To wonder why being un-pc is seen as something to celebrate?

[magicmummy1]

yes, yes, we've all heard the stories about pc gorn mad, but we don't usually describe someone as "un-pc" just because they talk about Christmas or because they sing bah bah black sheep.

The people who are usually described by this term tend to be those who have made remarks that others consider to be offensive. Am I alone in wondering why a propensity to upset and offend people is considered by some to be such a virtue? Please enlighten me! What is so great about being "un-pc"?

(and yes, this is a thread about a thread, in case anyone is wondering)

i don't know about pc - i prefer the term 'mindfulness' to describe considerate behaviour because thats what it is - considerate behaviour.

wheni was doing my sw training i went to a workshop about being pc though it was called something wankier (values in practice i think). in practice i am the most sensitive and thoughtful person in terms of how i address people/language i use and throroughly consider what is and isn't appropriate toward different service users. however we had to do and exercise where we demonstrated how we keep professional diantacnes from service users. i volunteered and said 'well it goes like this; if my su's ask me what i did at the weekend i keep my answers to appropriate topics such as going for a meal, seeing a friends, going to visit my mum. from these answers nothing can lead on to talking about getting drunk/other age inappropriate behaviours or reveal too personal information BUT it still gives something of yourself and makes the su feel that you are a human being' the workshop leader did a proper cats bu, face and then bollocked me. she said '(gasp) what if one of your su was in care, and you said you went to see your mum - they cant see their mum!!' cue lots of handwringing. i might have lost my rag a bit then and said 'right ok, do you stop kids in care watching television and going to school because theres eveidence of other people seeing their families EVERYWHERE!' surely kids in care just want someone to trest them normally and be nice to them and talk about normal things?

that was a bit long winded but what i mean is that in some industries the pc idea has gone so far that it gets in the way or normal relationship dynamics.

on the whole though of course i think pc is just another term for 'polite' and theres nothing wrong with that!

I once saw PC described as politeness & courtesy. If people find your language offensive, it doesn't take much to exercise a little self-censorship. It's simply treating others with respect.

Conversely, refusing to moderate your language because it's 'PC gorn mad, innit?' is just plain rude.

I agree with Onagar. As I said on the infamous 'Spastic' thread the other day it's all about intent. In the world of political correctness the goalposts are constantly being moved, and some people would get hung drawn and quartered for using terms which are outdated, when in fact their intentions were never malevolent, and their opinions were never bigotted. Yet other more wiley people can have quite sinister opinions, but so long as they are clever and up to date enough to use the right language and raise no eyebrows they can go below the radar with really quite un-PC ideas.

I think some people like being 'un-pc' because they see themselves as being edgy. Some people like being a little bit racist, homophobic or whatever and don't see anything wrong with it.

Others, because their privilege re: other groups of people have been eroded. The world is changing and they quite liked it the way it was. I think most people who want to turn society back to the 1950's like it because there were fewer non-whites, women generally 'knew their place' and gays had the good taste to hide.

Also want to add, there is a huge difference between those who would defend the right to exercise prejudice, and to use offensive derogatory labels and stereotypes to define minority groups, and those who would say 'PC gorn mad - a step too far' at things like banning Christmas festivities in place of 'Winterval' in local authorities where there is a high number of muslims, for fear of causing offence, or banning the wearing of a crucifix for one employee whilst allowing a hijab or a turban (or whatever) for another.

Sometimes, PC does indeed go a bit mad. But let's not allow these think-tank types whose jobs depend on re-inventing the wheel to confuse the real issues. Prejudice, bigotry and rigid intolerance is always wrong.

My dad's colleague was sent on an equality course by his employers for being homophobic.

He is happily married to his husband and had jokingly referred to him as 'the wife'.

My dad was also sent on a course for complementing a colleagues new hair do.

I find that sort of ott pc-Ness as offensive as bigotry.

I was going to say yabu based on your title, but having read your op yanbu. There is a difference between Prince Phillips gaffs which I don't think are offensive and the likes of Nick Griffin and Bernard Manning who I think are

Kaj32 that's the sort of pc I hate, that you have to constantly watch what you say in case it could be construed as being offensive. Those examples were not offensive but pc police deemed them to be in kaj examples

What is 'PC' is highly subjective and shifts with the times. It takes a huge amount of effort to remember what terminology is offensive from day to day and to whom. I remember when 'coloured' was a politely acceptable term for black people and the day I was pulled up short and told 'coloured' was now offensive and the right word was 'black'... only to be corrected by someone else that they found 'black' offensive and that they preferred 'African English'. So I can understand why some people choose to pre-warn that they are 'not PC'... it's a minefield.

To wonder why being un-pc is seen as something to celebrate?

Possibly because our esteemed jobsworths leaders have decreed that we should celebrate diversity?

Bollocks was he sent on a course for complimenting a hair-do, sorry.

I did type a similar response to that Irksome (then deleted it). -not the full facts kaj, I fear.

And I don't know any schools that still have blackboards anyway

Maybe not, but you'll find plenty of pubs and restaurants that have them, to name just one example.

a huge amount of effort....
It helps that I am a goddam genius and so find it very easy to remember not to call people coloured, wogs, Orientals, spacks, mongs, queers or Pakis, I know - but I do appreciate that not everyone is mentally capable of such amazing feats of memory and comprehension and as such must be forgiven for the odd lapse into racism. Their brains aren't up to it, poor loves.

at irksome.

The goalposts are continually moved, though. When I was growing up, it was grossly insulting to refer to someone as black. We were told to say 'coloured'.

Same with health issues, mental and otherwise. Mark my words, it won't be long before 'special needs' is binned as being offensive and some other phrase will be devised.

The fact is that there will always be people who can turn anything into an insult. IMO it's a pity to pander to them.

Well the equalities person where he works asked he my dad would say the same thing to his male colleague and he replied no, he was bald and might be offended! Que lots off laughter in the office and the crazy equalities bod decided my dad needed some retraining.

And it was the lady my dad complemented who told me the story at my dad's birthday party in a ha ha how funny is your dad kind of way.

Why is it so hard to believe some people are arseholes who take offence at the slightest thing?

Still bollocks, sorry

Yeah, I agree. I don't believe the hair do story for a bloody second.

I agree with all those who say PC is just a (derogatory) term for attempting not to offend and hurt people with what you say.

I'd like someone to give us a REAL example of PC having gone mad. By real, I don't mean some winterval or bah bah rainbow sheep bollocks.

Slacksally - you know that's just a cue for loads of made-up stories about pc gorn mad....

Get your bingo cards out everyone!

slacksally - mine was a real example! but i have more. my mate on my sw course failed one of her portfolios for using the phrase 'singing from the same hymm sheet' yes really!!!

I don't know about white middle classed men being the most oppressed, but I would say they are acceptedly insulted in ways that other people can no longer be because for some reason they supposedly deserve it, even if they have done nothing whatsoever wrong. Because in history their ancestors did.

People get annoyed about PC because it bans words in ways that make no sense. If you can't say black board, why are you encouraged to divide people into black and white categories? People get annoyed when they can't see the point of something. If black is a bad thing because of black magic and white magic associations, evil, good, etc, why on earth is it better to call someone black rather than coloured which it always used to be? How is coloured derogatory?

People don't like being afraid to use words incase they suddenly sprout a new meaning when someone decides that after years of using them, they have to mean something different. Handicapped. What is better about disabled? really?

I would say a lot of people's unhappiness with PC is that it feels like it's gone too far the other way and things that would never in a month of sundays upset a minority, are assumed to be inappropriate, often not by people within that minority. Christmas. Lots of people aren't amused at being told it has to be Xmas.

Often people are proud of certain encouraged misconceptions. Scots for example, I know a few who love the idea that they can drink any man under the table even if it isn't true, it's that sort of humour that people don't like being told isn't appropriate. People from the North and People from the South, we like our identity and as we know it's all joking, we don't like being told we have to curb it. regional humour is a wonderful thing. If someone seriously means it that's one thing but if they don't, telling them thy are being inappropriate is insulting to them, that's PC going too far in my opinion. People don't want to lose their humour and sometimes it is the person on the receiving end who's sensitivity is more of the problem than the person cracking the joke.

Sungirltan, I use that expression all the time. :)

"Shoesytwoesy Fri 10-Jun-11 10:27:47
bigots will always find an excuse to be bigots"

^^ What she said.

I don't believe the haircut story because being an equality officer is an essentially a policing role. You have to follow the law. You can't randomly send people on training courses because they referred to their husband as 'the wife' or because they complimented somebody's hair.

If somebody was routinely making such decisions, they would be sacked.