To wonder why anyone buys that 'Growing Up' milk stuff?

[bubbleymummy]

No one expects to get their iron content from milk - you get it from the food you eat alongside it (although you shouldn't really drink milk alongside a meal anyway because calcium inhibits iron absorption) so why would you spend money on this product? Does anyone on MN buy it? If so - why?

That should be 'most people' :)

I'll just say again that this is no fault of the parents - adverts are powerful things

How patronising. It is better than milk in some ways and less good than milk in others. Same as people buying fortified breakfast cereals, low fat yoghurts or taking vitamin supplements. Some people do actually know what their diet/health/lifestyle is lacking or too full of and compensate.

I agree that the advertising makes it seem like the only option but most parents realise that it is an option and choose it.

I will give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you are doing this for the reasons you state and want to reassure people that they don't need to buy follow on milk, but your approach is very belittling and smug.

Sorry Dingdong that wasn't intended to be patronising - I'm just trying to defend myself against accusations of calling people who choose it stupid etc and I don't think that at all.

I'm not really sure why you think it is 'better' than milk though. Is milk better than water because it has more calcium? Is orange juice better than milk because it has more vitamin c? It can't really be better than milk because it's something that milk isn't supposed to be - an iron enriched drink. It's not really a fair comparison - shouldn't you be comparing it to another iron enriched food/drink? Maybe Guinness?

Very well said, Cloudydays.

Follow on milk is better than milk because it has more calcium and other added nutrients, but it is less beneficial than milk because it is processed and sugary. Yes, orange juice is better than milk because it has more vitamin c, but it is less beneficial than milk in that the acidity can damage your teeth. It depends what you are looking for in a drink; taste, nutrients etc. One thing is better than another if it provides what you need, so it is a fair comparison.

The reason I thought the above comment was patronising was because you were implying that all parents who buy follow on milk do so because they are too stupid to see through the clever advertising. What I was trying to imply was that some parents see through the clever advertising, weigh up the pros and cons and buy products based on how useful that product will be to them

Guinness is better than all of the above drinks because it has alcohol in it. Vodka is better than Guinness because it gets me pissed merry faster

is better than water

Now my point is ruined...

I think if you're going to have a go, then Benecol and Actimel are two products that could do with a bit more advertising scrutiny, tbh. They are surely even more inflated in their claims than formula.

But Dingdong if uou saw through the clever advertising then you wouldn't buy it would you? Once again, I don't think that not seeing through it makes you stupid!

Also, we're talking about growing up milk not follow on milk which is a type of formula. Growing up milk is given later.

Boffin, I'll target them next! :) must discuss appropriate wording with cloudydays first though....

Sorry, I did mean growing up milk, the stuff given after one.

Can people not buy anything on merit anymore? Can people not buy things because they like them/find them useful/have them recommended/need the product?

For example, someone sees that advert for eggs. They think, 'Hmm, I wonder if eggs really are a source of all the good stuff the advert has said? I will check it out for myself'. They do a bit of research, find that eggs could be beneficial to their diet, and buy the eggs. Have they been conned by clever advertising or are they buying a product based on factual information about how it could enrich their diet?

Same could apply for growing up milk. A parent could see the advert, actually look at the ingredients and added nutrients themselves and make up their own mind about buying it.

You are still saying that nobody would buy the milk unless they were taken in by the adverts, that anyone who buys it has been led and has not made the decision for themselves based on factual information. I think this is untrue and unfair.

I dont think reading a list of ingredients would help you decide whether or not you need something. It could potentially convince you that you do need those things though - otherwise 'why would they put them in?' Iykwim The 'factual' information comes from the manufacturers who are obviously going to sing the praises of their own product so it's not exactly an independent source of information is it?

If you could read a clear list of ingredients of this stuff and discovered that one of them was sugar in some form (which must be true - as someone said it tastes like alcohol free Bailey's) I'm pretty sure that would change a lot of people's minds about it.

How on earth do you choose your food if you don't buy what adverts suggest and you don't look at ingredients? I don't mean stuff you already like and know, I mean new products.

Ok, I'm going to try again. I have been told in the past that I need to keep my iron levels high. I often read ingredients before I buy things to see whether they contain iron. We all need to keep our salt levels down, so I often look at ingredients to see how much salt a product contains. Do you never read ingredients and choose whether to buy a product based on what's in it? Or do you just go by the packaging?

If growing up milk contains added vitamin d (no idea, just picking something at random) and you live in a part of the UK with little sunshine and you have a child of an ethnicity who finds it harder to absorb vitamin d, would you not look at a list of ingredients and think that the fact they had added something that may be more tricky to get would be a plus? Or in this case, would you still be buying it because of clever advertising? It is a FACT that they have added vitamin d. Factual information is factual because of trading standards. 'Spin' comes from the manufaturers. 'Fact' is fact.

But in this case the "fact" is not as straighforward as that. The advertizers focus on iron, because they know that every parent has heard something vague abot needing to make sure that toddlers get enough iron once they are eating food. SO they show that massive beaker - saying that one carton of their stuff contains as much iron as that massive great beaker of ordinary milk. Which of course it does. That is a fact.

But it glosses over the fact that milk is not most children's main source of iron, a lot of iron is naturally excreted and that filling toddlers up with a very filling milk product is going to make the LESS likely to be hungry for other foods with naturally occuring iron in them. So "facts' ain't necessarily "facts"!

I still think a parent can take the fact 'it contains x much iron' and decide whether this is a useful thing for their child based on how much iron their child gets from other sources. I do not for one minute believe that every parent who buys this milk believes that it is the only alternative to feeding their child 300L of cows milk per day. Some of them will think, 'It is a FACT that it contains this much iron, so I could get them this, OR I could shovel more red meat into them, or eggs, OR I could look at the plant sources and incorporate these into my cooking' and choose one of these options.

I can see that the advert, like all adverts, are designed to imply that their product is the best. I still don't think that everyone who ever buys a product that has been advertised does it because they 'cannot see through the clever, clever adverts'. Some people buy on merit regardless of advertising.

I would guess that the milk does contain sugar, but again I would weigh up the good and the bad and make a decision. I buy own brand weetabix sort of things. I know they have added salt and sugar but I can't bear the taste of nothing added shredded wheat so I look for a product I think has a reasonable balance.

I don't check ingredients to see vitamin/iron content - do they even give iron content on packaging? I dont watch much tv either so i dont really see too many ads! I know which foods have which vitamins/minerals and which sources are better than others. I don't tend to buy much processed food anyway and afaik a head of broccoli doesn't have it's iron content written on the side :) If I check ingredients it's more to check that it doesn't contain something rather than see what it does have - I guess we just come at it from a different angle!

Seeker explains the 'fact' thing well. It's how it's being presented that is the issue.

You must have learnt from somewhere which foods have higher levels of vitamins and minerals, so if you haven't actively looked it up yourself you are still going by what you have been told. They do give iron content on packaging, this is the only one I really look for but I can see why people would want to see what is in their food. I would count myself as not eating much processed food but certainly don't live on raw fruit and veg so yes, I do look at packets.

The point is, if you hadn't seen an ad about that product would you go looking for a fortified milk to get your vitamins/minerals? It's the ad that makes people think - 'oh there's a good idea, I could just get little tommy that and then I KNOW he's getting enough iron'. It's not the type of thing you would go looking for in a shop. Why would anyone choose powdered milk over fresh unless they thought there was some added benefit and the only way they know about the supposed added benefit is through the advertising.

If growing up milk contains added vitamin d (no idea, just picking something at random) and you live in a part of the UK with little sunshine and you have a child of an ethnicity who finds it harder to absorb vitamin d, would you not look at a list of ingredients and think that the fact they had added something that may be more tricky to get would be a plus? Or in this case, would you still be buying it because of clever advertising? It is a FACT that they have added vitamin d. Factual information is factual because of trading standards. 'Spin' comes from the manufaturers. 'Fact' is fact.

I have added this again because I think this demonstrates why someone would check packaging looking for a specific addition and would like to know what you think.

I know I care a lot more about my DCs getting a balanced diet than I ever did about myself, this is why I have researched which foods contain what and which taken together increase absorption of essential nutrients. Also, I am lucky that my DCs eat well and will eat pretty much anything so I have never had to worry. They are also not of an ethnicity to need extra vitamin d, nor are they anemic (spelling!) or deficient in any other area that I am aware of. But I still hold with the fact that if you are aware your child needs more of something, for whatever reason, you will examine all the sources and make a decision which is not purely based on advertising but based on factual information and what is useful for your child.

Yes, but I haven't learned from advertisers trying to promote their products :)

I don't live on raw fruit and veg either but I don't feel the need to check ingredients on fish,bags of rice, porridge oats, lentils etc. I'm pretty sure what's in them already :)

Same can be said of nearly every product ever made. There will always be many ways to get a certain vitamin/mineral/food group. I eat wholegrains, but I do this through brown bread, rice, pasta, cereal etc. You could say, why not just eat the grain? If you didn't know cereal and all the other things were made from wholegrains, you would just be eating the grains themselves, which would be cheaper and not processed, but I bet loads of people get wholegrains from other sources. Why not be made aware of products that may contain what you are looking for so you can make a choice?

I am such a junk food addict then, because I buy bread, cheese, marmalade, spread etc. I didn't realise you made everything from scratch...

Again, I don't think I would go looking for vitamin d in a fortified milk drink. I would be looking at safe sun exposure and dietary sources and perhaps, as a last resort, a more natural supplement such as floradix. There you go! There's an example of something I checked ingredients for! :) no adverts for that though!

I don't Dingdong - why would you need to check ingredients on them? Don't you pretty much know what the ingredients are? The less processed the thing you are buying the fewer ingredients to look at anyway! eg butter instead of spread :)

You can ignore my last post then because you would just eat the grain!

We will have to agree to differ, I think people can buy things on merit, even after seeing them advertised, because they are intelligent enough to pick out the facts and make informed decisions. It is nice to have variety in our diets.

I bet if this thread had been titled 'To wonder why anyone buys eggs?' you would have had loads of responses telling you that they are not entirely influenced by the adverts, even though eggs are widely advertised on tv.

That was fun! Night night.