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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to wonder with what authority USA killed Osama Bin Laden.

342 replies

Mamaz0n · 02/05/2011 09:43

Since when has murder been justice?

Don't get me wrong, i think it is a good thing that he has died. I think that to imprison him would have caused massive uprising in violence and kidnaps etc.

But it bothers me that America has just decided that this man is guilty and therefore acted to murder him.

It is my (probably naive) understanding that you can't be extradited to a state that has the death penalty, so how exactly can Obama's order to kill Bin Laden be at all legal?

I have even just heard that the Pakistani government were not even aware that the USA were taking this action.

I am sorry but it sits very uncomfortably with me.

OP posts:
wotnochocs · 02/05/2011 19:32

capricorn posted- 'The crazy Jihadists will hate us no matter what we do. Even if we let OBL get away and sat around with daisies in our hair singing that hippy Coke song about teaching the world to sing they would still plan to kill us. Why? because their whole ethos is based on killing infidels and they will not stop until we are all gone.'
So you don't think it is the West's interference in the Middle East?

constantlywrong · 02/05/2011 19:52

I would like to point out that it's looking more and more likely that Gaddafi's son hasn't actually been killed, by the US or otherwise....

I am absolutely not a conspiracist, and think it's ridiculous to suggest that UBL hasn't actually been killed and it's US propaganda, but there is a lot to suggest that the Gaddifi son/grandchildren thing isn't true.

capricorn76 · 02/05/2011 19:58

@wotnochocs

Are you saying the 9/11 and 7/7 victims deserved to die because of our involvement in the ME? The ME is largely in the state it is because of dictators (which is why thousands of people there are trying to depose all of the leaders in that region - they no longer believe the lies that The West is to blame for everything and is the cause of their poverty as they are often told).

I am what they call a Guardian reading lefty and even I can see that the killing of OBL is a good thing.

@expatinscotland. Most Brits are with America today, don't let the hang wringers upset you.

CheerfulYank · 02/05/2011 19:58

I don't think that they just walked up and shot him. I think they asked him to surrender, he didn't, there was a fight, and he died. Better him than the JSOC.

I'm American, and I have never in my life wished harm to an innocent person. I have never in my life thought that being American made me better than anyone else, but I'll be damned if it makes me worse. I'm a good person, an innocent person, as is my 3 year old son, as is pretty much every other common American person I know. Osama bin Laden would kill us all and delight in doing it, so I don't care that he's dead and I don't care how it was done.

They tried to capture him. What were they meant to do, slap him on the wrist and say, "now it's not very nice to kill hundreds of thousands of people, don't you do it anymore!"

Yes, in war, innocent people are killed and that's a terrible, terrible thing. I think Americans (and anyone else) who intentionally commit war crimes should be brought up on charges and sentenced. Many time the deaths of innocent civilians are tragic accidents.

There were five children on American flight 77, ages 3-11. On United 175 there was a 2 year old, a 3 year old, and a 4 year old. The hijackers saw them and knew they were there, but they were infidel children so they didn't care.

F%ck them.

CheerfulYank · 02/05/2011 20:00

And I agree that the celebrations in the street were in poor taste. I was nowhere near them, but wouldn't have gone if I had been.

penguin73 · 02/05/2011 20:09

Mamaz0n,

I do get your point but am intrigued what your strategy in this situation would have been - what would you have liked to happen? I feel uneasy with the celebrations and v worried about the repercussions but cannot think of an alternative to what has been done.

hotcrossSES · 02/05/2011 20:10

I was about to start a thread - "AIBU to think that all the celebration and news coverage about the death of Osama Bin Laden is in poor taste"

I can understand why he was hunted down but to celebrate his death seems in bad taste. I agree with Mamaz0n's sentiments.

My Dad commented that it was some sort of attempt by America to show he couldn't get the better of them. Unfortunately I feel that (regretfully) that was a bit late in the day.

Don't get me wrong, I can understand that this man was a big symbol for terrorist activity and caused unthinkable pain to 1000s. I can understand too that it may have been an attempt to capture him that resulted in his death.
I just struggle with all the celebration - it doesn't make any of the hurt he caused go away.

midnightexpress · 02/05/2011 20:14

The BBC were saying this evening that they had been specifically instructed not to take him alive.

wotnochocs · 02/05/2011 20:18

capricorn - I am absolutely catagorically emphatically not saying that the 9/11 or 7/7 bombings were anything other than monstrous murders ao innocent citizens.

wotnochocs · 02/05/2011 20:19

But I feel we would not have been a target had it not been for Americas medlling in the ME

suburbophobe · 02/05/2011 20:22

What goes around comes around, a.k.a. karma

wannaBe · 02/05/2011 20:22

I'm intrigued by the motivation of people going out to celebrate in the streets. I mean how is it someone thinks "oh, Bbin laden is dead, I'll get me coat and US flag and head down to ground zero/the white house and celebrate." But that being said...

What other outcome did people expect? We're not talking Joe Blogs on the street here we're talking a man who has publically owned up to orchestrating the murders of thousands of innocent people in the name of his religion. Or do people really believe that he is innocent until proven guilty in a court of law? And what court of law do you suppose would find him innocent? And who do you suppose would sit on the jury?

I wonder, if Bin laden had been killed just post 9/11 would people still be so morally outraged about it?

So he's ill. and? has he had a change of heart and is now a good person? If he had already been taken into custody and was ill in jail would we be pleading for him to be set free? Being ill does not take away the magnitude of what he has done.

No, the world will not be a safer place because bin laden is dead. In fact it's possible that there may be reprisal attacks. But fear of reprisal is not a reason not to kill him - in fact not killing him for fear of reprisal gives alqaeda the upper hand.

I won't be celebrating his death. But equally I won't be party to turning him into a marter by calling it murder or saying it was wrong either.

Jux · 02/05/2011 20:45

I think it's entirely understandable that people went out and celebrated. I hope they all had a great time. If I'd been in NY at the time, if I'd lost someone I loved in the two towers, or on the Underground in London, or in Madrid or any of the other atrocities, I'd be bloody delighted the guy had been got. 9/11 had an immense impact on the US, it has had our forces tied up in Afghanistan for years, and in Iraq. There have been so many deaths down to OBL. I can see utterly and easily how the people whose forces got him would be out there partying.

The trouble is that I doubt that his death will make a huge amount of difference.

bemybebe · 02/05/2011 20:47

wot "But I feel we would not have been a target had it not been for Americas medlling in the ME"

Not sure what you mean by "medlling", but do you want your government to run foreign or domestic policy basis what a handful of nutters may do? I wouldn't.

crystalglasses · 02/05/2011 20:54

I haven' read all the threads so maybe this is repeating others...but while I accept how evil he was, I really don't like the American jubilation at his death.

nancy75 · 02/05/2011 21:03

I don't understand some posters points about not killing him as there had been no trial. From what I understand there was a fight between the 2 sides and he got killed. I don't really see what other options there were - were they supposed to ask him nicely to go attend court and when he said no just let him go?

CheerfulYank · 02/05/2011 21:08

Apparently, nancy . Hmm

gypsymummy · 02/05/2011 21:08

Was Bin Laden a dangerous man? well, his ideology was and still is and THAT has not been killed. There are many out there who cherish his Jihadist interpretation and I dare say many more who will now adopt it. And now every official and "professional" analyst is telling us hey we have actually more to fear now he is dead..so how is the world going to be a safer and bettr place now they have killed him? The real winner in this sad story is Obama who can't beleive his luck..that is the elections secured now!
As for Qaddafi well his little soap opera episode has now been overshadowed by this even more " superior killing".. and believe you me he knows a lot about killing..he has been doing it for the past 42 years.
No, celebrating the killing of anybody is very sad ..I know some people who lost loved ones in terrorist bombings and have not been out onto the streets cleebrating like primitive cave people but rather feeling very sad and incredibly thoughtful...
As for dumping him in the sea for the fish to devour..after Abu ghreib etc etc..who can really believe this was done for the reasons stated or maybe they think our seas need terrorising?????..and how could that have been done in the "islamic way "..if you know anything about islamic burial rituals you will know this is ludicrous.

BangkokChickBoys · 02/05/2011 21:10

Team America: World Police - fuck yeah!

[irony]

nancy75 · 02/05/2011 21:11

From what I have heard on the news the body was buried at Sea because Saudi Arabia wouldn't take it and obviously they don't want anywhere to become a shrine

CheerfulYank · 02/05/2011 21:11

Burial at sea is acceptable in Islamic beliefs.

The body is supposed to be dealt with as soon as possible; would you like it to lie around while countries bicker about who is supposed to take it?

deemented · 02/05/2011 21:12

"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."
--Martin Luther King, Jr.

Appropriate, i think.

hotcrossSES · 02/05/2011 21:16

deemented - yes, very appropriate. Thank you, it puts it very well.

gypsymummy · 02/05/2011 21:19

Burial at sea only if the muslim in question is at sea and there is no immediate land ..they could have buried him in an unmarked grave like saddam hussein..and in accordance with the salafy beliefs which bin laden adhered to and his followers worldwide shrines are prohibited..i suggest research for those in doubt .

CheerfulYank · 02/05/2011 21:19

As far as I know there was no immediate land.

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