to not understand why anyone would ban Disney?

[ScrotalPantomime]

Thread about a thread about a thread - the debate was getting lost among the main debate so I thought it could continue here... I guess each to their own, if you want to ban it then it's your choice - I admire such tenacity, as I've failed miserably at a Nestle boycott - I'm just a bit as to why.

I understand that Disney is very different from the original stories but I don't see the harm - when they're really little would you want to let them know the darker versions? It is a good 'safe' way of introducing classic stories, and IME children will cope with gradually learning the proper endings.

I totally get that most some Disney things are sexist, but it's not all princesses is it. There's much more to Disney than that. Of course if you expose them exclusively to the princess stuff it will warp their views, and I do frequently introduce my face to my palm when I see all the merchandise, but I don't think it's inevitable if there is balance. You don't have to buy into all the crap.

DD's favourite is Hercules, which I bought for DH as he loved it. She now demands that DH tells her all about the Greek Gods at bedtime. This has led to an interest in the past, so as part of her 4th birthday present we are getting her some books - one of Greek mythology stories, and one about life in Ancient Greece. I'm hoping this will be a good opportunity to then introduce other ancient cultures - Rome, Egypt etc, but right now Greece is the word (geddit?) :o

Other favourite is Fantasia, which I preordered the second I found it on Amazon as I absolutely adored it as a child. Really thought DD as a modern child would be at it but she adores it and sharing it with her has been incredibly special. It built on her love of the Nutcracker (she learnt the music from the Barbie version! ) and thanks to Fantasia 2000 we've also gone onto reading bible stories and the darker version of the tin soldier story. She's been exposed to classical music from babyhood anyway, but Fantasia has really cemented her love for it.

I'm waffling now, but I just wanted to say that I really feel Disney has added a lot to my DD's life - more than other stuff she sometimes watches which just seem so bland. Although - bad mother alert - she does sometimes watch Futurama and is now fascinated by space and time travel...

As I said, each to their own and if you've got a strong enough conviction then fair enough, but I'd like to hear more about why. Enlighten me - I feel there's an interesting debate to be had here :)

Applauds Continuum

Actually the interesting thing about the Disney films in terms of sexism is that some of them pass the Bechdel test and some don't, the list is here

LittleMissFlustered

oooh!! :o

Haven't read the whole thread (as usual - sorry ) but just wanted to say that

a) since it was raining all bank holiday monday we had a film afternoon and all watched 'Tangled' together. We all thought it was a lovely and very funny film.

b) I find it very unlikely that my DD will be particularly influenced by cartoon characters she sees in films every few months. Surely she is more likely to be influenced by a woman she sees every day, who has her own sucessful career, is financially, emotionally and in every other way capable in her own right, and who chose to marry DDs daddy because he makes her life even better and treats her with love and respect - ie me

Oh and DontCallMePeanut I totally agree about Beauty and the Beast. This was the only vaguely princessy film I loved as a child (as said above I preferred animal ones) but unlike the others I've recently seen, such as Alice in Wonderland/Fantasia where I've been totally captivated and sent back to my youth, with BatB I was disappointed. Seeing it through the eyes of an adult was totally different. I'll still keep it, and watch it occasionally just for the nostalgia. DD didn't really like it anyway.

WhataWitch, I applaud your passion for all things WDW however just because people choose not to take their children there doesnt mean the children are missing out on 'magical' things.
I have never been ( like I said, we're saving but I dont know how realistic the plans are for us to go) but I never missed out. I was taken to all manner of castles, forests, gardens etc while on holiday with my parents, I distinctly remember skipping through the gardens of Bamburgh Castle pretending to be a princess, jumping from rock to rock near the caves on the cliff at Culzean castle pretending I was a smuggler, pretending to be a vampire at Whitby Abbey and hiding behind the giant headstones. You dont need the commercial disneyfied magic and sparkles for children to have an amazing time and wonderful memories so it's not fair to knock people who won't or indeed can't go.

ABF I have to ask wtf is up with that picture you linked to?!? EUWWWW!

And why is the last one normal instead of pornified

It's art work by some bloke cant remember his name. I remember coming across them when looking for a pic of Prince Eric and was strangely fascinated with them. I wouldnt say they were Ewww they are very good illustrations!

but why is the last one normal Disney style? I need to know!

Not a fan of the Disney Princesses merchandise/movies etc, luckily my DD doesn't know about those yet .

But classic Disney, has some fantastic well made films.

My DD is 2.8 and loves all the animal ones: Jungle Book, Dumbo, Lion King, 101 Dalmatians, Aristocats.

Disney Pixar makes truly fantastic kids movies: Wall-E, Toy Story, Up, Monsters Inc, Finding Nemo - are all much better than MANY adult films and loved by DD and me and DH.

YANBU - Disney should be the least of our parenting censorship worries.

Like it or not movies are a medium now built into the fabric of our our culture and a good one can be like a warm blanket on a cold night. I have fond memories of curling up with my parents watching many a Disney film. When I think deeply about it (which I rarely do), I see the marketing and the brand name thing but....the rest of the time I see the child-like joy of stories and characters I grew up loving. Which is what the best movies are after all - great stories.

I'm not to sure TBH!

my mother banned Disney because their version of 'Bambi' dishonoured' the original book.
So we saw hardly any of the films.
I don't think it did me that much damage.

I would rather my dd saw 'Taxi Driver' than Barbie and the however many dancing princesses, (is that Disney?)

Well the reason I think the author of the other thread was banning Disney was because she only seemed to want her, as yet unborn child, to experience high culture - museums, languages, literature etc.
I don't see any harm in Disney at all. The characters look nothing like real people - I don't think that kids aspire to look like cartoon characters. And if your going to ban Disney for only showing conventional beauty then you may as well ban tv, films and magazines full stop (and even Mother Superior on the other thread was going to allow TV at weekends).
For what it's worth I loved The Little Mermaid as a child. She had red hair like me and it was hard to get a doll with red hair. I didn't/don't give a crap if it's different to the book.

No, barbie isn't Disney afaik. As a rule I hate barbie, but I got the nutcracker film as it was a good way to introduce the music. Hasn't turned DD into a wannabe princess or fairy - I think she'd rather be one of the soldiers

Got swan lake too, and it's good for the music but the film isn't so nice.

Fair point about the 'higher culture' - I just think that by banning the lower stuff (not just Disney, I guess I'm talking about the OP of that thread now) and insisting that only some things are good enough you risk putting the child off and making them want to rebel.

Also the stuff like Disney has actually been one of our routes into the more traditional aspects of culture - barbie/fantasia for classical music (tbh she doesn't really know any modern stuff - not deliberate, we just don't listen to much) Hercules for history etc. All this knowledge is really important to DH and I, but as a family we don't have the money to go to museums and concerts and sightseeing holidays all the time so DD wasn't getting as much exposure to it as we'd like in an ideal world. So film has provided an accessible start for us.

queenceleste - remind me never to send my dcs over to yours for a dvd evening...taxi driver? I think some damage may have been done...

My parents banned TV and kids films when I was growing up ( they took me to see Oh What A Lovely War and Orpheus In The Underworld, though ... WTF? ) on the grounds that it was all rubbish and bad for you. Sorry to say I've been trying to catch up ever since!

My DSs loved Hercules and Treasure Planet, but not as half as much as my ol' Crass-fancying Class Warrior of a DP did ...

I was only kidding about taxi driver!

I don't do banning anything, far too LAZY!
If my DD's aren't allowed to watch Disney films, I assume they mustn't be allowed to to gymnastics or ballet either (nothing more stereotypically girly than a sparkly leotard or a tutu and nothing more likely to encourage anorexia).

I wanted to go to Disneyland as a child, but I might as well have dreamt of going to the Moon, we had no money. I wanted to go to the science museum in London too, but that wasn't going to happen either.

I did go a couple of years ago and it is great fun in that larger than life way that only Americans really know how to do. Some how it's cheesy in an uplifting way. And I was happy and sad at the same time that my relatively affluent DDs, hopefully, will never understand quite how special watching the fireworks over Cinderella's castle was to that little girl who is always with us even as sensible Mums.

I was actually allowed to watch films like taxi driver, the omen, psycho etc as a child, my viewing wasnt restricted at all and it's not done me any harm.
Maybe I'm one of the lucky ones.