teachers should not tell children to shut up or call them idiots as that is rude

[jugofwildflowers]

At home, words like 'shut up' or 'idiot' or 'stupid' are not allowed as it is rude, my dc know this and so were shocked to hear members of staff including the Head at their primary school using these words at school.

I wrote to the school and told them I thought it was unacceptable. AIBU?

By the way, I'm on hols now just in case anyone thinks I'm mucking abaaht in the classroom!

I totally agree yanbu with regards to my primaary schoolage DD, yet also have to say with regards to my 15 yr old DS, agree with Maryz - could imagine him responding well to that.

Worked a long time in very 'challenging' classes and have never heard any teacher speak like that. IME kids pick you up on everything you say, so we are all very careful what language we use
(What we say when the students aren't there is something completely different

Oh I agree corlan - that's what staffrooms are for!!

I paid a lot of money for my children to be talked to like this. If they are out of order I want them sorted out, and the wonderful headmaster of my sons old prep school spoke loudly and clearly. I'm sure that he called both of them idiots at some point and certainly told them to shut up, as a result of this no nonsense approach they have developed self discipline and are resilient individuals. A namby pamby offend no one approach, which seems to be compulsory in state schools just creates problems.

I wonder what the reaction be is a woman came on and said her husband had called her these things? I would never accept a teacher to have so little self control!

Why on earth should I spend my time telling my son that saying these things to people is wrong and will hurt their feelings when teachers are just going around spouting it whenever they want? THAT would be stupid and idiotic.

You've never called your partner an idiot or been called an idiot in return?... Wow... It's hardly verbal abuse, is it?

My husband called me a twat this morning... To be fair I was being one.

If you are asking me Cogito, I wouldn't say I'd never called my DH an idiot or stupid but if I have ever done it it would have been a very rare event indeed and would have been tongue-in-cheek joking.
And yes, I have been called stupid/idiot in the dim and distant past - it's humiliating. Which is why I prefernot to do that to others.

As others have said it depends on context. probably best avoided with younger kids but certainly as they get older and definitely with secondary school kids I wouldn't have a problem with them being told to shut up (once again context will be vital.).
Having said that I have told primary school age kids I coach (probably 10+) to shut up if they are being particularly disruptive. However once again it's in context. I'm in a less formal role so it can be a quite matey type of chat you have especially with the older boys I coach, but equally they will try and get away with more because you're not really their teacher etc. so sometimes a bit of a shock/letting them know they're over-stepping the mark is necessary.

"I posted this before - ds's favourite teacher regularly calls him a gobshite grin. He is shock. This teacher also makes him stand in corners regularly. And he once lost his temper with the class and told them to shut the fuck up (though I accept that may be a step too far grin; ds was very impressed and they all quietened down immediately, apparently)."
Agree with that. I had a few teachers who treated us in a similar way especially as we progressed through secondary school and they were quite respected. It wasn't that they were bullying or swearing for the sake of it etc. but you did feel slightly more treated like an adult and then when they'd give you an exasperated look and call you a gobshite or mutter "oh ffs." as they turned around it was both a bit comical but also let you knwo that you were acting the twat and you were doing so in a manner that should be opbvious even to yourself.

So presumably if a teacher mutters "ffs" or calls a pupil an unfortunate name the teacher will be quite unfazed should the pupil then turn round and reciprocate?
Or allow pupils to say these things to each other?

@Slamotrutta.... Teachers are in a position of authority and can say certain things that pupils cannot say back or say to each other. Even as mild an instruction as 'sit down quietly and get your books out' would not be an appropriate thing for a child to say to a teacher, would it?

In the OP's tale the headteacher allegedly used the words 'shut up', 'idiot' and 'stupid'.... bit brusque perhaps, but there was no swearing or name-calling involved. Think the OP is frankly making a big fuss over nothing.

Don't like it at ALL but seems to be common place in ds's school sadly.

YANBU.
To me that's a sign that they've lost control.

YANBU - I'd be shocked if I thought the teachers used those words and the others here. gobshite really?

I'd be in deep, deep shit if I told a student to STFU.

'Shut up' I think is fine. Quicker & less poncey than 'Would you please stop talking', so more likely to be heeded promptly.

I don't like 'idiot' or 'stupid' - demeaning, hurtful words that create negative teacher/pupil relationships.

That said, with a student you know well & have a good relationship with, who has just done/said something daft, you can often get away with telling them that they're a blithering buffoon with the world's first single-molecule brain. But only in banter. If you mean it, I don't think you should be saying it...

And how do we know that this incident wasn't banter or delivered in a jokey fashion? The OP wasn't there and is relying on second-hand testimony from that most reliable of witnesses... little kids.

Weeeelll Cogito - if the kid I was bantering with reacted with shock or took offence, that'd tell me quite clearly that I'd misjudged the situation.

But yes, it's not always necessarily quite as the child says. Which is exactly why OP is NBU to write to the school making them aware of her concern. They can't address it if they don't know about it.

Even if addressing it means telling OP that her dc has misinterpreted or misreported what was said...

I think some of us are just going to have to agree to disagree about this.
I don't use this sort of terminology in my classroom - and I have had some pretty challenging pupils. I've also established pretty good classroom relationships with most of these pupils too by treating them fairly and trying to lead by example.

millyrainbow pretty much wrote my post for me- thanks!

Would also add that part of a teacher's job is to model the behaviour we expect from pupils as well as the skills. And I wouldn't be happy with a child using that language to another child.

Spot on pozzled.

Meant to add - teenagers are very quick to spot any perceived "unfairness" so if a teacher told a pupil they were an idiot (or insert other inappropriate phrase) etc. then tried to deter pupils from doing that to their peers they wouldn't have a leg to stand on.
Most secondary classes have a barrack room lawyer pupil who will be more than willing to helpfully point out a flaw in that sort of logic.

Salmo, I was brought up with the mantra "do as I say, not as I do".. it worked for me and most of my peers.. children are children, not mini-adults, and it would do quite a few of them good to remember this.