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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Designer dogs.

71 replies

faverolles · 07/05/2011 21:08

They are not pedigrees. They are crossbreeds bred for funny names Hmm
labradoodles, cockerpoos, sprockers, yorkipoos.
If you're desperate for a dog, go and rescue one that some feckless idiot has already bred and couldn't be bothered to be responsible about.
Don't put money in the pockets of some tosser who has bred a random non-breed so they can call it designer and sniffer at the name.
Labradoodles were bred carefully to be non-shedding guide dogs for blind people with allergies. A lot of thought and work went into breeding these. Shoving a random Labrador and poodle together shouldn't mean charging nearly £1000 for the offspring.

I don't care if IABU :o

OP posts:
Original poster
faverolles · 07/05/2011 21:56

Elastamum - sounds like yours came from a responsible breeder. Sadly, they are few and far between, as are the owners of these breeds who actually research what they are buying.

OP posts:
kirrinIsland · 07/05/2011 21:58

All pedigrees are designer dogs. Many have been so inbred that genetic problems are common. The Breed Standards have resulted in certain "desirable traits" being bred in at the expense of the health of the dogs - for example back problems in Bassett Hounds where the elongated shape is prized. This is less likely in 'oodles types as they are mongrels, so perhaps they are actually a good choice (though not for £500 :) ) Other popular breeds are churned out by breeders more concerned about the money coming in than the health and well being of the dogs they're producing or the homes they're going to, though in fairness the Kennel Club has taken steps to discourage this. The fact is irresponsible breeding is irresponsible breeding, regardless of the type of dog in question and certain people shouldn't own dogs, designer or otherwise. secretNutellaFix's colleague might have a labradoodle that is an untrained menace, but presumably it wouldn't be any better behaved if it was something more traditional. Sure, people might be buying these types because they are fashionable, but have a look at how many staffies are in rescue centres for the same reason. elastamum shows that these "designer dogs" can make excellent pets in the right hands and I can't see that they are any less valid than any other type of dog. Tighter controls are needed on breeding in general.

Al0uiseG · 07/05/2011 22:01

MadameCastafiore has a very valid point. Some breeds are in a dreadful state due to overbreeding, a bit of dilution can be a good thing. There will always be irresponsible breeders whatever the breed or cross.

I have a Bulldog, one of the worst offenders for over breeding, luckily due to his responsible breeders we have a healthy and happy specimen.

SecretNutellaFix · 07/05/2011 22:03

kirrin- it's the sprocker that is the issue, not the labrador.

DooinMeCleanin · 07/05/2011 22:06

My dog is a Fox-a-jack Grin. They are very rare.

YANBU btw.

Vallhala · 07/05/2011 22:07

YANBU.

'Nuff said.

kirrinIsland · 07/05/2011 22:08

SecretNutellaFix - oops, got my designer dogs mixed up Blush. I just meant that it is probably a menace because she bought a dog on a whim and hasn't put the time in to training it, not because it's a designer breed.

Original poster
faverolles · 07/05/2011 22:10

I completely agree about the breeding of pedigrees. Luckily, I've never come across any irresponsible breeders on that score.
To be fair, I also get peeved when people buy a dog and love it so much they have to let it have puppies Hmm
I think it's the vast sums of money for a dog with a daft name. No guarantee of which parent it'll take after.
Yes pedigrees were once designer, but they were bred for a purpose, for their herding abilities, their guarding instincts, their retrieving skills and many more. No contrived funny names.

OP posts:
SecretNutellaFix · 07/05/2011 22:14

it's a cross between a springer spaniel and a cocker spaniel. neither of which I would class as a sedate breed!Grin
I agree about the time and effort issue.

Original poster
faverolles · 07/05/2011 22:15

Kirrin IME, designer daft named dogs seem to be bought on a whim rather than thought through properly (possibly with the exception of labradoodles, before you jump on me!) because the owners can't resist the cute little fluff ball, and the name is the icing on the cake.

OP posts:
kirrinIsland · 07/05/2011 22:29

SecretNutellaFix I have 3 cockers and I'll admit 1 is a bit scatty, but the other 2 are as laid back as you like. Agree that Springers are generally loopy though so I take your point Grin
faverolles Probably haven't explained myself very well (as usual!) - I don't disagree that breeding to get a silly name or buying a dog because it's cute is a problem - and clearly both of these things are happening too much, I'm just saying that there are problems with most breeds, often to do with breeding for looks above health or temperament, and that it's a problem that needs addressing generally, not just in relation to designer dogs.

fruitshootsandheaves · 07/05/2011 22:33

"My point is that dogs should not be bred for comedy value"

but then Springers would be extinct! Grin

Mumswang · 07/05/2011 22:33

interesting article about the guy who 'invented' the labradoodle here

Original poster
faverolles · 07/05/2011 22:34

OK, fair enough :)
(working cockers have a different temperament, and are extra lively and bouncy!)

OP posts:
midori1999 · 07/05/2011 22:35

The majority of pedigrees have very few health problems. Aside from which, as Labradoodles are bred from pedigree dogs, they have exactly the same health problems as the pedigree they are bred from. Hence the need for hip scoring and eye testing (which sadly nowhere near enough breeders of them do). Hybrid vigour in dogs is somewhat contraversial, not least as crossing dog breeds doesn't make a true hybrid, but a crossbreed. To see any sort of 'hybrid' vigour, you are really talking about monrels, not crossbreeds.

The one thing that bothers me about the breeding of crossbreeds is why do people do it? There are no breed standards for crossbreeds, no type to breed to, nothing to improve upon. Some people are genuine, I have no dubt about that, but just like with pedigrees, those who breed most of them (puppy farmers or back yard breeders) are in it for the money only and don't care less about the welfare of the animals they are breeding.

I agree there need to be much stricter regulations surrounding dog breeding.

SecretNutellaFix · 07/05/2011 22:39

I certainly don't disagree with you on that kirrin Smile

For that reason, I tend to prefer working dogs to show dogs. In no position to have any dog at the moment though, but lost my border collie last year.

NimpyWindowmash · 07/05/2011 22:40

I'm sure YANBU... (but I saw a young cockerpoo today and it was absolutely adorable)

Original poster
faverolles · 07/05/2011 22:43

Mumswang - Thankyou for that article :)
Midori - I wish you'd started this, you say it all far better than I do :o

OP posts:
elastamum · 07/05/2011 22:54

The probelm isnt the dogs them selves it is people who buy dogs of any sort because they look cute, without giving it a lot of thought. Labradoodles suffer because they look cuddly. As a pup my eldest doodle was an adorable blond ball of fluff who stood about up to my knee. Now she is a 40kg adorable huge lump of fluff and muscle. If she stands on her hind legs she is as tall as me! Not quite the same thing.

The people who had our 3rd dog as a pup should never have bought her in the first place. They had 2 small kids and lived in a flat. Apparently she wrecked it Hmm

delillah247 · 07/05/2011 23:08

I have llasha-poo, she is gorgeous. I thought getting a xbreed was a good thing, you hear so much about pedigrees and genetic problems caused by overbreeding. Those poor little king charles spaniels and there brain issues, the german shepherds, with hip issues, cocker spaniels with ear problems, pugs with breathing problems.

DooinMeCleanin · 07/05/2011 23:13

Yes but Delillah did you pay stupid amounts of money to some con artist who doesn't give a fuck about his/her dogs welfare or that of the puppies because the puppies have a silly name, even though they are essentially just mutts?

As Midori pointed out crossing pedigree dogs with health issues does not wipe out the health issues. Only responsible breeding can do that and the eejits breeding these dogs are in for the ££££ not the dogs.

I was joking about my Fox-a-jack just incase that wasn't clear. He is an ex poundie who cost me a £40 adoption fee. He's a fox terrier crossed with another terrier - possibly a jack russel, possibly a westie, possibly both. No-one can agree.

hephaestus · 07/05/2011 23:21

Delillah, crossing a breed that commonly suffers with, for example, hip dysplasia with a breed that commonly suffers hereditary eye conditions has just as much chance of producing a dog with both conditions as one which had miraculously cancelled those conditions out. See Midori's post.

midori1999 · 07/05/2011 23:24

Delilliah, perhaps you should have done more research before you bought your crossbreed?

Cavaliers do not have 'brain problems', despite that being documented by a BBC documentary. SM is a condition which affects the spinal cord and as dogs can be affected, carriers or clear, with responsible breeding it can actually be bred out.

It's obvious you don't know much about pedigree dogs, but I wonder if you do know that both Lhasa apso and poodles can be affecte dby eye problems and as such your dog's parents should have both been health tested clear for these. Sadly, most people breeding crossbreeds don't bother to test and tell puppy buyers they didn't need to, one of the reasons being 'hybrid vigour' and 'they're not inbred, so it's not a problem'... Hmm

hephaestus · 07/05/2011 23:28

And LOL that all pedigree dogs are full of health problems - true working dogs, bred for purpose, are still as sound as they were a hundred years ago (excepting the efforts of numpty back yard breeders). Reserve your ire for the dogs bred solely for their appearance to the detriment of their health.

Vallhala · 07/05/2011 23:39
  1. IMHO and IME breeding AT ALL is irresponsible given the number of healthy dogs killed in pounds each week.
  1. Too many of these silly crosses end up in rescue because the buyers have no bloody clue what they're taking on. I've seen Labradoodle pups come in because the owner didn't realise that they were so demanding and "can't cope" and because they believe the dog is going to be non-shedding and then discover that he isn't. If only they did their research it wouldn't be QUITE so bad (although see my first point).
  1. Too many of these dogs are bought almost on impulse as fads because they are new/different/cute/the owner doesn't realise that he may get the worst of both breeds and not the size/personality/exercise demands that he anticipated. The same happens whenever a cute movie depicts a breed... 101 Dalmations caused a high increase in purchase, an increase in demand which led to backyard breeding and consequently a lot of these dogs being abandoned to the streets or rescue.
  1. The demand for these designer dogs comes at a high price to them, not least in the increase in puppy farms and in the dogs which existing puppy farmers offer.
  1. When these dogs become popular they also become money-spinners to either heartless or just ignorant owners of one of the breeds who decide that they will make a few bucks by mating their Cocker, for example, with next door's Poodle. This results in genetic problems and all the problems associated with the average Joe (AKA a backyard breeder) breeding his dog. These are the people who won't be there to offer support and advice if the pup's owner hits a problem because they haven't a clue what to do, whose dogs are often going out unvaccinated and who certainly won't be willing or able to take him back in months or years to come if the owner can't keep him for any reason.

The result, if the dog is lucky, is that they end up in already overburdened, underfunded and packed to the gills rescue or worse that they end up dead in the pound having been thrown out or taken to the vet and killed there.

Rescue is already on it's knees, particularly since the RSPCA decided in it's wisdom that it was no longer willing to take in unwanted dogs from Joe Public... Please, FFS, don't make it harder for us and contribute to more hundreds of dogs dying each week by breeding your dog or buying from such breeders.