to not want to give symptoms to GP receptionist?

[vintageteacups]

So I called the GP surgery this morning and, as like the last time I rang, the first thing the receptionist said when I asked to book a doc's appoinment for dd (9) was:

"what seems to be the problem? We have a nurse's clinic this afternoon"

I calmly said that I would like a doctor's appointment and didn't tell her the symptoms.

What on earth? We pay our taxes and it's our right to take dd to see the gp, yet this cold fish of a woman just went "right, Dr .... at 11:50 then", took the name and address and put down the phone.

As has happened before, I felt really guilty about taking DD and felt as though I was wasting their time (even though I hadn't said what was wrong wtih dd).

Surely they can sift out the ones who turn up every monday morning with a spot on their finger and another runny nose (however, it's surely their right to book an appointment if they want) compared to me who has taken dd and ds probably twice each in 2 years. I have been once in 2 years!

They have a comments sheet - was thinking about extending it into a letter.
The receptionists have a really bad reputation for being grumpy and unhelpful.

youarekidding there are some things receptionists are INSTRUCTED by the DOCTORS to pass on to nurses. Receptionists might not be medically trained, by the DOCTORS who make the surgery rules, are!

I hate how people wage war on receptionists, who are trying to keep a bunch of very unreasonable people, nurses and doctors happy, all in one go!

'I would be slightly miffed if the receptionist was questioning me as a parent as to my decision about my child - who I can see at the time - needing a nurse or GP. When I've needed a nurse I've rung and booked for nurse and same with GP.'

youarekidding if you had read the whole thread you would hopefully realise that not all people can be trusted to be so reasonable or have that understanding. Sadly like some others you are crediting others with too much intelligence. Even if you understand it doesn't mean others do. If you read the thread I have given many examples of people both wanting too much and too little in relation to their symptoms. Some people don't understand and others don't want to understand so to be fair the receptionists must treat all patients the same and ask the questions.

I suggest you do read all the pages then, as it will improve your understanding of the way practices function, and why this question is routinely asked.

I think it's fair and reasonable for her to ask if a nurse's appt would be appropriate, and don't see how she was being a 'cold fish a woman' to promptly give you a Dr's appt when you asked for one!

That said, our dr's receptionists are largely vile and one of them reduced me to tears the last time I tried to get an appointment.

Three things I don't understand and I hope there are some GP's on here who would like to explain it to me.

1. Same day appointments - phone at 8 to get in and no appointments in advance (this has stopped at some surgeries now). One has to stand with finger poised at 8am to try to get through to the surgery. It sometimes takes an hour or more. It isn't easy when there are two school runs and an adult to get to work. After that hour when there are no appointments left for that day why is it reasonable to be told to phone the next day day at 8am or to come to the surgery for 8am and make the appointment in person. Does this respect the time of the patient? If Drs and their staff expect respect why is there so little appreciation that respect works two ways.

1. Repeat prescriptions: I have a chronic medical conditions which means I have to take drugs every single day. Those drugs are very cheap and have a long shelf life; the condition has been stable since 1991 and the does has not varied; I need one blood test per year and one prescription for 365 tabs per year - that is economical in terms of my time and the doctors time. In the last two years I can only get a prescription for 100 tablets at a time (and that after argument). This involves requesting a repeat prescription. Having done that the following happens: the prescription is not prepared; the prescription is sent to the wrong chemist; the prescription is requested for the chemist but not sent to the chemist. The result is usually a visit to the surgery and three phone calls which uses over the the course of a year about three hours of my time and several calls and visits to the surgery which a little common sense could have prevented. Can any GPs explain to me, why when work pressures are supposed to be so high, this is an acceptable situation. It stops sick people being seen and it wastes your time, my time and the time of your staff.

1. Why is it when receptionists always refer to the doctor as Dr Bloggs rather than by their first name; it is deemed appropriate to call all patients by their first name rather than by their title. When my appointment is made with Fred, Jane and Ann I shall be delighted if GPs and their staff call me onceamai - for as long as it is Dr name I expect to be called Mrs DH - why is this regarded as being unreasonable. It is an equality issue it is not a snotty issue and I have long wondered why any doctor or other healthcare workers thinks it appropriate to address patients as subordinate to the doctor. It doesn't make me feel more comfortable and I would happily invite people to use my first name if a little more respect and courtesy were extended in the first place.

Just come back to this thread since yesterday.

I wish people - lady you're the worst offender it seems - would stop talking as if a question from the receptionist about symptoms is an attempt to diagnose or do anything that would require medical expertise. It isn't.

Just imagine 2 parents phoning for an appointment for their child. The answer to the receptionist's question in one case - if the parent chooses to answer - is 'a runny nose'. The answer from the other is 'he's turned blue'. Are you seriously suggesting that the receptionist needs medical qualifications in order to see that there are different levels of urgency/need there and use that information accordingly?

Far too much on here is arrogant and dismissive about receptionists. Just because someone's job is generally seen as more lowly than another, doesn't mean that the person doesn't have skills and pride in doing the job well, or that we should assume we need to remind them what the parameters of their job are. They might know what they are doing better than the arrogant patient thinks.

Ironically DD has molluscum contagiosum (sp?) and it was a MNetter who said she thuoght it could be that (an untrained mnetter at that !

Then, when the GP said she couldn't give her anything for the spots, I went back to mumnet and found a natural cure, which arrived in the post today.

Onceamai I have a similar problem and would also like to know this. I am also entitled to be called 'doctor' (not a courtesy title) but this is never acknowledged. I wouldn't normlly care about this but the GP I have to deal with is incredibly patronising and I have to bite my tongue sometimes about our relative medical qualifications.

vintageteacups Good to hear it was nothing serious.

Now if you were at the practice I attend, and you had briefly described the symptoms when booking the appointment, the receptionist would have booked you in to see a particular doctor who specialises in skin-related stuff. I am sure this doctor would have known all about a remedy for this ailment because she's more interested in that field. If you said nowt, you'd have probably ended up seeing one of the other doctors with the same result as you got - a diagnosis but no treatment.

It may not always make any difference, but knowing roughtly what the problem is can help the receptionists to point us in the direction where we are going to get better service.

I'd much rather be asked brief questions about why I want an appointment because that way, I get to see the right person. Also, I don't waste the time of the GP (or people who need to see a doctor) when I have something that's much better treated by the excellent nurse practitioners at our surgery. Also, our GPs will refer patients straight back to the nurses so there may be nothing at all gained by getting precious and insisting that only a doctor will do.

In our surgery the receptionists do ask for any information the patient is willing to give, at the request of myself and my partners. This helps us to ensure patients are seen by the best person. Very frustrating for both the patient and me when they have refused to give any information (this is recorded on my clinic list) and they come in expecting me to deal with something that for example requires advance planning (like cryotherapy for a verruca) or a longer appointment, or a nurse appointment (blood tests, ear syringing, dressings etc), only to be told that they will need to rebook.

Where patients do not want to give information, it doesn't affect their ability to see a Dr, and the receptionist will just make them an appointment but it may compromise their care (I cannot count the number of patients I have seen in surgery who should have gone by ambulance to A&E, or, at the other end of the spectrum, could have self-treated after a brief telephone consultation with me).

For those extraordinarily arrogant people like Lady, please understand that this system is there to help you, not to make things awkward for you. You may feel you have a 'right' to see a Dr, but who would be so stupid as to think this is always the best option? I for one would never now choose to see a Dr for my smear; nurses do more than 90% of the smears in our surgery. As a result they are far better at it than I am, yet patients persist in coming to see me, a female GP, because they think that is somehow 'superior' to 'being fobbed off' with the nurse!!

[Oh and for the record, UK Drs (hospital or GP) do not have PhDs unless they are academics, and GP surgeries are private businesses who are funded by the government in various complicated ways, and pay their staff directly IE the GPs DO pay the receptionists wages.]

Thank you, doctor - you own the thread. :)

The receptionship should say

we have a nurses clinic which deals with x y z does this suit

then you say

no it doesn't

end of conversation

yanbu - you have a right to privacy

Hey I wasn't digging at receptionists. My sis DP mum is a DR receptionist.

I'm just saying that what may seem minor in words is not to someone who knows and can see the child. And yes others judgement may be exaggerated but then they could exaggerate symptoms over the phone - its no different.

My neighbour could ring the GP and get an emergency appointment at the click of her fingers as every cold/ sniffle her DD gets is serious.

For example recently I had to get an apt for my DS. I wouldn't have said it was an emergency therefore demanded a same day appointment. However I had sought advice here - again from unmedically trained MNers and knew it wasn't just constipation. If I'd been asked I would have said my DS is constipated - not really a medical emergency. However he was feceally impacted and had stretched his bowel so badly he had become incontinent. So I knew as knowing him and seeing him it was important but I know that saying he was constipated isn't.

And I know this as I said he was constipated and was told no appointments but when I said he'd had some feacal incontinence I was given an appointment for an hour later.

I also know when I've needed an appointment and said re DS allergies I have been given appointments straightaway - even when its been minor (needed eye drops for discomfort).

Another classic example was a few yeras ago. I'd had a really sore throat (think hot razors) for 4 days. When I rang for an appointment it wasn't deemed bad enough as I'd had it a few days its should get better soon - have an appointment for next week and let us know if you don't need it important. 2 hours later when hanging out washing my neighbour takes one look at my grey face questions why I've not seen GP and I explain. She rings up, gets me an immediate appointment and it turns out I have quincys throat. I was grey as my throat was so swollen it was affecting my airways.

I have learnt from this to use my own judgement about the state of the person needing to see the GP - not just the symptoms in black and white.

FWIW I don't believe in any of this 'is it an emergency crap' because if it was a true emergency you would call 999.

and also FWIW I have now read most of the thread and agree with what many have said, and disagree with others. I am basing my opinion on my experiences.

Oh can I also mention I rang my surgery to query about how I arranged community pead nurses coming round - as per cons pead letter to GP. (wasn't sure if cons, GP or I arranged). Was told I could see practice nurse - despite what cons pead said and what I then told her apt for for. So last week DS missed some school, me some work to attend an apt that the practice nurse couldn't deal with as she's not community pead nurse.

However Community pead nurse is coming in an hour to show me how use my DS lifesaving epi-pen.

And in this case I gave all the medical info.

OK, rant over -- as you were.

I have no problems with answering questions over the telephone, but if it is in person, I tend to make something up like when they ask what is wrong like "I have a green discharge oozing from my penis and it tastes absolutely disgusting" - and keep my face absolutely straight. They don't ask me any more.

Went to collect a prescription yesterday and went just before lunch as this is normally a quiet time. The screens to the receptionist desk were shut but clear so you could see through them. I waited for nearly 15 mins for this lady to open the screen. She insisted on taking every call that was coming in and was on her own. I nearly asked her to ignore the next ringing phone and speak to me as I was collecting a prescription that they have messed up anyway (but I didnt know that at the time!) but I didnt, I just waited patiently.

Most of the calls that she was taking were from people changing appointments, and generally messing around. Surely we must be able to do better than this....

It takes my doctors at least a full day to get any prescription signed. It's horrid knowing you have something wrong and are just waiting on a piece of paper to be signed and put onto a different pile, so they can call you to let you know they finally have it ready for you to collect.

Well Doctors can't be seeing patients and signing prescriptions for another patient at the same time. can't have it both ways. Either you want seen more quickly or you want your prescriptions quicker.

i think lady has qualifications confused. Being a medical doctor does not mean having a PHD. If there are medical doctors with PHDs they are probably top consultants/researchers specialising in one particular field. they are hardly going to be working as a GP, the clue is in the name GENERAL practitioner.

OTOH i personally know of 4 nurses who have obtained PHDs in nursing. They are still working the jobs they did when they were "just" nurses.

back to the original point, i would have no problem telling the receptionist about my symptoms. unless its something completely weird, thinking mad tropical disease that turns you purple, they couldn't give a shit. Maybe i feel different because im not a private person. I would hate to be a GP and have a good chunk out of my day with people who are complete over reactors or people so up themselves they feel only a doctor is good enough for them. I'm not a nurse but find some peoples attitudes about them and the way they look down on them frankly horrible.

Xstitch but the reason I have to wait for them to sign it off is because I can't get an appointment from them and my MW's are having to do all of the checks and tests and tell my Dr when I have something wrong. As I said when you KNOW something is wrong, not getting the medicine is what is frustrating, especially when your doc can't make time for you!

Interesting then, no doctors on today to respond to post 17 messages up.

Gooseberry - if you had read the thread you would know this was nothing to do with the OP wanting privacy. She has said this several times

Oncemai why it is deemed appropriate to call all patients by their first name rather than by their title

Not had this done much to me but seen it happen a lot (when I worked in a hospital) Its awful esp to elderly people from wet behind the ears Drs/Nurses. Often it is even documented in the patients notes that they want to be referred to as "Mrs Smith" but they still get called by their first name.

Very disrespectful.

Ok - I work within primary health care and just wanted to clear up a few things.

1. The receptionists are not triaging, they are SIGNPOSTING. There is in house training to assist them to do this. In essence, their job requires them to make sure the right patient is seeing hte right clinican. It makes no sense for a smear test to be booked with a doctor or a pregnant woman not to be booked with a midwife. Each professional is expert in their field and no one is inferior to the other.

1. Nurse practitioners are usually far more aware of best practice with regards to treatment of minor ailments and do not over prescribe antibiotics like some older GPs do

1. If you want to go back to the "good old days" when GPs did dressings, smears, immunisations and said "there there" to every sniffle then all the secondary care work that has gradually been shifted from hospitals to GPs ( as it's a lot more cost effective) would have to go back to secondary care. This would mean your taxes would probably have to double to keep up with the demands of an NHS. Is that what the "I have a right to see a GP" brigade really want?

1. There is tremendous wastage in prescribing and this is even with a maximum of 2 months supply. The easiest way to obtain medications for chronic conditions is to have a 6 monthly repeat dispensing system with your local pharmacist.

1. Most GPs partners ( the business people) work extremely hard, take their work home but their profits are tumbling. Their first priority is the patient which is unlikely to be the case if practices are taken over by corporate companies who are only interested in profit. The headline salary figures given by the media does not take into account things such as pension contributions and NI.

1. As a practice manager, my views of primary care are very glim. I can see thousands of inner city practices going under due to contract changes and the most deprived people in society will not have the voice that they need. Inner city GPs are a really dedicated lot who will suffer with them.