to think that you can either have a clean, tidy and uncluttered house OR happy children but not both?

[GreenTeapot]

Or can you manage both? How do you do it?

I'm much encouraged to see on this thread that the people who have tidy homes + kids either have mahoosive homes with spare playrooms, older kids than mine or just one child.

MoreBeta -

Meredith, in your position you're doing well if you're all dressed, fed and alive.

I live in a v tidy and clean house. My Dp is OCD about cleanliness and tidying so it keeps him happy. What helps us is:
We have a largish house with lots of storage
Our dining room is only used formally and spare double is just for guests
Making cleaning fun
Dp does more than his fair share (all washing/ ironing/ detail cleaning)
I Hoover daily and ensure that house is fine before he comes home
We have a massive toy chest / bedding box in the lounge where most toys fit
Messy play in the kitchen or outside
Dd puts her toys away before bed time
Declutter regularly
All meals at the table only snacks in the lounge

May sound ott but dd is very happy and we often host play group when it's cancelled.

Speedy - after more than 25 years with DW it still feels wrong going in her handbag for something.

I have special big 'poachers' pockets in my coat in which to keep my emergency supplies so I can pull them out like a magician from nowhere to disinfect any offending surfaces at a moments notice.

I am a virgo and my house is usually tidy. I am always tidying. It's not fably clean though.

I do a brief clean of the loos every day. I clean the floor round the loos whenever I think "Christ! What's that SMELL?" - so, approx every 2 days. I sweep the crumbs off the hard floors twice a day but hoover about once a week and dust when I can write my name on things. (We don't have any pets.) I clean the bath when there is a ring and clean sinks when we have visitors. But I tidy twice a day. The state of the DCs bedrooms causes me, well, let's just call it "considerable discomfort" and leave it at that shall we.

I breathe a sigh of relief on Monday mornings when I can tidy the house and get it back to how I like it after the four of them have done their best to live in it trash it all weekend.

I usually have tissues in my handbag, but then, I usually have a permanent runny nose.

I also have plasters and antihistamine cream in my handbag but that is because I have to carry a medical kit for a DC, and they are in that.

I am a Gemini. The Jekyll and Hide of good housekeeping. My floors are spotless and you could eat your dinner off the toilet seat, but don't look behind the radiators or expect to open the Cupboard of Doom without being attacked by falling clutter...

Ha ha - crazycatlady, I'm like that! - scrupulously clean kitchen and bathrooms but my idea of tidying is to chuck everything in a large black bin liner and bung in the cupboard to "sort later".

There is still a half unpacked suitcase on my bedroom floor from a short stay in York over half term!

I agree with MrsVidic

Also, encouraging tidiness - although I feel as if I am following DS around sometimes!

Actually - on the original post - I lived in a very messy house when I grew up. I hated it..... One of the reasons I am so tidy now!

I think it depends on the age of the children, the size of the house and the tidiness of both partners.
For me having a very tidy home would involve nagging everyone else constantly and having lots of arguments.
I absolutely struggle because of the size of our flat, we don't have much storage space and DP (works from home) has a completely different and pretty, non-negotiable idea of how much stuff should/can be kept and where it is acceptable to keep it.
Our house is pretty full of stuff, but it is clean in the bits that matter.
I'm not keen on the minimal look for a home, but I didn't really want it to be quite so diametrically opposed to minimal.
Never mind, nothing that going out and shutting the door won't improve.

Yes you can. Don't be lazy!

I could reply - dont be so dull and one dimensional

Tidyness isn't about LAZY!
It is about having two jobs, three dogs and always finding something more interesting to do.
Housework is really boring

MoreBeta - perhaps you could teach the moral rules of respecting handbags to my 1 yo DD?

Haha - sounds like a rhetorical question to me! You know the jokes (or even real life anecdotes - reportedly) about how burglars (or visitors) come into the home and think it's already been burgled? Well, as long as the home isn't as untidy as that, I think it's ok. Doesn't need to look like a page from House and Garden.
As for how tidy one keeps the house, as long as the kids are being taught to practise putting their own things away without being shouted at or terrorised to do it, I think that's fine. That said, I have seen a lot of friends' bachelor pads look worse than homes with kids having messy fun.
There is one no-no I absolutely stick to: no laundry (clean or not clean) lying about on floors or sofas when visitors arrive (unless it's unannounced visitors) - if you can afford a tv, you can afford a laundry basket.

My dh learnt this the hard way after having leave from work and spending most of it following the kids around picking up their toys and getting very stressed. I have a tidy up in the evening while the kids and dh are in the pool so we can have a nice relaxing evening away from brightly coloured, singing and dancing toys. So If you come round in the evening, you wouldnt know we had kids as all toys are packed away, hidden in draws, under tables, in toy boxes. Come round during the day and you'd be lucky to see the carpet through the toys!

I honostly think if you have a tidy, toy free home it looks like children dont live there. My husband is a clean freak and I smile to myself when he tidies up and my son come behind him and messes everything up. Tidy up when they go to bed and dont worry during the day. Children are messy and I live with it :)

I once went into my old neighbour's house for the first time (unexpectedly) at about 9.00am on a school day. Given that she was not expecting visitors I swear it was the most eerily disconcerting thing ever. It was spookily tidy.

She'd got three primary school aged kids up and out, and had had no time to do anything since she walked back in the door. Yet there was not so much as a buttery knife or a used mug in the sink, no keys or handbag slung on worktop, no cereal boxes on the table, not one single coat or shoe, book, hairbrush, or personal belonging of any sort was in evidence anywhere and I even went up the stairs and onto the landing. No towels hastily discarded, no stray socks, nothing. Nada. Weird.

GerOrf, you said "All the 'patronising shite' on here is in response to the VERY condescending kack in the OP which effectively states 'if you have a tidy house your children won't be as happy as that of an untidy person'".

I think that's pretty unfair. In the OP I asked if you could manage to have both, and how. I don't believe that I at any point suggested that tidy houses contained miserable children. I just inferred that I couldn't keep my DC happy while tidying and cleaning constantly. No generalisations.

Bssh - If you are still reading this, I would love to know how you only need to do three loads of washing a week. My family is the same size as yours and I'm forever washing!

On the clean/mess scale, I'd say my house was pretty clean and tidy but not immaculate. I give it a good going over once a week and tidy/ spot clean as I go along in the week.

Green, this is how you do it. You make everyone responsible for the things they can do.....ie children make their own beds and pick up their own toys (this may be a week/fortnight of reminding before it becomes a habit) You ensure you leave time for tidying after playing and before bed. You put things away straight away, including dry and ironed clothes. After any meal dcs clear the table and you instantly wash up/pack dishwasher. When dcs are old enough to earn pocket money you can begin handing out tasks.

No need to leave house with a dirty kitchen, make plans to have breakfast in time to clean up......you may have to get up 15 minutes earlier.

Some people spend the equivalent of a working week just doing housework. If I had nothing else to do, my house would probably be tidier. Some people LOVE cleaning. I love it when I have cleaned and tidied the house. It lasts for about 5 minutes, then back to scratch again.