To think that taxing high earners even more would actually be a bit unfair?

[bubbleymummy]

I hear this suggested a lot on mumsnet and I really disagree with it. High earners are paying a huge contribution in tax already - thousands and sometimes 10s of thousands more than a lot of people who are clamouring for them to be taxed even more! Why should they be punished for having a highly paid job? How would you like handing nearly half your income over to the government? I think we should be thankful that we do have high earners who are already making a significant contribution. We would be a lot worse off if we drove them away with higher taxes!

Higher income tax is a disincentive to work. DH and I both used to be higher rate taxpayers - now we're both part time for various reasons. We don't have to pay so much tax and have time to do our own cooking and cleaning instead of eating out and employing a cleaner (so we're not redistributing our money to the local economy so much). Now DD is at secondary school I could go back to working FT but really it isn't that attractive a proposition.

I sometimes wonder if it would be possible to use sales taxes more progressively - zero rate all real essentials, moderate tax on 'normal' non-essentials , high tax on luxury goods and services. (would probably be a nightmare to decide what fell into which category so maybe that idea is a non-starter)

Sorry MM! I just saw that. I read the table in a hurry. :) phew!

To the poster who said they would limit salaries in their company to £60k - it is very likely you would't be able to attract certain skill sets as other companies will pay significantly more for them. I agree with he ethos and in an ideal world the gap between low earners and high earners wouldn't be so wide but in reality my DH for example would not be in a position to afford to take the pay cut necessary to work for your comapny -and why should he when the 'going rate' for his skill set is much higher?

I really don't see that 'high earners' not wanting to pay more tax makes them less socially responsible or less of a good citizen.

If that was the case then tax rates should go up across all income bands not just for high earners so everyone was being socially responsible. 'we are all in this tigether' are we not?

With regards to Higher Rate tax -both DH and I are higher rate tax payers, I would have no objection to paying 1 or 2% more BUT I do think any more than that would mean I would probably reduce my hours or do a less stressful job.

I do feel sad to see another thread where it is assumed that higher rate tax payers and high earners are merely lucky - luck has a very, very small part in in, it's all down to blood, sweat, tears and years and years of working 60+ hours a week.

We are all in this together, that's what society is, but some of us have a far greater ability to contribute financially. Denying that difference in circumstances is socially irresponsible IMHO.

Higher income tax is only a disincentive to work for a very small number of people, many people do the job they do because it is what they want to do rather than because of the take home pay it offers.

There needs to be a 30% tax bracket that sits between £30 and 40k in my opinion, a disproportionate amount of tax is paid by middle earners.
The wealthy could be taxed at a higher rate because remember this is annual earnings, nobody is touching their capital.

Don't agree I'm afraid mainlymaynie - if it's about a % of income how can you say losing an extra 5% (say) of 50k is more easy to swallow/have less of an impact than losing an extra 5% of a 10k salary?

Why do I at 29 with a large mortgage, no final salary pension scheme, big student loan costs, childcare costs and a house quite possibly in negative equity have a greater financial ability to support society just because I earn around 50k compared to a baby boomer on 30k??

Agree whatever.

As I said earlier, I was far better off, in terms of disposable income, when I earned a lot less than I do now. Its far too simplistic to say that the more you earn, the better off you are.

Whatevertheweather - what you spend your net salary on though is up to you, your pension isn't taxed so you could save on tax that way.

Btw I'm not begrudging at all of the tax I already pay. I think we do have many excellent services in the uk - especially nhs but I just object to the cry of tax the 'high earners' more - they are lucky, they can afford it and have a social responsibilty to pay in more than they already do!

Mamatomany - yes it is my choice but then it is also the choice of anyone whatever their salary is

I think wage inequality is a massive problem, the cost of housing in this country is also increasing at such a higher rate than wages are. I don't mind paying tax, not at all, I would gladly pay more for better services.
I think that people are understandably objecting to paying more and getting less, which is due to the bank bail out I guess, it is depressing for all tax payers, higher rate or not.

I think that people earning average wages should be able to afford a decent family home, but isn't the average house worth about 7 times average salary these days?
Was talking to a retired teacher who lives near my mum in a house worth about £300k which he bought on a teacher wage for £3K - 'of course wages were much lower then' he said, 'I was only earning £20 a week then'

The current distribution does not take into account how expensive it is to live in an area where you can get a private sector £40k+ job.

Whatevertheweather - So should I get to pay less tax because I have three sets of school fees, a huge mortgage and a nice car or are they my lifestyle choices that will change/come to an end eventually and therefore nobody's problem but my own ?
And I'm not even a 40% tax payer sob :(

I havent read it all but "lucky" FFS LUCKY?????
fecking sense of entitlement or what!
I do not begrudge the masive amount of tax I pay, but LUCK had FECK ALL to do with it.
I came from an abusive working class background, and worked my little socks off, all through school, got into Uni, and worked even harder, studying, night shifts, 2 sometimes 3 jobs, work work work, training training training, 100 hour weeks.
Till I got where I am, then married an abusive shit, who left me a single parent with massive debts.
So now I work some more, harder and harder, I live in a modest house havent had a holiday for years, but I can support myself and my children.
Luck?/ Let me tell you luck had absolutely nothing to do with it!

On this thing of luck - I count myself very lucky. Lucky to be British and benefit from education, clean water, nhs.. all that stuff, lucky to have educated parents who supported me through school, lucky to be fairly intelligent and able to go to university, lucky to be healthy. I had to work to take advantage of the opportunities that I have been lucky enough to have, but we are all lucky, and relatively rich in this country.

I don't normally contribute to threads like this but I am getting tired of seeing the same old bashing going on to anyone who has managed to progress in their career and earn a good salary.

I am a high tax payer, and I agree with Dragonhead, luck has a very, very small part in it. Years of working horrendous hours and making huge sacrificies is what has allowed me to earn what I do.

I have had to work all over the world, have spent so much time living in hotels away from home in countries where I don't speak the language, am afraid to go out alone and have been frankly very lonely after leaving my DP for weeks/months at a time. It really isn't as easy as some people think. This is aside from the huge amounts of pressure my job brings.

However, I know that is my choice and I do it so I can enjoy the lifestyle I have. I also do it without ever complaining about how much tax I have to pay and how it helps all the people needing benefits. I am actually glad that I can contribute and help people who are struggling.

What I don't understand is why it is never recipicated. Why don't people who receive the benefits from higher earners taxes feel glad that we are contributing so much? Why is there so much resentment towards those of us who are paying a hell of a lot in and taking very little out?

I paid almost 50K in tax alone last year - a huge amount in my opinion, however I don't begrudge this at all, I just begrudge people who constantly want more from us.

Dragonhead "I agree with he ethos and in an ideal world the gap between low earners and high earners wouldn't be so wide"

But it doesn't have to be in an ideal world - in most other countries in western Europe there is less inequality in salaries.

I am strongly in favour of about a third of taxes presently being collected by central government being devolved to local authorities, who would be able to set rates as they wished.

At the same time, benefits would be locally set, and be allowed to vary.

No local authority would be allowed to borrow money.

The ranking of inequality in family income is interesting. UK ranks 92nd in the world for inequality - the EU as a whole sits at 106 (Sweden is the most equal)

longfingernails, much greater local taxation would be a great idea IMO - if nothing else it is insane that the Welsh Assembly has no tax raising powers/responsibilities.

Why has inequality got worse over the last 30 years?

Mama - well that just about proves my point - you as a non high earner (as classified by the tax you pay) can afford all of that - I could not dream to afford private school fees for 3 or an expensive car - I have 1 child would love another but until she starts (non private) school it is financially impossible, I have a 160k mortgage on a house in the south east which we bought 3 yrs ago for 185k and drive an 02 plate car.

Clearly you have more disposable income than me yet it is my salary bracket not yours not is under threat of more tax

I am not crying 'tax the 'high earners' more - they are lucky, they can afford it'. As I have said, I am a higher rate tax payer, I understand that what people earn is more than a simple matter of lucky/unlucky. People on £50k have more choice about how they spend than people on £20k. We can choose how to structure our spending, rather than needing to spend it all to cover the necessities. We have options around saving money. So yes, we can afford it more than someone earning significantly less. I don't believe our 'right' to expensive houses etc. outweighs the right of the elderly to have appropriate care in their own homes. And we're not currently paying enough tax to ensure they can.