To ask whether or not people here believe in homeopathy?

[DaisyLovesMetronidazole]

I don't at all.

However, I'm not out for a bunfight!

Just curious, as was surprised by the response of a certain group to this question today.

OK. So everyone seems to agree that homeopathy works because of the placebo effect. And that if you know that you are being given a placebo it won;t work. So it's therefore OK for homeopathists to lie like troopers to their clients about the homeopathic dilution, water memory and so on in order for the placebo to work. Huh?

I don't see the problem. Other placebo studies may have been deceptive, but they have shown an effect. So I see no ethical problem telling people about that effect.

Because you said it was easy to understand? And I said it wasn't?

Glad you are not dismissing the effect of placebo but a shame that you cannot see its value in homeopathy.

Also glad that apart from a few random people there is now proper conversation instead of childish abuse.

Actually, there has been some interesting research into the placebo effect in pain.

As with opioid drugs, the effect of placebo on pain is blocked by naloxone. It's related to descending serotonergic pathways and the release of endorphins.

It is, however, less well understood in skin conditions etc., but neurophysiology of the placebo effect is by no means left unstudied.

I think we are going off point but there are no side effects to Homeopathic Treatments while the most commonly prescribed medicine in the UK lists among the possibly side effects, severe muscle breakdown, pacreatitus, hepatitus, impotence, increase liver enzymes, memory loss and another top 5 lists stroke and death.

In my experience, Homeopathy can help with all sorts of illnesses without side effects and it is cheap!! Remedies cost pennies rather then pounds and studies also show long term health benefits to using Homeopathy rather than an escallation of medication that occurs as a result of long term use of some of the most commonly prescribed medicines. If only the Government / NHS could see this massive cost saving opportunity but we as a society are blinkered by the miracles of modern medicine at all cost rather than as and when appropriate.

Of course homeopathic treatments have no side effects. There's fuck all in them! Unless you have a water allergy, then I guess they might cause a problem.

Homeoepathic vaccinations -any pro-homeopaths want to comment?

The official homeopathic association did:
'
The practice of replacing conventional vaccines with homeopathic alternatives has been condemned by the Faculty of Homeopathy.

It said there was no evidence for homeopathic treatments being able to protect against diseases, and said patients should stick to conventional medicines' BBC news

A practice offered by registered homeopaths despite the official recognition from their own registered body that they do not work. Fill anyone with confidence in the practice?

Unvaccinated children are responsible for the continued presence of diseases that still kill children/cause miscarriage etc -from a friends experience) that are eradicable. And the evidence (yes -there is some in this instance -unike the whole practice of homeopathy -why so scared guys?) is available.

Surely a component of the placebo effect is the good feeling that comes from the belief that something positive is being done? For some people, that will be spending spondoolies on sugar pills; for others it might be something else altogether.

I have pretty severe psoriasis at the moment, and have done for a while now. I have almost exhausted the treatment options, but after being told that I may be eligible for the newest superduper most cutting-edge treatment, despite running out of my current meds, it has started to clear up a bit on its own. I can only put this down to feeling hopeful, and being more relaxed as a consequence. When I've run out of meds in the past, it has got much worse. There is definitely a stress element in most skin conditions.

I personally have no truck with homeopathy, as it strikes me as dishonest and scamming. I particularly object to the way it has unethically been used to substitute for clinically effective treatments for HIV in Africa, for example. The cultural transposition of Western middle-class mores kind of pollutes the concept of the placebo effect when it takes the place of clinically proven medicine. I don't like that people in Britain can just set up as a homeopath and rake in cash from the desperate or gullible. I rank it alongside spiritualists and mediums in that respect: many people think that if they give comfort to the bereaved, then fair play, but to me it seems fundamentally dishonest. The fact that some mediums and some homeopathists have convinced themselves of their intrinsic efficacy doesn't alter that basic situation, in my view.

Mistyb: your point about side effects is a good one.

Bof: so your hippy woo comment was just a throw away sneer with no personal truck behind it.

Coalition : your study and you claim to show there is no deception.

That is my point: there is always some deception. This is accepted by you, given your last post.

ps thanks Daisy. Not that I understand it, but I could always look it up!

According to Richard Dawkins, there's not enough water on the planet to dilute it sufficiently.

To be honest I don't see how you or even the most virulent anti-homeopaths could, in the light of this conversation, object to homeopaths saying here is a pill with its active ingredients diluted to ten gazillion times so there is no active ingredient, which it's been shown can work on your condition. Here are the side effects (nil).

I mean, that's all they did in that study. Result: statistically significant effectiveness.

I don't see how that follows, Goose, about the flippant comments. They are my feelings on homeopathy, and I don't think I've been inconsistent.

Chipppy: if you'd like to talk about the side effects and adverse events of vaccinations there's a place for you. There are a lot of threads for you to read through and who knows, you might learn something.

There am I, getting snide. Seriously chippy: there's a whole lot of stuff on the side effects of vaccinations and if you're interested in the risk - benefit analysis thereof, you could find it interesting.

MistyB: while I find it extremely difficult to agree with you on crediting the effects of homeopathy to anything other than placebo, your latest posts are jolly good.

If homeopaths said "here is a pill with its active ingredients diluted to ten gazillion times so there is no active ingredient, which it's been shown can work on your condition. Here are the side effects (nil)", I would have no problem with that at all. So why don't they?

BOF Homeopaths are qualified and train for at least three years.

Placebo effect - can be v. effective. No "Science" involved. End of.

chippy - have you had a homeopath offer homeopathic vaccinations to you? I would be interested to hear what their opinion was and how it was presented.

Misty, I know. But doesn't that make it a whole self-perpetuating gravy train?

I wish I was thick enough to believe in homeopathy. My life would probably be amazing.

My mum went to see a homeopath. She was open minded. She was told she could have a remedy that had been diluted or she could have little pills that had been 'charged'. Basically, the homeopath put them in a machine and 'charged' them. It was at this point my Mum decided she wasn't going back.