to ask what people's impressions are of academics/the job role

[anotheracademic]

I see there are quite a few of us and also see from the recent money and salary threads how much people are earning, working conditions and qualifications .
Im wondering what non academics impressions are of what we do, what they think/thought we earn and what we are like.

We do lots of marketing as well

want2b maybe your reality isnt quite right. The majority of regular real life jobs are monday to friday, 9-5. No? Well who's reality are we comparing against?

I'm on my second post-doc position, first was 18 months and this one is 12, so the lack of job security is an issue and I am already very stressed about what to do next. I've applied for a fellowship (only around 10% get funded) and network as much as possible. Mix teaching and research, but more research heavy workload.
Also dislike the politics but try and be as diplomatic and avoid getting into competition -not always easy.

Pay is fine imo, my first post-doc was low 30s, although no great leaps up and difficult to move up grades without lots of outputs, taking on more responsibilities etc (fair enough)

Things I love are -
Autonomy, as long as the work gets done I'm left to my own devices and I come and go as I please (although generally work over my contracted hours)
Having strong female role models (head of dept, phd supervisor and last boss all women)
The lack of attention to appearance - outfits I have seen on colleagues include -full shell-suit (vintage!), winnie the pooh sweater, stained cardis, cycling shorts worn all day in the office, and so on.

I think, like with many workplaces the feel of academic departments reflect their most senior staff.

I have colleages who email me at 2 am
Not that Im there opening them or anything serves me right

Pinksky - I love your descriptions of the advantages of your job! Esp the clothing.

I didn't carry on and left after my phd to work in banking. As others have said, its very difficult to get junior research positions and the money is awful and you need to get a new job every couple of years. I've been interviewing lots of people over the last year or so that have been forced out due to cuts in research funding and are having to find work in the real world but starting in junior roles in their thirties. Also the only new mums in my circle that are going back to work at six months are academics due to the need to keep their researah up.

anotheracademic

The majority of professionals that I know (including myself) work longer hours than those doing 'regular' jobs. I don't think it is fair to compare non-professional jobs to professional jobs as the demands are completly different.

Actually, I don't know of a lawyer, accountant, doctor or engineer that works 9-5. Those that do work 9-5 quickly find themselves out of a job in my neck of the woods.

I don;t know anybody in a professional job who works 9-5 Mon-Fri!

We dont have cool outfits but serious gadget addictions - very competitive gadjet envy

Yes 8-6 was a short/normal day for me working outside academia, and working weekends was quite normal. Wouldn't consider that 'phenomenal' at all.

I'm not an academic (yet!) but am doing a full-time funded PhD - so get some insight into what the research side at least is like. I can imagine though that the academic staff are doing as least as much as I am in that respect, plus teaching, supervising, marking, admin, and applying for research funding. It can't be easy, and I would be amazed if anyone managed to fit it into a normal 8-6 working day, and still had time to publish. And you really do have to keep the publications coming. Several academics in my department were made redundant recently because their 'citation counts' were too low and they were not bringing in enough funding (though they were very highly thought of on the teaching side and had focused a lot of their time and effort on that). So it can be tough and competitive, especially at the more 'research intensive' institutions.

want2be - in a typical day I am in the office from 7.30 am to 4pm when I rush off to get the kids. I then work 7 til 11 every evening (ok I also have mumsnet open ). On weekends I juggle it around the kids - but I think I do around 5 hours of work a day then too as well. I am always on email and I have often answered emails at 2am when feeding the baby. And even when I'm not in work I am planning research, thinking about things etc.

I literally cannot remember the last time I had a week off. I rarely have a day off. I did have Christmas day off. During my maternity leave I still wrote grants and papers - I responded to a student 3 hours before I gave birth and around 5 hours after.

That is the real reality of academia....

However I also have great freedom in that I often never have to specifically be in the office (although usually am), get to research what I love, have the flexibility - I can be at home with the kids by 4pm and spend holidays with them (although am then working all night and will have during the day).

It is great - just extremely pressured.

annie some NHS professionals, like my neighbour work 9-4.30 mon to fri.

I never met anyone of my generation who works Mon-Fri 9-5, certainly not anyone with a good level of education and earning a reasonable salary!

I didn't carry on and left after my phd to work in banking. As others have said, its very difficult to get junior research positions and the money is awful and you need to get a new job every couple of years. I've been interviewing lots of people over the last year or so that have been forced out due to cuts in research funding and are having to find work in the real world but starting in junior roles in their thirties. Also the only new mums in my circle that are going back to work at six months are academics due to the need to keep their researah up.

ephiny what hours were you paid for? I am contracted to a 0.5 post and work every day and weekend and evenings. Wouldnt mind if I was getting the benefiit of full time pay.

And how does their pay compare?

Teachers, engineers, accountants, solicitors - well - it's not my experience.

You are joking. Most people I know work 9-5 and are highly paid professionals (well around 50K anyway)

I'm an academic , but I often don't have a very high opinion of the profession (or parts of it). I'm in arts/humanities and I think a lot of people there are very blinkered (mostly - please note, I say mostly middle class - I'm not and this has made me feel quite different from my colleagues in terms of assumptions, wider familial support etc) by virtue of never having done anything else. This isn't, of course, universally true, and it's certainly less snobbish than when I started. Whether it's a happy experience or not will depend on your department (i'm in a lower prestige uni that my cv might command simply because it's a good place to work with super, supportive, smart colleagues), and can be quite volatile (e.g. a head of department can make a huge difference)

It is relatively well paid, although increasingly pressured (more so in the sciences for sure); it's a complex job, with duties and responsibilities that are very wide-ranging and I find juggling all the different tasks quite difficult (more so since DD); the fuzziness about contracted hours and lack of clear definition can be problematic (am I obliged to run open evenings, no, but yes). But it is also a very privileged job, and very demanding job (in a good way) and one with a real image problem.

I think its status is on the wane (perhaps indicated by the increased numbers of female academics) and the long-term future does not look that brilliant; but it is a fabulous job if you can get into it - and that is a long and tortuous road for the vast majority.

Some posters would be getting red marks on their posts from me re missing the point. (Although we are not allowed to use red anymore)

The pay for effort and hours doesnt really equate. Thats the issue. Not shy of working hard but would like to be renumerated adequately.

sorry anotheracademic - does that mean then that the people in the profession aren't allowed to comment?

I wasnt referring to you, sorry daisy...previous posters.

I dont consider myself well paid just as an aside

Precisely another.

It is a way of life not a job.

Which is fine but it seems that no matter how much you do it is never enough. And it takes over.

That is the same for many other professions but they will be better paid.

But I dont want to do those jobs so hey ho

I just saw drivig and miss and came out with daisy, sorry crazy

anotheracademic - I had no set hours, we all opted out of the working time regulations. I guess I could have refused to, but that was just unheard of in the sector (banking), you just got handed the form to sign as a routine part of your induction, there was never any question of anyone not doing it! It was reasonable pay, but the downside was they expected to own you and you worked whatever hours were necessary to keep the traders happy .

I probably work about the same amount on my PhD but at least I'm doing it for me, not to please or serve someone else, and I do love it. Wouldn't be surprised if I got similarly disillusioned with academia further down the line though, so many people do these days...

How was your pay based then ephiny? curious

I am mighty curious about these 9-5 £50K professionals.

Seriously - reading this is like reading Professional Engineering.

We love it.
We wouldn't do anything else.
But everyone else is better paid.

We all think it!