to be angry that Ann Summers has a real woman in underwear in their shop window?

[1eve]

Walking down Market Street in Manchester on Friday I saw a couple of guys taking pictures with their phones at a shop window. When I turned to see what they were photographing I found that there was a woman posing in sexy underwear in a window display. The shop was Ann Summers, although it had changed its name to ManSummers as a publicity thing to get guys to come into the shop and buy valentine gifts for their girlfriends. Now women buying vibrators and dressing up if they want is not a problem for me, although Ann Summers has always leant towards getting women to please men in my view, but sexual desire is never pc anyway so its a tricky subject. But this felt like it crossed a line.
If I'd been walking through town (it was the middle of the day) with my 2 boys, age 4 and 6, that is not what I want them to see. That a woman's role is to be placed on show like a piece of meat while men leer at her? (a group of guys were standing in front of the window laughing and staring, making comments). Is it just me or is this bloody degrading?

exactly. And it's the introduction of adult sexuality to the High street/children.

So what exactly is the problem?

The model is 'objectifying' herself? Her body, her decision... nobody is being forced to do that job.

Objectification is something that some people do - it's their problem, nobody elses. If I see a model wearing AS lingerie I might think, "I bet that lace is a bit scratchy", but I wouldn't have any views on the model, just the product. People aren't objects and it's sad to see that some women feel that way about other women.

Introducing adult sexuality to the high street and children... FGS, how many satellite channels, newspapers, magazines, etc. do that very thing? Is this window display just more 'in your face' somehow?

YANBU and I think it's a sign of how far women's and society's self respect has slipped that so many on this thread see nothing wrong with a woman marketing her body freely in public, for all ages to see.

Of course it is objectifying women to have a woman in sexy lingerie in a window. It is literally making her an object of desire.

All the satellite channels, newspapers, magazines, billboards, etc. are also to blame for putting all women in a position where we are seen as living sex dolls.

It's all part of the widely documented pornification of society that has resulted in young girls being socially required to give blowjobs and have f*-buddies and feel that they will be judged on little more than their appearance.

I would formally complain.

I feel that anything of this type is completely unacceptable
Did you complain?
I complained as the Ann Summers store in our local shopping centre has mannequins wearing stockings, peep hole bras and crotchless knickers
I don't find it acceptable
I don't want my girls to think that it is the norm

Live mannequins is wrong on so many other levels
Awful

How is this different to a mannequin in the window?

And a while ago La Senza had a huge photo of a woman (Kelly Brook or Gary Linekar's wife or someone like that) posing in underwear in the window - how is that different? Because it isn't a real live woman? Still the same thing - a woman or feminine form in underwear.

YANBU. I would complain. Is there nowhere a woman can go without being compelled to view the objectification of women? This reminds me of walking through Amsterdam and feeling nervous before turning a corner in case I had to see women 'advertising' themselves around them. I shouldn't have to be nervous about this, we shouldn't be compelled to have to see this just because we want to walk down the street, no woman should have to walk by men leering at those women in the windows. How can I explain to my dc that men and women are equal and equally worthy of respect if this is what we see as part of every day life FGS. And of course she was not 'just wearing underwaer'. If she was, there wouldn't be a live woman in the window.

Those people who 'can't see a problem' with this should have gone to Specsavers.

Do we really want our High Streets to resemble the red light district of Amsterdam?

Would you find it as Awful if it was a man in the window in little pants "Modeling"?

Do you avert your Children's eyes from every mans underwear campaign which ALWAYS involves some celeb with his package on display?

Or is this one of those situations where it's a case of "Men have been objectifying women for years and therefore hold all the power. Men CANNOT be Objectified"

Yes, I would find it awful to see a man in the window. But of course there is context to consider too. Ann Summers is not about selling or advertising 'just underwear' like a standard 5 pack from M&S. It's very sexualised stuff and just isn't appropriate in a High St. Why the hell should I have to explain to my 6 year ds, who did ask once outside an AS in our local shopping centre, why the woman in the window had a hole in the front of her pants?

VeryStressedMum - were there crowds of men standing in front of the La Senza picture making obscene comments and taking photos on their mobile phone?

I don't have a problem with my children being exposed to pictures of women modelling underwear. I do have a problem with them seeing crowds of men leching and making comments. Nothing wrong with adult sexuality but it should take place in private and definitely not where children might see it.

YANBU

I don't like the covers of many of the "lads mags" and the the likes of the star being on display in shops, often at child's eye height.

I don't like "sex encounter" establishments on the high streets.

I don't like prostitutes being advertised in my local free newspaper.

And for the same reasons I don't like this.

There is a huge difference between a woman on a beach in a bikini, a woman wandering around her house in her underwear, and a woman standing in a shop window in anne summers underwear on a normal high street with (obviously) a gang of men leering and taking photos.

I wonder if Mumsnet's "Let girls be girls" campaign would have anything to say about this.

All it does is reinforce the idea in our young people that women are there to display their bodies for men to leer over. Same message as they get from a lot of other outlets. Doesn't make it right though.

Of course it is objectifying women to have a woman in sexy lingerie in a window. It is literally making her an object of desire.

Quite frankly I dont see a problem with a woman being an object of desire.... why should that be wrong????

Some men are total knobs. I didn't see it so I can't in all honesty say what I would think if I walked past with my girls.
Though they wouldn't know what sort of a shop Ann Summers is, they would probably think it's like M&S.

But if anyone thinks a woman on a beach in a bikini is not a sexual display of their body needs to open their eyes! The only women I've seen in a bikini are the ones with knockout figures and they know what effect they are having on men.

squeakytoy - it reinforces the broader objectification of women, not just in a shop window but in the street and in the workplace.

Do I want my colleagues to see me as an object of desire? No I do not. Do I want my son to see women generally as "objects of desire"? No I do not.

And VSM, I don't know what beaches you are going to but many women with not amazing bodies wear bikinis.

I am certainly not looking for sex or sexual interest when I wear a bikini - that is ludicrous.

Verystressedmum if you honestly think that all women who wear bikinis on beaches do so to sexually arouse all the men around them then you are mistaken.

Many girls and women wear bikinis or go topless because they want a more "all over" tan, they think they look nice, they are fashionable.

I would further hazard a guess that most women in bikinis on the beach would be rather upset if they were surrounded by a group of men shouting obscenities at them and taking photographs with their mobile phone.

But this is an adult woman, wearing underwear, in a shop window. She's not a girl. Girls shouldn't behave as women do - that's part and parcel of parenting, no?

So... the tacky, nasty, inappropriate clothes for girls, "Juicy" emblazoned and so forth? Pole dancing kits for girls... nobody bought one? The advertisers missed a beat there, didn't they? I know that they're not sold now but how many were sold to parents who either thought they were a good idea or just succumbed to being pestered by their daughters who wanted to fit in with their peers?

The teens who stand about in the street showing midriffs, thongs on display, etc... some are really young. They seem to have no sense of keeping their bodies covered up. Who buys them this type of clothing?

I wouldn't let my daughter wear this stuff and I wouldn't buy it for her. What's ok for adults to do is not ok for children. They need to learn that and their parents need to understand that.

I'd say that all women want to be 'desired'. It's a message passed down through the ages and whilst children should stay children whilst they are so, you can't stop them growing up nor shield them from every advertising message that you don't agree with.

I suppose I'd say to my daughter... "This woman is earning her living, taking care of her body"... that kind of thing. Is that not positive?

Whoops that was to VSM rather than squeakytoy

lyingwitch the LGBG campaign has taken a stance on lads mags covers, which is a very similar thing to this.

How would you explain to you daughter about the gang of men shouting obscenities and taking photos on their mobile phones, and the fact that rather than reacting with upset/fear/anger/giving them the finger, she continues to pose and smile for them? What message does that send to your girls?

chandellina Mon 14-Feb-11 10:34:17
squeakytoy - it reinforces the broader objectification of women, not just in a shop window but in the street and in the workplace.

Do I want my colleagues to see me as an object of desire? No I do not

I assume you dont parade around the office in stilettos and a bikini, so I am sure you will be quite safe.

It would be along the lines of being in a workplace with page 3 calendars up everywhere (as they used to be).

I would not want to work in that environment.

When I am walking down the high street I do not wish to be confronted with images and situations designed to sexually arouse random passing men. That's not what the high street is for.

SardineQueen.... Firstly, I wouldn't want to see my daughter 'giving the finger' to anybody.

Secondly, women receive verbal abuse whether they are standing in a shop window in underwear or are standing in a bus queue or anywhere else. It's nothing to do with the activity, it's to do with the pinheaded men that behave this way. I'd be teaching my daughter that people who shout abuse are the ones with the problem - and so they are. I certainly wouldn't be teaching her to react with 'fear or anger'.

LeninGrad... I'd agree that it's unnecessary. There are lots of things about today's society that I find distasteful. I think that there isn't a 'level' though that is going to 'fit all'.

SardineQueen... Those images aren't intended to 'arouse', they're intended to generate sales. If women (maybe men also) didn't buy or wear them, the shop(s) (as a 'storefront' anyway), wouldn't exist.

I wonder how much AS business is done online as compared to storefront?

Lying if you saw a gang of men hurling obscenities at a woman on the street and she gave them the finger, you would be disgusted with her????

You don't understand how a woman when surrounded by a gang of men shouting obscenities might react with fear or anger???

Are you serious?

If you think that the covers of lads mags aren't designed to arouse men, and that when the name of anne summers is changed to "man summers" and they put live women in saucy undies in the window that it's not designed to arouse men, then I'm a bit baffled TBH.