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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To be Gobsmacked that someone doesn't know who Nelson Mandela is?

91 replies

Skeptical · 24/03/2011 21:15

A very religious American lady was telling me all about how she has chosen to homeschool her children because she doesn't want them taught evolution. I was shocked enough by this, but then the conversation turned to history and what we are taught in English scools. I described how a big part of my GCSE's was about South African history and especially Nelson Mandela. Her response was "yes he was a great example of Englishness, oh you guys have done so much good in Africa"

I was completely shocked. I can't believe that someone doesn't know who he is and his history! It's even more alarming because this woman is homeschooling not only her own children but several others as well.

AIBU to think people who homeschool their children should do some sort of test to actually prove they know what they are on about?

OP posts:

mathanxiety · 25/03/2011 02:47

I recently spoke with someone whose oldest daughter had taken a trip to China with a choir. We talked about the trip and it turned out that the older DD had visited the city where a relative of mine had adopted their DD from an orphanage. She had never heard about Chinese orphanages, abandoned Chinese babies, never apparently wondered how so many people in the locality have managed to adopt Chinese girls (including one such child in her DD's and my DD's class).

moogster1a · 25/03/2011 06:37

Thing is, if she had only a little knowledge of Mandela which side of him would she tell the kids. The lovely old statesman side who deplores violence, or the younger terrorist side who said violence was necessary?

tabulahrasa · 25/03/2011 07:57

isn't it an American thing though?

Not in an American bashing way, but I'm under the impression that history taught in America is very much American History rather than world history

Original poster

Skeptical · 25/03/2011 08:05

But tabulah this woman was in her 40's, so in the early 90's when everything was happening and he was all over the news she would have been in her 20's. So not really even history, just general knowledge I supppose. How could she have missed it? Thats like someone 10 years ago hearing about Osama Bin Laden and thinking he was American! But then maybe I am overestimating American media and it wasn't really in the news even back then?

I am only 27 and went to a crappy school, yet I know who he is, where he is from and what he did. So does everyone else I have ever asked. (And I have asked a lot of people since my conversation with this woman!)

OP posts:

ithaka · 25/03/2011 08:07

I do find it odd that, in Scotland anyway, people need to have an honours degree in their subject specialism and a postgraduate qualification in education plus a years mentored teaching experience to be responsible for teaching a single subject. Yet someone with no qualifications could home school. It doesn't make sense to me. Either teachers need qualifications and experience, or they don't.

Morloth · 25/03/2011 08:08

Well, how much relevance does Nelson Mandela have to the midwestern bible belt?

How many of you know of all the significant historical figures?

Who can tell me (without googling!) what say Thomas Allbutt did?

You can't know about everything, there are probably things that I think are absolutely essential to existence that you have never even heard of.

Morloth · 25/03/2011 08:09

I bet she knows who Bin Laden is, do you think everyone in SA does?

Relevance is the key here, you can be intelligent and not know stuff.

thelittlestkiwi · 25/03/2011 08:46

I met a very lovely, smart American lady recently who had not heard of the tsunami in Indonesia. She had heard about the tsunami that hit Phuket though. It makes you wonder what the American media report when she knew about the deaths of a few thousand, which included a lot of tourists. But not the 180,000 Indonesians.

QwertyQueen · 25/03/2011 09:00

my SIL has decided to home school my nephew who is a bit of a whizz tennis player, so that he can attend all the tournaments....
Problem is, she is really REALLY thick. Sorry I know it sounds horrid to say but it is the truth of the matter. eg: She puts extra salt on her kids food cos she heard somewhere that it is good for them!
I worry about my nephew, if he doesn't become a pro tennis player, what will he be able to fall back on.......

LeroyJethroGibbs · 25/03/2011 09:03

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

LDNmummy · 25/03/2011 09:11

Quintessential I am under 25, as are my DP and all our friends bar a few who are a couple years older. We all know who Nelson Mandela is, but it may be because our backgrounds have allowed us a wider view on history than what is taught in many Eurocentric states.

Actually I know alot about his life, his marriage to Winnie, her unscrupulous ways of doing politics, his time incarcarated on Robben Island, their divorce, the Soweto Massacre and protests etc...

But then it is about having an expanded view on the world, politics and history.

OP she is a conservative, religious American who is home schooling her children out of a wish to keep them away from other perspectives on humanity and its development. Frankly I am not surprised she does not know who Nelson Mandela is, she probably does not know who Desmond Tutu or Che Guevara is either.

Bogeyface · 25/03/2011 09:12

poopnscoop I concede your point about your brother but I did say generally not all and it was supposed to be tongue in cheek :)

LDNmummy · 25/03/2011 09:14

And all you have to do is watch Fox News to see what American's are fed through the media, it explains alot IMO.

I have a friend who is having a baby with a guy from America, she is deperately trying to relocate him to here so her LO does not grow up in the American environment for all these reasons.

HumanBehaviour · 25/03/2011 09:24

I bet OP is British and got taught British history in school, South Africa is part of British history which is why OP knows so much about it.

South Africa has not played a missive part in American history which is why this american lady does not know much about its history.

It's got nothing to do with americans being taught "American history" and the brits being taught "world histoy", as someone put it.

I am sure Americans are taught world history in schools as well but they don't put the emphasis on former British colonies as British shools do.

mamsnet · 25/03/2011 09:41

I don't really understand why you are all assuming school is responsible either..

Did you not watch TV then?? Have newspapers lying around the house? My parents were not highly educated but I clearly remember the day Mandela was released.. If my memory isn't playing tricks on me it was a Sunday.. And we chatted about it at Sunday lunch..

LDNmummy · 25/03/2011 09:45

I don't know anyone who was taught about British colonies in school. More likely Henry the Eighth, Queen Elizabeth, the Romans, Vikings and all that subject matter, but nothing of places like South Africa and the colonies.

mamsnet · 25/03/2011 09:47

I was, actually! In Ireland..

bronze · 25/03/2011 09:49

Most of the time HE isn't about teaching the child. It's about enabling them to learn. So as long as you're willing and able to provide the child with the tools to learn it doesn't mean you have to know everything yourself first.

LDNmummy · 25/03/2011 09:50

Yes but that is not an example of the whole of Britain. And I was respondong to the following statement.

"I am sure Americans are taught world history in schools as well but they don't put the emphasis on former British colonies as British shools do."

I have never known British school's to put emphasis on teaching about Britains former colonies.

HumanBehaviour · 25/03/2011 09:51

LDNmummy, OP was:

"I described how a big part of my GCSE's was about South African history and especially Nelson Mandela."

piprabbit · 25/03/2011 09:51

I think that the lady heard the name Nelson Mandela, couldn't place it for a moment, but felt the need to keep the conversation going so she tried winging it. And failed. She is probably sitting somewhere kicking herself for putting her foot in her mouth.

If she is bad with names she may not have instant recall on other important names from the period (Margaret Thatcher, Gorbachev, Lech Walesa). Doesn't mean to say that she wouldn't do her research properly if she needed to.

FlorenceCalamityandJoanofArc · 25/03/2011 09:54

I don't think the British as a whole can slag Americans knowledge of others, you wouldn't believe the amount of Brits who don't know the difference between Dublin and Belfast, or indeed the fact that Ireland is not in the UK. And thats a country that you could practically swim to. Most people know nothing about the troubles and that was on the news for 30 years. They also know bugger all about European History.

It's all about perspective.

LDNmummy · 25/03/2011 09:54

It depends on how the curriculum for your area is structured and what topics are included for study. Maybe in your area it was taught but I have not seen evidence of it in any of the schools I, my DP or any of our friends or family members have attended. Only maybe lightly touched on, but never a main focus of study.

In fact, one of my friends who is studying her PGCE has had to overhaul a few leeon plans in which she included subject matter on colonialism or topics on slavery. It appears her mentor would not alloew her to teach it to her secondary school class.

bronze · 25/03/2011 09:55

hank you piprabbit. I've learned something new and interesting today. I had never heard of Lech Walesa until now. I don't think I'm stupid, just have never come across him before. I went to school too, shocking!

Just bookmarked a page on him so I can read up later.

bronze · 25/03/2011 09:55

Maybe not stupid, but unable to type.

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