Not fitting in - AIBU or just paranoid?

[biryani]

Help! I don't seem to fit in with my DD's friends' mums and I would like some opimions on this. I am happy to be flamed - any advice would be greatly appreciated. I live in an urban area which is reasonably "nice" and on the face of it I should have loads in common with them. We have similar incomes, similar backgrounds and our DCs attend the same school. However, I seem to have a completely different outlook from them. I have always sought to to thoughtful and generous towards their DCs, I am always there when they want a favour and their DCs are always welcome at our house. I want a simple, uncomlicated childhood for my DD, and want her to grow up to be generous, thoughtful and to look out for other people. I am quite down to earth in my attitudes towards life, and would expect others to hold similar attitudes, given our similar backgrounds. However, I find the opposite to be the case. I find them cliquey and self-absorbed. Most have been able to cling on to their careers thanks to the (free) support of others. Most favour "activities" over just playing, at great expense. I cannot afford this lifestyle as I can only work part time. None of this would bother me but I feel that, as a result of my not fitting in, that other mums (and sometimes children) sideline my DD. She's an only child and loves company, but I feel that myself and her are looked down upon by these people. I'm not sure if this is just paranoia. Do I need to just get over myself? Am I jealous of their self-satisfied "niceness"? In short, am I BU? Thanks in advance for your comments!

Would you really want to be friends with those mothers? Or to have your dd be friends with their delightful children? I'll bet there are plenty in the playground who share your views and outlook but maybe they are quietly hovering on the sidelines.

I have an only child and I don't really fit in either, different lifestyle and interests I suppose. I know you are worried about your dd though, not yourself. Does she ask friends to come over after school, and if so, is the favour ever returned?

Your comment re them being able to 'cling on' to their careers with (free) help, may speak volumes though.

why oh why oh why do women want to be friends with people simply because their children are coralled in the same room as theirs

get a life of your own

I don't think YABU, sometimes we just don't click with other people. DD is an only too and I have nothing in common with most of the people at her school.
While we aren't on the breadline, we don't drive the latest Porsche people carrier nor do we own our thatcehd house.
I just let DD get on with it TBH, if she wants her friends to come over they are welcome, if she wants to go to their houses that's OK too.

I would try to make other friends, join an activity in the Evenings and meet people with similar interests to you.

You may be making a mistake expecting people with similar incomes and backgrounds to have the same outlook as you though. That's a little prescriptive if you don't mind me saying. Live and let live.

Anyway, I read it that this was not about you wishing/needing to make friends, but ensuring dd is not left behind. I think you should just carry on being your own sweet self and inviting her friends around to play, encouraging her to make friends with whomever she likes.

YAB a bit U. you say they look down at you but actually in your post you are looking down at them. reference to "clinging onto careers thanks to the (free) support of others" comes across as very bitter and judgey of others life choices and situations. also the stuff about not affording the activities that others have - and therefore putting that choice down because they can afford it - it sounds very resentful.

can't you just accept that you have differences but you can learn from each other and get along? let down your guard and be open and honest about your different financial situation. you might find that your sense of being "looked down upon" is more about your own attitude than theirs.

YANBU, but don't worry too much about the parents, you don't have to be fiends with them, or even like them! If your DD likes their kids, that's fine, let the children be friends but leave it at that. If it means you have their kids round more than they invite DD back, does it really matter as long as DD is happy? We had other children round a lot more than my DC were invited to others'. I've never fitted in with any of my DCs friends' parents either, but that's people.

Can your DD start another activity outside of school (eg brownies) so that she can have other friends as well as the school ones? Or see if there's something you can do together where you can both make new friends?

Some people take time to take stock of their surroundings and get the 'feel' of a new group of people; it feels awkward for a while. Likewise, some established 'groups' take a while to absorb newcomers in; it's self-preservation and a bit of rigidity.

As far as lifestyles go, you never do know what is going on behind closed doors. An idyllic lifestyle isn't always what it seems to be.

Keep being friendly, involving your DD, and just be yourself. Don't make excuses for who you are. You're good enough.

YABU.

I don't think "similar incomes" and "similar backgrounds" or living in a "nice" area mean someone is going to be a better friend at all.

Better to find people you get on with, and whose company you enjoy. Widen your outlook to include people you might not have already considered as potential friends, and you could be pleasantly surprised :)

Good post Rannaldini.

I'm a bit about the OP's snippy comment on other women who have been "able to cling on to their careers thanks to the (free) support of others". If that attitude comes across in your approach no wonder they are loathe to include you, OP.

Thanks all for your comments. I AM dead jealous of other people's ability to return work because of free childcare, and I know I am not the only one! It's encouraging to know that others feel the same as I do though - as an only child myself growing up in a completely different sort of community I feel for my DD (perceived) isolation. I know I need to get out more, though!

Biryani, are you me? Seriously was considering posting a similar thread to this.

My problem in a nutshell is the same as yours - only child, although we do struggle financially. Did have group of friends but seem to be getting blanked by them. My heart breaks for DD as she is getting pushed out too - the other mums are blatant in their "networking" its depressing. I have decided to give wide berth to mothers but can't help but feel this is bad for my DD

I hate all the playground politics i just hate it, i swore i wouldnt do it, i did :(

I know exactly what you mean about the career thing too, its not that i care what other mums do, but dont be making me feel bad because my bloody career went down the toilet - it doesn't make my child less worthy as a play date than yours FFS!

Agh how tough this is. It's your daughter you're really bothered about, not you.

Sorry to say this but people like this are nicer when you are horrible to them, when you say no, and look over your shoulder when talking to them to see if there's someone better over there.

On the other hand they could just be terribly busy.

I think you should think of this as a "job". Aim: to make your daughter happier with a bigger social circle. Means: do what you need to do, be ruthless.

There's a book called the Rules of Work which is about walking the walk for success in te offce, and I think there's also one called the Rules of Life which would cover your situation.

Being nice isn't working for you. Toughen up. Good luck.

so what if some get free childcare - turn it on it's head :

okay so you would pay for nursery/CM BUT you would get care tailored to your child's age and stage of development, age and stage-appropriate activities and experiences rather than just hanging around at the GPs being fed sweeties and being indulged totally whilst the GPs seethe inwardly at their loss of freedom after their childrearing days were thought to be over*

*sweeping generalisation about GP care here, I know, but for the purposes of this thread roll with it

When I think back to my days at school, it would not have influenced my friendship choices one jot to know that my mum was friends with their mums.

I'm sure your daughter and her classmates will eventually sort themselves out into friendship groups regardless of whose mum is friends with whom.

I think YABU.

People are people and we all have different attitudes to life. Some want careers, some want to stay at home, some want to climb mountains. It's unreasonable to expect people to have the same attitudes as you, no matter what their background, income or the area they live.

The key is separating your daughter's social life from your own. You don't have to be great friends with her parents. As long as you're polite and nice to them, surely you can arrange playdates.

Your post is rather strange. You have all these expectations - 'simple, uncomplicated childhood', 'down to earth' and all the oddness about careers. Why does any of it matter? I am fairly unconventional in my lifestyle, activities etc. and have friends who are similar to me, but also more conservative friends. It's fine - we respect each other and accept that all people aren't the same. You're worrying too much about what they think. If you're polite, respectful and nice to other people, things will be ok.

Just be yourself and let others be themselves.

Yes but it doesn't matter sometimes para: the mums invite back the children they like the mums of, until they get to about y5-6.

I a bit bemused by all this playdate stuff and mother's outdoing each other at the school gate. When I was at primary school, we played with neighbours after school - ALWAYS outside. When it was dark/raining we had to go in. Playdates never existed at all. You normally only got invited INSIDE someone's house when they were have a birthday party. The neighbourhood kids were never the same as the people I mixed with at school. Parents never had ANY input into friendships at all, beyond the odd mutter about some child being a "bad influence".

Dd goes to an afterschool club as I work FT. She has friends from other classes as well. We live nowhere near the school so SHE plays with the local kids too at the weekend. I will invite the odd child over at the weekend from time to time. I have very little to do with most of the other parents (though have done the odd coffee/bbq invitation) - my friends are MY friends.

oP, invite a child back and do something really,really amazing so that the child begs the mum to do it again. Or invites yours. And be really really cool with the mum and not too smiley and helpful so you don't look desperate. And mention other popular children that she's friends with.

I don't think it's that uncommon a situation; I've felt much the same about toddler friends, and a friend of mine said she walked around S London feeling like a pariah for 18 months with her first until she found someone she clicked with.

What put it into perspective for me was someone pointing out that for so much of your life, the people you meet are filtered - you meet them through friends and work or uni so the chances are that you're going to have something in common. But, suddenly, when you have children, you are suddenly amongst a pretty random set of people. All you have in common is that you have had a child at the same time. So it can take much longer, to make good friends, and you will meet a lot more people that you don't necessarily get on with.

And I've come to to this only through several long dark nights of misery, thinking, but I used to get on with people when I worked, why isn't this happening now. I'm now much more laid back about it, and just enjoy the people I do get on with.

Interestingly, I also have an only and haven't gone back to paid work despite having been quite career-orientated beforehand - I wonder if we are perhaps a) hoping for more from our social lives and b) less likely to meet the people we might have got on with as a result. (And I also hate endless 'activities' too, so you have my sympathy on that one too).

"If you're polite, respectful and nice to other people, things will be ok"

Carmen, you're lovely, but this often isn't true.

You're right, some people will still be horrible or unpleasant, but you don't really need to force them into your life.

I think what confuses me about the OP's post is that she thinks that wanting your child to grow up thoughtful and kind etc. is the reserve of people who live in certain areas, certain backgrounds etc.

Everyone with some rare exceptions wants that for their children.

I don't really understand what 'down to earth' and 'simple and uncomplicated' mean. These are really vague concepts and my definition is probably different from the OP's.

I struggle to see how jobs, activities and so on matter when it comes to social relationships with other children. Your children will make friends with who they make friends with. If the other child's parents are reasonable, they will agree to playdates and so on. If they're not, then the children will continue to see each other at school. No biggie.

Your social life is separate though. If you want friends yourself, it's best to forget about the children and to find people you personally click with through your own hobbies, activities and so on.

We do playdtes because none of the kids live near to one another. I never expect to make friends with the parents though...they mostly work full time and s a result they are not ofen home before 6 or 7pm...they sometimes ask my DD to go out with them at weekends...I never make these parentss feel they have to invite back...I am a SAHM and have time to entertain the kids and I like it...

I know that one day soon I won't be part of my DDs social life and so I just make the most of it now...I honestly dont care about being friends with the parents though...I think you sould seperat your own and your DD's social life OP...they won't collide for long.

At secondary (which comes round fast) they'll be friends with a whole new bunch...

Portofino...out of interet how did your DD make friends with the local kids if they're not in school together?

there are some kids locally who my DD isn't in school with but they're never allowed out it seems.

I let my 6.5 year old play on te front lawn of our house (quiet cul-de-sac) and I watch from the kitchen...there's only little boys from the surrounding streets and they whizz about on bikes...the local girls seem to be kept indoors!

One lttle girl stares out of her bedroom window and waves at my DDs but her Mum who always says hello) never let's th kid out!