To think "Disgusted" of Tunbridge Wells is alive and kicking

[mumzy]

We went for a day out in Tunbridge Wells with dc and witnessed 3 seperate incidences of intolerance which quite took my breath away. Now on MN Tunbridge Wells is often a place where lots of families want to move to for the amazing town, countryside, schools etc, but the not so nice side is never mentioned.

Incidence 1: Went to a pub for lunch the only other people in the restaurant were 2 ladies one middle aged and the other elderly. As we approach the only table big enough for us all, which happened to be the one next to them, the elderly one starts a hacking cough we sit down anyway. Then a family arrives with a toddler whereby the elderly lady starts telling her friend about the dreadful behaviour of children where she lives in a very loud voice. Afterwards I discuss this wth dh and he said he also felt that she didn't want the children in the same room as her.

Incidence 2: Went to a hotel for afternoon tea following a walk, sat next to a family with their elderly grandfather who proceeds to tell them in a loud voice about his holidays abroad where he met some "negros".

Incidence 3: Had dinner in a bog standard restaurant in a village just outside TW. Getting late and just wanted dc fed and home. Restaurant is very slow and we have to ask for everything: menu, to place order, get bill. Whilst we were waiting forever for our food to arrive the dc play races in the garden as we had decided to sit there for dinner being easier outside than in with dc. After a while the waiter comes along and tell us to keep dc quiet as the manager was getting annoyed. Now there was noone else in the garden except us, the children weren;t shouting and all the other diners (middle aged elderly or with adult children) were inside the restaurant. On paying the bill we spoke to the manager about this and they denied all knowledge of having asked the waiter to say anything [sceptical]

AIBU to assume this sort of intolerance of children and casual racism is actually quite widespread in TW having encounterd 3 seperate incidences within a 8 hour period.

Yes, I can see a lot of Kent is in trouble financially - I moved from TW to Guildford to Canterbury (a few in between) but can honestly say out of the 3 of them East Kent is the roughest. And people think the South East of England is all snobby and affluent

Some towns around here are horrendous, but again, Canterbury is meant to be a nice part of East Kent, just as TW is a nicer part of West Kent. Guildford seems positively heavenly to me after living in both of these areas now, despite me thinking it was rougher than TW when I lived in Guildford, because it was closer to London and you got the busy rough weekend crowds hoarding to the shops and pubs as well as seemingly more suicides on the tracks . Just try out the various doctors surgeries in each area and I can guarantee you Surrey's healthcare for starters is fairly amazing, let alone the facilities for kids in parks, leisure centres, etc. But, IMO Guildford was the most racist place of all three. At my school we had a grand total of 2 Indians and 1 Cantonese. I remember walking around wondering where everyone was hiding when I first got there! People actually used blatantly stare at anyone with colour in the street.

Catgirl, where on earth do you live?? As I don't find T.Wells or Southborough 'rough' I guess you must live somewhere I could never afford to. What on earth you would have made of Wood Green in North London where I lived before I can't begin to imagine. Are you rather sheltered? Or rather lucky anyway? (sorry if I'm sounding rude now, I'm just rather astonished).

Hahahaha Blindcave, I'd love to know what she'd make of Wood Green too, that'd be rather interesting to hear!

Tunbridge Wells is one of the most affluent towns in the whole country. I am astonished that anyone would describe it as a dump.

I live right in the centre of Tunbridge wells and i love it! It's beautiful, so family friendly, clean, and always loads going on! Of course like with any town, there are bits that need a bit of a re-vamp, but on the whole, it's pretty lovely. I don't know where what part of town you were in, catgirl!

I think we're all wondering where catgirl lives

TW isn't one of the most affluent towns in the country - according to this survey

www.telegraph.co.uk/property/3360997/Britains-50-richest-towns.html

it isn't even in the top 50.

I have lived in a few cities and work in London a lot so I don't think I am sheltered - but you expect a bit of "urban grime" in a city.

TW is not the worst town by a huge margin and I appreciate compared to a lot of places it is fairly nice, but I am lucky enough to live somewhere that is just a lot prettier, with a lot lower crime, not the same choking traffic and less social problems. I think it is just what you are used to.

Where I live is gorgeous and I am lucky to live there but on the other hand it is not the most exicitng or culturally diverese place so I guess it is swings and round-a-bouts. TW is just not my cup of tea and due to living somewhere with much lower crime and social issues it isn't somewhere I personally want to bring up my children or re-locate to. Visiting once or twice a year to see the PILs is enough and when there I have to say I do love the countryside and have been to Bodium Castle etc which is really lovely.

I am not "outing" where I live on the internet but it is lovely and I do feel lucky to be here.

Oh dear, the elderly grandfather and the comments about old people's terminology being out- dated reminds me of my own dearly departed granny who once came into the room when I was about 15 when I was watching a video of Paul Simon's Graceland concerts, in which he has a fabulous South African backing band. "och" she exclaimed, "that's awfy good, the darkies have really got a good beat!" Once I had picked my jaw up off the floor I explained that it was not acceptable to use that term, I have no idea if she took it on board or not but I could not have let it slide because she was old and I was meant to look up to her. To be fair, she was being admiring, not derogatory, but even still....

As someone who spent much of my early career doing store opening strategies for UK retailers, TW is consistently in the top 20 in terms of disposable income and scores very highly in terms of the ABC1 demographic, although of course it's now all Mosaic classifications and more sophisticated, but essentially it is a highly affluent town, albeit with pockets of social deprivation. Arriving in the town via the A26 doesn't do it any favours. ( I can't link to the Telegraph article so can't comment on it, its criteria or its sources, or the towns which scored above TW)

I've lived in and around the South fir mist of my life - Cornwall, Devon, Somerset, Dorset (all fab), Surrey (ghastly!), and now West Kent, and if DH's job allowed him to be in the West Country, we'd move in a heartbeat. Until then, am v happy to live in TW, away from smug, idyll-dwellers

Sorry Catgirl - that article is about the most expensive towns to buy a house in which is why the top ones are mostly a bit closer to London than TW. It is not about economic well being.

Here is the info for TW from the Office of National Statistics. It comes out very well on the basis of both income and especially education and well on crime too.
www.neighbourhood.statistics.gov.uk/dissemination/NeighbourhoodSummary.doa=7&b=277014&c=TN1+1YB&g=460995&i=1001x1012x1013&j=309187&m=1&p=4&q=1&r=0&s=1311715388312&enc=1&tab=1&inWales=false

Am with Panic here, especially about Surrey

Glad I've managed to convince someone, even if I can't seem to check for typos before sending!

It still comes out a lot lower than where I live mumwith. I am not saying it is a sink estate, but I just don't like it and think it is shabby, congested, run down and has high crime compared to where I live.

I think it is a case of each to thier own though. My MIL loves whilst my BIL (who lives there) can't bear it and thinks it has gone down hill and become really rough in the lasy few years.

Villages are much nicer than towns IMO anyway. Some of the towns on that list I'd avoid personally, but then again my dad lives in a lovely village just outside Sevenoaks, which seems to be up there with the Gods .

I wonder if the OP went to Chilham/Westerham though they would have encountered much of the same and would be similarly disgusted.

What are these high incidences of crime you keep talking about catgirl? I've lived in TW area for 20 plus years and tbh it's pretty innocuous and a LOT less scary than where I grew up in New Zealand.

I would agree that the some parts of the town centre could do with pulling down (the old cinema springs to mind because that is really dire) but it's not a hotbed of criminal activity. I lived right in the centre of town for years and the most you got was a bit of lairy behaviour late at night on a weekend.

I didn't say there were high incidences of crime, but they are still a lot higher than where I live. I agree with Orbinator that of course villages are always nicer than towns.

Family may have not corrected the elderly man because they agree with him.

Or it could have been my FIL you heard! He speaks very loudly - partly because he has poor hearing. If anyone tries to correct him he argues back and says much worse, e.g. I know negros was used when you were younger, but nowdays black is thought to be more polite. Him - I don't care what is thought to be polite now, I have always called them negros in polite company, and I will continue to call them negros. When I was young nobody battled an eye lid if you called them niggers etc etc

Although I am always embarassed not to challenge him in public, believe me the alternative is much much worse.

I have had a look on line and TW has 200% more robberies, 200% more burglaries, 100% more vehicle thefts, 133% more thefts from vehicles as where I live.

I guess the trade off is that we have more than double the % of retirees so the brand of racism described in the OP in no doubt pretty prevelant and it is not the most happening place in the country :)

And the women in incident 1 may have been perfectly reasonable if tactless. I have a hacking cough at times. I have also talked maybe too loudly about awful ill behaved children e.g. my SB and later wondered if the young family close to me were thinking I was referring to them? I was not. But I admit I can be tactless at times.

Maybe in 3 the waiter was fed up of the noise your children were making?

The % are meaningless unless you quote the numbers of the crimes though. Obviously Catgirl you live in an Utopian gated community where anyone less than perfect may not go. I believe TW has the lowest crime figures in Kent - I follow the local police on Twitter and it's a rare day there is actually a crime committed - just lots of community facing stuff and the odd drugs arrest.

Agree with Panic that the percentages don't mean anything on their own (especially as we don't what you are comparing against; could be a hamlet with just Catgirl's house and her mum's next door). The crime rate in TW is very low. The only thing I agree with is it does get very congested especially at rush hour but other than that is very nice.

You say no one else was in the garden.Perhaps your DC charging up and down were stopping other diners from using the garden?

Absolutely agree that the congestion is v bad - doesn't help that the Council allowed John Lewis at Home and M&S (et al) to open new stores on an already gridlocked out of town estate, or that the dualling of the A21 got pulled after the election.

I can't imagine that Catgirl is comparing like with like though. My parents live in a hamlet in Somerset where the crime figures would be 0% for every category. To be a real comparison we'd need to know whether she's living in the Outer Hebrides in a crofters' cottage, or somewhere like Claygate which is lovely (if you like WAGs), but hardly comparable to a town!

Where I live is a bit smaller than TW (with 10,000 less households) so I agree they are not really comparable. It is just not my cup of tea and it is rougher than where I live, but of course nicer than a great many places. I just don't like it much and have seen a lot nicer places so I don't get the fuss about it. It doesn't strike me as particularly affluent, although it is obvioulsy not poor.

And sadly where I live has started to get the odd footballer moving in which has lowered the tone terribly

Oh and the % figures I quoted were per 1,000 population - not in the community as a whole so they were directly comparable.