Bishop Gilpin parents - And you call yourselves Christians?? (MERTON SCHOOLS)

[NutellaWithEverything]

Name changed because I need to rant about my DS not having been offered a school place and don't want to be outed. I am in Wimbledon and my nearest school in Bishop Gilpin. My DS has not been accepted to start in Reception this September coming even though it takes us three minutes to get there. Yet, they take in children from the other side of Wimbledon even though they have to drive through town to get there. And why?? Because they go to the right churches. So last November there was a request from the Council to add another Reception class but parents voted against other children from their own community benefiting from attending a good school. They felt it would be in the detriment of their school's community feel!!!!! AM I THE ONLY ONE WHO THINKS THIS IS SELFISH, SHORT-SIGHTED, UN-GODLY AND JUST PLAIN WRONG?????????????????

choccyp i had a choice out of 2 faith secondary school. The first is outstanding and massive with around 2500 pupils. the second is nearer and rated a good with only around 700 pupils. We went for the second school as it was nearer and smaller.

Hogsback that is not at all the same and in my area you are more likely to find a bigger racial mix in a faith school then you are the local comp.

There are very few non-CofE schools where I live, too. I'm not in London.

Thankfully a number of these schools have adopted a very sensible approach, which is to give priority to children for whom it is the closest school who have siblings already attending, then children for whom it is the closest school. Church attendance doesn't come into it.

If there were a number of non-faith schools within a reasonable distance then church attendance would be a reasonable criterion imo. But there aren't.

Teach him about my faith at home or scrape up the cash to send him to a faith school, Academic . I never went to Sunday School, actually. I just think DS will really like it. :)

cantspel - why is it not the same? You are supporting schools that discriminate on an arbitrary personal characteristic (religion) - why not allow them to discriminate on other characteristics too?

You also have chosen to ignore the point that for many of us, we don't have "choice" - I live in a small, isolated village and the only junior school can legally refuse to let Jews and Catholics in - how is that right?

Surely a local school should be for the education of all local children, irrespective of their faith?

To get the sacraments Im pretty sure that kids need to have instruction from someone other than family . So if there is no sunday school, school is it for us.

Oh, I see. I'm a Lutheran so it's a bit different. :)

hester i cant afford to live in Kensington and Chelsea or richmond for that matter. Infact i moved from surrey 13 years ago so that i could afford a decent home and lifestyle for my family.

Life is often not fair and things will never be 100% equal. I am quite prepared to support you wish for more decent non faith schools and with our growing population the state does need to build more schools but it is not the churches fault that to cut costs the state will opt for another church school. What should the church do? say no and then no one gets a school?

cantspel - oh, I should add the infant's school and the senior school (which is actually in the next, larger village) don't discriminate - but the junior school does - how is that even remotely ok?

cantspel - if the church wants to contribute to school funding, which is of course very laudable, it should do so no-strings-attached. Charity should not come with conditions.

Um, how about the church employing a bit of good old fashioned christian charity and building a school for the local community, regardless of faith?

Seriously, conversations like this really put me off returning to the UK. How can anyone possibly think that any form of selection is appropriate for school age children, whether by grades, religion, race or the colour of their hair? Totally bonkers. In the name of the environment alone, surely all children should go to their local school???

x-posts, sorry.

hogbback it is the state that is failing as they are not supplying enough places to ensure everyone who wants a place can have one. The school that has no catholics or jews only has no catholics or jews because it is already full with children who are higher up the admissions list. So the answer is for your local education authority to build a new school as your clearly have more children than places in your area.

ScroobiousPip the church schools came into being in the first place as an act of charity as at the time it was only the church which was supplying an education. Now times have moved on but the church schools are still there. We wouldn't be having this discussion if the state supplied enough schools to offer a place to everyone who wants one but they rely on the church to fill the gaps.

I wonder where the money for all these new schools will be coming from? Capital spending on schools has all but stopped. Thanks for that Mr Cameron

The system sucks that's for certain

cantspel - in reality in my village there is room for everyone who wants to go to the school, but the issue is that they are allowed to discriminate if they so wish - this is what is wrong.

Our junior school was only built in the 1980s and was built on land that was donated by the church - that is the only reason that it is voluntary-aided and that it has this discriminatory policy. The church contributes nothing to capital or running costs, other than that plot of land.

Interestingly, the infant's school, which is actually attached to the church and 19th century is voluntary-controlled, so is not permitted to discriminate.

The state is indeed failing, but with bishops having the right to interfere with legislation can we be surprised?

If we make all new schools open to all then eventually the faith ones will be replaced and we can dispense with a shameful part of our history once and for all.

Personally I think we'd be better off getting rid of them now. Increasing class sizes until new schools could be built would be better than allowing these people to spread and teach prejudice and immorality.

We wouldn't have to ban faith schools. Just stop giving them tax money.

Faith schools should not be state funded in the first place. If you are, you know, a bit dim and actually believe in gods, it's better that you peddle your primitive superstitons to your DC at home and they then go to school to get a proper education which will help them outgrow the superstitious nonsense. Generally, the better educated and smarter people are, the less likely they are to subscribe to any of this mythological bullshit apart from culturally.

YY SpringChicken. I don't think faith schools should exist at all. Indoctrination of children by their parents is bad enough but for the state to fund it is ridiculous.

I can't believe you were naive enough to put a faith school down as your first choice without the first inkling of what was involved. Fat lot of research you did into your child's education then.

And I went to a faith school in Wimbledon in the 80's (not BG) and kids travelled in from Tooting and Kingston. So it's hardly new. Where I live now, there is one faith primary amongst about a dozen others. Hardly taking over the world.

Funny how it's always the people that didn't get in who are moaning about the existence of state schools. If your child had got in it'd be the best thing since sliced bread no doubt.

hogsback if the school has places that they wont offer to other dthen that is wrong. What is the admissions policy of this school? as surely way down on the list it has open places?

Cantspel - over the whole country there are broadly enough places for children to go to school. If the state adopted your solution, there would be too many schools with too many places, half empty classes and wastage all round. Hardly a good idea at any time, let alone in the current economic situation.

All that is needed is for children to go to their local school and the problem would be solved. Churches could invest in Saturday and Sunday schools for those families who want a faith education for their children.

Oh great it has only taken 7 pages for someone to come along and tell anyone with faith that they are thick and uneducated.

Prime example of why we still need faith schools.

At the end of the day, the years 2006-2010 were pretty bad years to have children. (the economy nose dive will reduce the birth rate after that.)

If I had had my son 3 or 4 years earlier, it wouldnt have been such a big problem, hence why I think some on her with older kids dont quite get how severe and widespread this primary schools place crisis is.

Hopefully, it will put pressure on the councils and government to have a serious look at where all of these kids are supposed to go to school if so many schools are allowed to discriminate on the basis of faith, or allowed to refuse to expand to allow the overspill in.

Unfortunately, the children of the people who make these decisions are well taken care of, so it only affects us plebs who can't afford to move go private, or move to posher areas with better school provision.

It disgusts me really. ALL schools should be good, and fairly administrated.

no scroob you just have smaller schools.

I like small schools and think it is better for a child to be in a small school suiting his/her needs then lost in a school of 2500 trying to cater to all.

cantspel. I don't understand the need for faith schools. Why not scrap them, teach children about all religions and let the child make their own mind up?

cantspel, there are plenty of desperately poor people living in Kensington and Chelsea. Lots of them are recent refugees or immigrants, struggling to stay aflost, often with traumatic recent pasts in war-torn countries. They are often transient, lack knowledge of how the system works. They may be desperate for their children to be well educated, but they don't know that you have to attend a certain church every Sunday for four years, and get your name on the parish roll and help out with Sunday School, in order to get your child into the local school.

The church CAN do something about this. It sets its own admission criteria and it can choose to reach out to these people. It could note the drop-off in family church attendance once children have got into the school, and choose not to keep reaffirming privilege. By giving church attendance the priority in admissions, it allows in a small number of genuine believers, and a much larger number of game-players. On this thread we have heard about faith schools that refuse to play that game, that concentrate instead on providing a good education for local children, and all power to them. I wish that all faith schools did the same.