to think that the formula companies are succeeding with their campaign to promote formula to be as good as breast milk...

[MissyKLo]

...when it isn't?

this article rang true in so many ways

www.analyticalarmadillo.co.uk/2010/10/how-breast-is-best-came-to-be.html

Breast milk is of course, full of amazing antibodies and nourishment etc that formula can never replicate - but the formula companies are winning in their campaign to make people believe that formula is as good as breast milk aren't they? A lot of people don't see bf as a big deal and that babies are 'perfectly fine' on formula. But what about all the benefits of breast milk and the fact that so many babies don't ever get these?

Breast milk cannot be beaten on so many levels so why are the formula companies allowed to get away with this?!!!!!!

Just wondering what you all think of big business that spews out poisonous emissions regardless of their environmental impact, factories emitting chemicals into the rivers, the decimation of the rainforests?

Formula manufacture uses palm oil, one of the biggest culprits when it comes to the destruction of the rainforests. All those cows take up land that could be used for growing food, not to mention the methane emissions. If everybody formula fed the ecological impact would be totally devastating. There is a great article on this which I will try to find.

By supporting formula companies, by which I mean buying their products, we are supporting an industry that is causing real environmental and ecological damage (not to mention causing the deaths of countless numbers of babies in the developing world along the way, but I presume everyone knows that). It is far from being purely a matter of personal choice which nobody else should care about, any more than a personal decision not to bother recycling or a decision to use a gas guzzling car.

By supporting formula companies, by which I mean buying their products, we are supporting an industry that is causing real environmental and ecological damage (not to mention causing the deaths of countless numbers of babies along the way but I presume everyone knows that). So personally, while I did not have a choice but to use formula with my DS, I refused - then and now - to buy any other product made by those companies because I hate everything they stand for.

As for not advertising first milks, the company websites are a terrific exercise in "when is advertising NOT advertising". Supplying information about first milks at my individual request - yeah right.

It's awful.

all - and I do mean ALL that matters to big business is £££££!

They don't care about anything else and they never will.

any claims they make to care are only made because they think by making them, they will get our money.

They don't care about the environment. That's the future. that's someone else's problem. that's not this year's profits.

Oh the old "linked" phrase,must be gospel then,gosh given that the vast majority of people had formula at some time in this country I'm surprised that as a nation we're still functioning. Thyroid too keep em coming,I'm sure we could blame in growing toenails too if we try hard enough.

So many people spectacularly missing the point.

what point?

you asked what people thought of big business that spew out etc etc

I said I think that they don't care.

Oh I knew that would happen! Sorry, that was just a despairing comment on the thread as a whole. I should have added a emotion.

Why do you care?

Are you feeding your baby formula? No? well then what's it to you what other people feed their babies?

Do you know what does the most harm to the image of breastfeeding? People like the op and her ilk who spout on and on and on about it and the evils of formula and the evils of the formula companies and the damage they do to the good name of breastfeeding. The only reason why women feel guilty for not being able to bf isn't because of the over-inflated risks, (20% more risk of gastro enteritis worldwide equals almost neglidgeable in the western world when the 3rd world has a much higher risk), it's because other women see fit to judge them for it and somehow claim superiority because they managed to do what so many other women either can't or choose not to do.

If I ever had another baby I would seriously consider not even trying to bf and you know why? Because I wouldn't want to be associated with the judgemental, self-righteous image that is portrayed by some of the women who droan on and on about it.

The more you waffle on about breastfeeding, the more negative an image you give breastfeeding women. You might want to think about that.

WannaBe - I know that's directed at the OP, but for my answer as to why I care I would direct you about 4 posts back.

Make that 6 posts.

but there are lots of other things that damage the environment. I imagine you drive a car? That you drink coca cola? have gas central heating? take holidays abroad and the list goes on. Formula feeding is just one tiny part of our lives, and if you don't formula feed you will still be doing something else that either supports a large unethical company or does serious damage to the environment. So that's not a valid argument I'm afraid.

If you really want to save the planet Gaelic I suggest you go vegan,don't use cotton,don't use a car etc etc.

We're doing well formula now destroying the planet as well as world health,now are you sure we can't pin war on it too. Surely Iraq could be linked somehow if we just try hard enough

Well now you come to mention it, wasn't it aledged when there was talk of blowing up aeroplanes, that they were planning to put explosives in bottles of formula?

Yes breast is best blah de blah but OP why do you need to start so many threads about it? You either want to cause a ruck or are truly obsessed, either way some therapy may be in your best interests.

You are all saying it is purely a matter of personal choice. You ask why anyone else should care. I told you why people should care. Take it or leave it.

Oh yes Wannabe!!!!!

That sooooo has to be on the list- increased risk of airline explosion.

And the fact remains that for 98% of women it is an unnecessary product. Anyhow, I promised myself I would not get drawn into this and I won't. I will truly lose the will to live, and get a very sore head to boot.

but my point isn't why people should care about how they feed, that is their choice. My point is why anyone should care about how anyone else feeds, which is in fact none of anyone's business.

But really all these threads do and all this breastfeeding hysteria does is make people look like nutters.

People don't find the concept of bf weird, they find the image of the outspoken breastfeeders weird.

I know- who cares if women ff for convenience or so they can have a night away from their child- god forbid a mother do something that benefits THEM

I am really not sure that the no-holds-barred AIBU topic is necessarily the best place for a reasonable debate about this, but there's some fascinating stuff on this thread all the same.

Those who already know me will be aware that I am absolutely not interested in forcing women who don't want to breastfeed to do it; my aim is to influence those who can do something about it (those who hold public purse strings, for instance) to put breastfeeding support on the agenda. I have been, imo, rather successful at that (more on that soon).

Those who don't know me - well, read the last paragraph!

And by breastfeeding support, I don't mean lots of breastfeeding nazis (are we STILL using that? Can we use "judgy-smugger" instead, please? Look, here's why!) judgy-smuggers sitting in a room, wearing woven lentils and looking disparagingly at other women. I mean more sensitive language, more understanding of, ahem, how breastfeeding works, why it is important (and it is, you know - if it isn't, why are so many people posting so angrily about it?), more empathy, more consistent information and far less myth and misinformation.

My ultimate aim is for any woman who wants to breastfeed to be able to do it for as long as she wants. And yes, some of the women who want to will be unable to, some for physiological reasons and others for reasons of circumstance (though if bf were recognised as important in wider society, many of those circumstances would melt away) - and that is also something that, with the right support, the right language and the right approach can be managed so that nobody is left distraught or feeling guilty.

Because - guilty? For wanting to do something for your baby, but being let down by those who should've supported you? Those who should've known better, BEEN better? I would heartily suggest you get angry, not guilty. Be sad, by all means - absolutely. It IS sad when you can't do something you want to do for your baby. But guilty won't help you and it won't help those who come after you. Angry will - angry with those who didn't help you when you needed it most. Tell people how important breastfeeding was to you, how let down you felt, how desperate you were to do it (if you were - and many women are), how sad you were when it didn't work and nobody helped you.

And maybe if we can all get bf higher up the agenda, then it won't matter how other women feed their babies, because they'll be feeding them the way they want to. At the moment, it matters - it really matters. Or there wouldn't be nearly 300 posts on this thread (and x zillion other threads like it).

Wash your mouth out Gemsy,mums doing something for them,you do know in order to even be half a mum you have to sacrifice yourself on the alter of motherhood-oh and of course brestfeed

let's see - how many unnecessary products do we use throughout our lives:

Alcohol, Cafeen, tobacco (now there's a company that makes a fortune without any regard to the damage its product causes), chocolate, any food that is pre-packaged and not home-made, coca cola, any other fizzy drinks, shall I go on? I'm sure I could do so at considerable length.

Gemsy - have you heard of a breast pump? Some women use them so they can have a night away from their child if they want one :)

HBW - I think the problem starts when someone who ff takes offense at someone who mentions that there is an increased risk of x,y,z - the thread pretty much deteriorates from there with bfers being accused of being militant/fascist etc when they try to correct incorrect information that is posted about bf or its benefits. The sad thing is that the initial post wasn't meant to cause any offense - it was simply pointing out a fact.

milamae - why do you think someone who breastfeeds can't do something for themselves and why do you think bf is some big sacrifice? You really do seem to have some issues....

nope, I don't feel angry, or sad or guilty that I couldn't bf.

The only thing that makes me is when people seem to insist that A it is incredibly rare for women to not be able to bf, as there is no evidence to support this statement, and B, that it is sad when women choose to feed their babies formula, (personally I think that it's sad when women choose to go back to work, but would I make that statement on here in a judgemental way? I don't think so), and C, that women should somehow blame others for the inability or choice not to bf - the midwives, the doctors, the health visitors, the lack of literature, and most importantly the formula manufacturers, even though formula advertising is illegal, when in actual fact it is not and should never be a blame game.

Article here in case anyone's at all interested.

I really admire people like HBW who manage to stay calm and reasonable at all times (pretty much). I am feeling far from calm and reasonable tonight (bad day at work), and I've seen enough of these threads recently to last me a very long time, so I'll try not to post again. I just wish so much that any attempt to discuss formula promotion and its impacts was not always shouted down by accusations of making individual ff mothers feel guilty.