
www.citizensadvice.org.uk/pdf_adding_up_excerpt_sacode.pdf

Why are trips not essential to education being run in school time anyway talker ?

I collect the payments (sorry, voluntary contributions) for our school trips and mostly the majority of parents do pay. We don't calculate how much to request based on the actual cost of the trip - for example, if the coach hire works out at £250 and entrance fee into the destination costs £100 for say 20 pupils we wouldn't divide these totals by 20 and charge £17.50 each. We would probably ask for £7.00 and the shortfall would be paid for out of school funds not from any budget.

We do ask for a donation of £1 per week school fund but I would estimate that only about 35% of parents pay this. Some pay more, some send 50p and one little girl brings me 10p every Monday (bless her - I think it's her own money) and it is all very much appreciated. School fund is also boosted by fundraisers like coffee afternoons or non-uniform days.

There have been one or two parents who don't pay (we don't chase them for the money - just have a private little chunter about them in the office) but usually the ones who actually can't afford it are the ones who will come in and say so - offering to pay later or to give a smaller amount. No child has ever been left out.

One of the past governments decided that just leaving kids at home because their parents couldn't/wouldn't pay was wrong. Also that schools shouldn't force people to pay for essential school trips. Therefore it is called a voluntary contribution, and if essential schools try to walk there and incur no costs.
My kids have all had free trips BTW. The Primary often have trips which they walk to, some do cost eg. trips to the Lido, but only the entry fee, lots of others are free.
The secondary even have trips to Sainsbury's, which they can walk to.

What gets me is the blatent disregard of the rules at some schools. My ds's school included. To actually ring someone up and say we wouldn't want your child to miss out as you haven't paid is clearly wrong. It wasn't even a trip. It was a visiting company.
It just seems that parents are treated like cash cows. And don't get me started on the Young Writers fiasco.

I am on benefits but always paid the voluntary contributions in full for my twins' school trips until they moved schools and the trips now all cost £90+. Can't afford it and they don't go - but they aren't the only ones of course.

I always cross out the bit that says 'voluntary' though. Poncey but I feel compelled to do it.

They used to get pestered for the money in front of the class every day in their old school until they coughed up, but sometimes I couldn't afford the full amount in one go (Once had to pay 2 x £45 for an overnighter and never got told I could pay any less and they'd still go!)

"They used to get pestered for the money in front of the class every day"

That kind of behaviour I don't like.

Trips are a luxury basically - and in this current climate schools shouldn't expect parents have 20 quid spare - and hassle the kids about it.

At DS's school the "paying for trips" waffle reads something along the lines of ..."cost of this trip is £x, however no child will be excluded though inability or unwillingness to pay. Parents who are unwilling/unable to pay must discuss this with a member of the senior mgt team"

I have mixed feelings about it. I can see this is embarressing for the "can't pay" people - although I guess enables the school to determine if they could pay some/pay in installments. It enables the "won't pay" people to state their reasons and have them heard. I imagine the idea is to weed out the "won't pay because everyone else will ha ha ha" people.

I'm back! Just read one post that said about parents who get free school meals paying half and I actually think that's a really good idea. That means everyone pays something without makin people hard up and without some people paying nothing. I guess all schools do it differen though.

DDs school is in a quite deprived area and a lot of her class mates are quite obviously struggling . It is a church school so there are also children who travel to attend whose parents are quite well off. It's an eclectic mix (we got in as it was the only school in the area with places left when we moved here)

DH and I can easily afford to pay for these trips so have always paid over whatever the contribution is as whilst we are earning good money it feels like the 'right' thing to do. We've never made a big thing about it, and never told anyone else.

Last year DH got 'persuaded' to join the PTA (they call it Friends of the School) and came home one evening furious that one of the other members had gone on a rant about how the school funds shouldn't be used to pay for those children who couldn't afford to go otherwise - it was all very Daily Mail benefits / shouldn't have had children nastiness . He politely (I wouldnt have been so polite) suggested to this woman that she was being unreasonable, but she absolutely would NOT back down.

As a result a number of members (incl DH) of the FOS left, many of whom were struggling financially and felt this woman was picking on them.

The FOS then seemed to be taken over by this woman's cronies...quite affluent SAHMs.

DD has gone back to school this week and has bought home a letter basically saying that 'contributions were voluntary, but if you couldn't pay then trips would be cancelled' - no mention of school funds being used any more.

I'm seeing the Head next week (about a different issue) and I'm going to ask him about it - If that bloody woman has got her own way...well grrr

my twins had a trip cancelled due to this,no-one had to pay so most didnt.
stupid if you ask me ethier charge or do it for free lots of disapointed kids :( last trip they classes had a list on the door of the clssroom with kids names and who had paid and who hadnt,talk about making kids feel bad,they kept on at my 2 saying i hadnt paid and i bloody had,told them time & time again i had paid,i paid it into the office and found the receipt and took it in,the office had mislaid it grrhhh but the teachers made my 2 feel so bad and kept coming home and having ago at me!

Swimming is meant to be an 'essential part of education' isn't it? (especially as I can't afford private lessons and can't take my own dc due to my epilepsy). Right now, I'm on benefits, will be working from next week - but will actually be £2 a week WORSE off when I go to work.

There is a request for voluntary payments - but also on the letter it states that the school cannot afford to take children that haven't paid. AND they want 10 lesson's worth in one go. Which is £50. Which is all well and good, but they take two year groups together, and this year, instead of taking Y3&4 together, and Y5&6 together like they've always done in the past, as Y5 is a 1-form entry, and Y3 is a 3-form entry - they are taking Y3&5 together. Which means I have got to pay £100 on Monday (just as I start a new job and have to go a month without money) or DS1 (Y5) and DS2 (Y3) can't go swimming.

There is no fund for parents on benefits or low income (affluent area, less than 30% on FSM). We just have to find it or our dc don't go. And have to be picked up from school for the duration of the swimming lesson.

It's the same for all trips too. I worked out that in the costs last school year, I spent £110 on DS1 and £90 on DS2. No effort to help from the school, and penalties for my dc if I don't find the money. Some weeks, I end up living on baked beans to pay for their school trips.

"Yeah maybe merci or maybe schools should fundraise for school trips instead of buying nintendo wiis but that's another thread "

Bit of a double-edged sword this though.

DDs girl guide unit wanted to go on a trip to a theme park and it was decided that they would do a fund raising event first towards the cost. I went to the fund raiser, paid my admittence, paid to have a go on various stalls, bought cakes etc. so all in all it cost me quite a few quid to support it. At least half of the parents didn't bother attending and so contributed nothing.

When the trip was organised the letter said "Oh we have raised £X towards the trip already that means that the cost per girl will be only £y"

However, I figured that adding what I had spent at the fund-raising event to what we then paid it would have been a damn sight cheaper for me if they had just split the cost in the first place.

I know people will say that some might not have been able to afford the full cost but the think that rankles is that I know a lot of the parents who didn't bother with the fundraiser and I am sure many of them are at least if not better off than us.

Just read one post that said about parents who get free school meals paying half and I actually think that's a really good idea. That means everyone pays something without makin people hard up and without some people paying nothing.

That's all well and good, but what about parents like Loudlass and others who are 'working poor'. I earn well under the £16k threshold for FSM even counting my Working Tax Credits, Child Benefit etc in the calculation, but because I work and get WTC, my DS isn't entitled to FSM. So in theory, someone could be 'earning' in benefits more than I earn by working, but because they don't get work or get WTC they only have to pay half while I pay the full amount. Great .

My children will bring home a letter today from school. It will state every event for the year for each year, it will also give costs for any trips. With enough notice parents can budget, we also have parent pay so you can pay online, for higher cost trips like residentials you can pay in instalments.

I love my childrens school.

I've had my eldest two leave primary school with a camping trip which cost £50 -£70 pounds. With my youngest they decided to do two trips, one in year five and one in year six.. To weigh me down even more he goes to year seven and has another activity type 3 days and then the end of year 7 theme park for kids who have done well during the year ( so why don't school pay for that then!)
I feel guilty if i say no but that's my issue. Also he is diabetic so i want him to gain independence by being away in these situations.
But he is turning out to be the most expensive of my children.

We had a letter asking for contributions towards taking the kids in y6 swimming for about 10 weeks. It said that children of parents who are unable OR UNWILLING to pay will still go, but if not enough people pay they won't take them at all. I really don't get it. I don't have a problem with people who can't pay, but why is it ok for some to just be 'unwilling to pay'? Makes me feel like a complete idiot for paying, like I have nothing better to spend my money on.

i am one of those parents.i could pay for school swimming lessons , but don't want to!

Rubyx - doing jobs around the house to encourage mum to pay for trips is good to encourage independence too

Also if you are really struggling, Christmas and Birthday money could be saved for that kind of thing - also encourages the realisation that money doesn't grow on trees. My DDs offered to pay for a few of their trips - not that I accepted, but I didn't need to at the time.