to be stunned at the rates some nannies expect to be paid?

[headfairy]

Ok, I'm putting this here because if I put it in childcare I'll have hundreds of nannies hating me for evermore... However, recently I've had two nannies tell me they want in excess of £15ph net. Gross that up and that's what I earn, a graduate with 20 years experience working in a very high pressured environment with deadlines that have to be met every hour. Both of them have 10 years of nannying experience, but still....

I've had several more who want £12ph net, with less than 5 years nannying experience, and a few more who want £10ph net and yet they have almost no experience, and who've sent me cvs filled with spelling mistakes and grammatical errors.

I'm going to get flamed I know... I've got the hard hat ready.

No chance of that Iwanttobeafairy, huge corporation, salaries are nationally negotiated with union, very little opportunity for individuals to have pay rises beyond the standard company wide pay rises, which for the past two years have actually been pay freezes.

For £15ph net I'd want a flipping amazing nanny, who leaves our home sparkling (the bits the kids use anyway) and a home made meal in the oven. My experience has been very far from that.

Ahh you see I also did all the children's meals and ironing and cleaned their rooms. You're employing the wrong people.

My boss also employed a cleaner and a gardener. They were both in very good jobs, I did earn alot back then :)

Have to say my boss told me that you should expect to pay a percentage of your salary to your nanny (and I can't remember what it is now - but it was something stupid, hence why I'm a SAHM :o).

oooh just noticed your username - and mine

It's in the contract about the cleaning and cooking, and the people I've been seeing haven't inspired me that they'll cook much more than pasta and baked beans. I know children like simple food but I want ds's diet to broaden, he's very stuck in a rut. For £15 an hour I really want someone who'll have him eating curries and chowing down on steaks within a few months.

My name is a little bit ironic I have to say, no real affinity to fairies I'm afraid :o

Let's be blunt. Of course, it's your career & your life, but I'm struggling to see much incentive in staying employed. (But I have an agenda... I recently became a SAHM) You said you're concerned about getting back into your industry in a few years when the kids return to school - but are you expecting a major uplift in salary in the meantime?

I pay my cleaner £10 hr !!

headfairy I'm also in Surrey and I think part of the problem is that there are some nannies who are on extraordinary salaries.

The average nanny is not, but they hear the stories of friends who are earning in excess of £40k and so think that is normal.

£10 net seems to be what most people I know pay, although I have a friend who recently lost her in excess of £40k nanny as she forze her pay once her youngest was in school FT

I also think you get a worse deal if you are employing for PT hours. There seems to be little difference in the salary of a PT and FT nanny.

And yes yes of course your children are your most treasured possessions but actually it doesn't take a genius to look after them and frankly my mind boggles that most nannies earn more than caridac nurses and teachers

blimey i'm also in wrong job! they don't even have to be qualified do they?

would an au pair be any better? not that i have a clue about au pairs

I live in Essex and work closely with a nanny agency. The majority of their nannies are on £8 per hour net. When London based nannies apply they are horrified at this 'low' pay! personally I think paying in excess of £350 a week net is a lot of childcare which then begs the question of how much you need to earn before a nanny is uneconomical.

It is a shame as for 2 or more children, this does tend to work out as the best option and much less stressful for mums going back to work.

If our nannies started demanding £10 per hour net we would be bust as there just isn't the budget for it in most working families I liase with.

Also thinking I am in the wrong part of the sector. I am in Early Years, ABYSMALLY paid, but I love it, so that helps. The sector is also moving towards increased professionalism because of the (growing..I wish), recognition that best practice A) requires trained and motivated staff, but also b), since children spend so long in Early Years settings, the IMPACT of this on their further education has to be noted. That is... We are (good practice wise), TEACHING children life skills and hopefully supporting their natural development in a holistic and reflective way.

So I'd want a nanny who knew abut learning theory, how children acquire language, the fundamentals of mathematical reasoning etc etc; because the rest of the (largely underpaid), sector has to meet these sorts of standards.

In some countries you are required to have a TEACHER in all EY settings...

So if she can provide this then she IS the equivalent of a private teacher... and should be paid accordingly... n proof of qualification and experience.

So I am going to look at nannying... ;-)

but....the vast majority of nannies do a simlar job to childminders who incidently are much more monitored than nanies in terms of government expectations. Does this mean that they should demand hiked rates as 'private teachers?'

Just a thought...

Blackswan I'm not expecting major rises, but once I can get back to doing fully flexible hours, plus nights I can expect my salary to go up by about £10k a year, which makes it much more worthwhile to hang on to the job. Our childcare costs will also go down substantially (hopefully) once the children are in ft education. I'm dreaming of a day when I have disposable income.

NancyDrew I suspect you're right. Our previous nanny left to someone who's paying double what we paid, they're both lawyers, work 17 hour days, live in a huge immaculate house and have 2 nannies for three children (as well as gardener, cook and driver) so it's not surprising they're paying her more.

To be honest the job is totally different, and our previous nanny hates it but she can't turn down the money. She is totally in loco parentis. In her words they've had children but they aren't parents, so there's a lot of responsibility placed on her as the nanny. And for this I agree, she should be paid substantially. The hours are very long too, sometimes she has to stay over (they have a self contained flat for her to use). One bloke I've had a cv from worked for a very high profile actor and also said he wanted £15ph net, so no guessing where he got that rate from.

southeastastra we don't have room for a live in aupair, only got a three bed house and one tiny bathroom. Plus dd is only 13 months so I think a bit young for an au pair. My sister has an au pair for her two, but they're 4 and 8. I would definitely consider a live out au pair (do such things exist?) if dd was older.

Jinx I do think some nannies are in danger of pricing themselves out of the market too. With working practices changing so much, we're all working longer hours and commuting so much more, as I see it more and more people need the flexibility of a nanny - not many nurseries can take children beyond 7pm, and how tired must those children be anyway - ds is dropping by 7pm. But ordinary people won't be able to afford nannies if they're charging the sort of money only the very wealthy can afford.

MrsDo do you want a job? :o

NBU but because it goes by word of mouth salaries go up very quickly.

The earning curve is very steep in the first few years then plateaus. I think it's because people advertise for 'a nanny' and say they're paying £10/hour (grrr net) expecting a qualification and 5+ years experience. They get applicants with 2 years experience, so rates go up to attract v experienced nannies. Then an extremely qualified candidate comes along and insists on being compensated appropriately and it goes up again.

There's also the artificial pressure that nannies exert on their employers - they know it's tough to find another nanny so they have a bargaining chip for payrises which inflates them above the 'norm'.

Very highly paid nannies are often in extremely demanding jobs (24/5 or 6 care with extensive travel etc). But then nannies in standard jobs hear of someone earning that and think they'll try their luck.

The net pay thing also means most nannies have no idea how much they're reallly costing.
Lots of reasons.

Things have certainly changed.
25 years ago when i was a newly qualified nursery nurse, I worked as a nanny for £35 a week.
Monday to friday 8 til 6.30
:o

Live out au pairs are.....inexperienced untrained nannies - but living out they want nanny wages. They're worse value than trained nannies IMO!

Why are childminders paid so poorly in relation to nannys?

They're not in theory. They're SE so paid per child. 3 under 5s at London CM rates (can be £6/hour) plus 3 before/after schools means a gross daily taking larger than a nanny's and some expenses are deductible.

But CMs need to be competitive and nannies don't in the same way. They apply for jobs and negotiate up!

Firstly i think yabu to put a price on the care of your dc ...It does seem alot but if they are fully trained with lots of experience covering hours a childminder and nursery cant then so be it unfortunatly - I have a friend who is a london nanny ,live out on about £500 a week but for quite a lot of hours - I was a nanny in wales in 2005 and was on £1075 gross a month for 2 children 8-6.30 mon-thurs :o

Slippersandpjsmum - they can look after several children at a time and are no necessaraly on a bad take home wage after tax if they are on their maximum number of children a day :)

stoppinching, of course I have to put a price on caring for my children. In an ideal world I'd pay millions to someone who'd love them as much as I do, and care for them the way I do (actually if I had millions I'd be at home with them) but I don't, and as someone further up said it's a job of work and as such attracts a market value.

I think thats a lot TBH. We pay our nanny (6 years experience but all with us) £10 an hour net. Other friend have good nannies (less than 5 years experience though) and pay £8-£9 - this is north west London - and told me I am overpaying....

Nannies often assume that their bosses as very well paid... my nanny was shocked when I told her that she got around half my salary.

My nanny has no qualifications though other than a basic correspondence course that I helped her do. So yes I think £15 net is mad.

Ooh sorry can i change that to a yanbu ...i was being a bit hasty in my reply and actually your right of course we would all pay millions if we could ...i agree with whoever said you name YOUR price then leave it to a nanny to come to you and agree :)

I pay £10 ph net. She does the cleaning too whilst the children are at school.

I think that this is a fair wage for a nanny and I could not afford much more.

you see swarski, I'd pay £10net for a nanny who cleaned too. DD has a nap in the afternoon, and ds is at preschool in the afternoons so there is time to at least tidy the kitchen.

Our previous nanny was lovely and so kind to the children, but she wasn't the tidiest person in the world. I was prepared to put up with that because she was so nice. She didn't ever do any cooking though, I would bulk cook and she's often use stuff I'd made from the freezer. We paid her £8.50 net and she had 9 years experience. She would have stayed if it was a 5 day job, but full time for me is 3 days a week (work 12-14 hour days) so not an option.

Would it be utterly unethical of me to try and poach her back? I do know someone who wants to nanny share for the two days I don't need a nanny for. How ruthless can I be when trying to woo her back? :o

Why do people work in nurseries when they could be paid so well as a nanny?

That's a lot. Nannies round here (SW London) earn £10 net or aim to take home about £500 a week - and that's top wage for a qualified nanny, English speaker etc. Many nannies earn less but they do usually also get perks eg, car/food etc.

Are nannies in short supply where you live? That might bump up the wage. Here in London there is a plentiful supply.

I couldn't afford to work if I had to pay £15 net (about £20 gross?), it's more than I earn.