To think that if there was low cost childcare in the UK then Cameron wouldn't need to whine about benefit scroungers?

[ChristinedePizan]

We are on holiday in France at the moment and I'm really impressed by the state's provision for childcare. Pre-school is free from the age of 3 and there is wraparound childcare either side of school from 7.30am - 6.30pm. At a cost of £1 an hour. If we had that in the UK it would make it worthwhile to go to work even if you were low paid. Whereas if you're paying the school £5/hour then if you're earning NMW it's really not worth it.

there is low cost childcare

its called being a mother

No, K999 - that's the whole point. It should be a universal benefit, like school is. Does anyone have an issue with the children of wealthy people going to state schools? Or using the NHS? It is a change in mindset that is needed. All children should have the right to decent quality affordable childcare.

Memditrina - I was referring to an article in the DM the other day when DC talked about feckless benefit scroungers. I can't be arsed to google it - I'm sure you're quite capable.

oohyouareawful - gosh - have you saved enough to look after your children without an income and without claiming any benefits? You should write a thriftiness book

Thank you for your vote of confidence in me.

I do not read DM, so was not aware of it. It doesn't seem to be reported elsewhere.

^somethingwitty82 Tue 14-Jun-11 17:58:14
Nomore money needed!, small reduction made in benefitsthat can be made up be joiing in the community care scheme, all in receipt of benefits putting in a few hours each month to care for lil ones and the old folks^

fabulous idea... and tell me who would be the ones who would care for my children? I am paid the princely sum of 32p an hour to be their full time (more like 24/7) carer?

Not all on benefits have time on their hands or are capable of working.

Nope - the vote of confidence was displaced!

I searched "Daily Mail Cameron benefits scrounger 2011" - zilch.

I don't read it either. It was a report of a speech he made so assumed it'd been reported more widely. As I said, I'm not in the UK at the moment.

I don't understand though. If someone is very wealthy but doesn't want to work, yet it's a universal benefit, why do they need it?? Am I being thick here?

K999 - we have to have a form completed and stamped by our employers. You are only able to access afterschool care if both parents work.

I know, I claim childcare vouchers and for that you have to work. This doesn't mean it's a universal benefit though?? I will lose family allowance soon. This is classed as a universal benefit, but the govt have deemed that this should be scrapped if you can afford to do without it??

Well I guess free Kindergarten from 2.5 is universal. It has about a 95% take up rate.

Feckless/scrounger - pretty much the same thing

A universal benefit just means it isn't means tested. Like porto says, if you can prove you have a job, you can access the childcare. It's easy and cheap to administer. Other countries manage to do it perfectly well

moodykat - We both work 70 hours between us and get no other benfits any tax credits I get go on childcare. If you are getting nothing or little you arent on a low wage. For 70 hours work between us we get 21k household income. Nursery here is 30 pound so thats a good thing.

But who administers the universal benefit? The employers? When someone leaves employment?

Christiane - he didn't say "feckless" that is copy from the journalist.

It is not fair to criticise someone for something they have not done (criticise DM journos as much as you like!). It is worth noting how very, very similar the statements on this issue are with those made by Miliband (eg what M said about Council/HA prioritisation and reducing numbers of longterm claimants).

Actually I see it as a good thing that all three major parties have one voice on this. But at worst we can all now know that whoever we vote for, this is what we get.

oh love the idea of low cost child care, oh hang on a second, will it still be low cost if child is severely disabled~?

Shoesy, I doubt that very much.

Glitterknickaz -
Other Kinderklub members, you would earn childminder credits. Worked well in East Germany, 'back in the day'

I don't really care what his exact words are meditrina and that's not really the point is it? Would cheaper childcare be a good idea? Yes/No?

shoese - probably not :( but that doesn't mean it's a crap idea.

and if those kinderklub members didn't have any specialist knowledge of my kids' needs and something happened to my children as a result of being cared for by untrained people?

Cheaper doesn't always necessary mean better or fit for purpose. Or practical.

I'm glad we seem to have established that the title should have said "...then the DM wouldn't need to whine about feckless benefit scroungers". (DC needs to be held to account for his own words and actions, not some other random copy).

And I have no problem at all with the underlying question!

I think I am tending to agree with Bubblecoral's post at Tue 14-Jun-11 17:33:55 - the period when you require childcare is a small part of the likely expected working life. The costs of the scheme (despite some possible offsetting measures noted above) is likely to be high; it is likely to be bureaucratic, hostile to individual practitioners (CMs) and might amount to a "stealth" nationalisation of childhood.

The actual costs of life in UK (not just childcare, also housing) is badly out of kilter with likely household income (a consequence of WTC/CTC?). I think more is needed than some state-funded alterations to relative cost of just one item.

Even worse when your child has additional needs. Childcare by necessity has to have less children when they have one with additional needs, therefore it costs double.

The problem is not the lack of "cheap" childcare: the problem is the lack of inexpensive 24hr wraparound childcare; the majority of jobs in the UK being shift work.

It is no good there being wraparound (the school hours) childcare if you have to START work at 5/6/7 in the morning, 4/5/6 in the evening or finishing 10/11/12 at night or 6/7 in the morning for example.

There are little payable (non-family) options available.

ooyouareawful - interesting. How are said mothers supposed to provide for the children they so nobly stay at home to care for?

Unless you're assuming that all households are two parent ones which is pretty laughable.