Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think 'Mum knows best'

35 replies

EricNorthmansMistress · 17/01/2011 12:19

is a fucking stupid meaningless potentially dangerous platitude?

Bad form, cos I read it on another thread (in several forms, this isn't one particular poster, and I've heard it IRL anyway. No, mum doesn't know best actually, not when mum (or dad, or anyone else) is doing something that is potentially harmful to the baby. Grrr arrg.

OP posts:
xfirsttimemummyx · 17/01/2011 12:22

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

SlightlyTubbyHali · 17/01/2011 12:28

I agree.

"You know your baby. Giving him bisto
at 6 weeks is fine if you know he's ready".

No it effing isn't. Sometimes the weight of medical research knows more than you.

Of course there are times when a mother does know her baby best: she knows if it is tired, hungry, in pain, or just "not right". But to extend that to every sort of behaviour is just plain silly.

PuraVida · 17/01/2011 12:48

I certainly don't know best.

I'd never held a baby before i had DS, I still haven't got a fricking clue what i'm doing and i muddle through from one mishap to another.

I for one need a bit of guidance.

StewieGriffinsMom · 17/01/2011 12:59

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

spidookly · 17/01/2011 13:06

I think it's a useful platitude to counter ideas like Pura's above.

When your first baby is born you spend hours gazing at her, watching her breathe, tending to her every whimper, trying to figure out what she needs.

So although other people might know lots about babies in general, it is the mother (and the father to a point, but due to feeding and ML and giving birth, really the mother) who is the expert in that child.

That doesn't mean that you should ignore advice about what is best for babies. But given how contradictory that advice is, and the tendency for it to be given with a large dollop of sensationalist panic, it is important to remember that you are the the one who knows your baby best.

So if a whole thread of MNers are telling you that it is harmful to leave your baby to cry, but you think your baby is exhausted and will cry no matter what you do, but is more likely to get the sleep she needs if you leave her be, then YOUR expertise trumps their general (non-scientific) beliefs.

"potentially harmful to a baby" covers almost anything you might ever do.

chipmonkey · 17/01/2011 13:48

I know best. The rest of you are rubbish.

ShowOfHands · 17/01/2011 13:51

It's bollocks.

"Happy mummy, happy baby". That too, right there. So many hidden messages in that it makes my teeth itch.

I know they're both built on plausible and reliable concepts (we have instincts as parents, your ability to parent is improved by your own happiness) but they're rolled out as excuses and platitudes for the frankly ridiculous.

Unrulysun · 17/01/2011 13:57

The aeroplane one gets me: 'put on your own oxygen mask first' which seems to me to get used to justify anything which is good for the parent but not the child as it must be better for the child to have happy parents. Fair enough if you might expire but a bloody stupid analogy if not.

MamaMary · 17/01/2011 14:01

I think there is a lot to be said for 'happy mum, happy baby'. Okay, sometimes it's a bit glib. But there's another American saying that says it even better: 'If Mama ain't happy, ain't nobody happy.' Was certainly true in our household growing up.

TrillianAstra · 17/01/2011 14:02

Depends if Mum is stupid/ignorant/misinformed/selfish/out of her head on drugs.

Original poster
EricNorthmansMistress · 17/01/2011 14:05

Well quite, Trillian. 'AIBU to ignore guidelines because I want to do X, Y or Z?' No, you know best...uuuuh actually, no you probably don't.

OP posts:
Hassled · 17/01/2011 14:08

YANBU - the sum total of what I didn't know when I was first a mother was in hindsight quite terrifying. I had no fucking clue. Any passing stranger would have known more than I did.

I know the "Happy mother, happy child" mantra does wind people up, but I disagree, SOH, I do think it has a lot of truth in it. Babies and children are so good at sensing emotions/atmospheres and responding accordingly - I'm convinced that the reason DS1 was a miserable baby who never slept was because I was miserable and stressed at the time. But then if I'd been happier I wouldn't necessarily have been a more competent parent, and in the long run it didn't do him any harm - he's now a very mellow, happy adult. Probably the most chilled of the DCs. I think I may have just shot my own argument in the foot there :o.

redandyellowandpinkandgreen · 17/01/2011 14:09

I definitely don't know best! I hate the fact I am meant to trust my judgement or instincts somehow. DS is 9 weeks and I don't even know why he's crying half the time. I gave birth to one baby, it doesn't make me some kind of expert.

ShowOfHands · 17/01/2011 14:09

Like I said MamaMary, it's built upon a sound principle of it probably being a whole lot more desirable to have a happy parent, not least for the parent in question. But it's also trite nonsense that's trotted out as an excuse. Gin might make you happy but it's not necessarily going to help your children. And there's the veiled reference to unhappy babies. Like there's some kind of blame to be apportioned if your baby is less than happy. You do things because they're the right thing to do for the adults and children concerned. Facilitating happiness is not a goal just occasionally a welcome side effect.

spidookly · 17/01/2011 14:14

So what you're saying Hassled is miserable stressed mother, happy offspring?

:o

What about women who are told by HVs or doctors to stop breastfeeding because their baby isn't gaining weight according to the charts?

If their instinct and reading of the situation tells them their baby is fine, then should they ignore it and do what the "experts" say?

ShowOfHands · 17/01/2011 14:14

Hassled, like I said, built upon sound and reliable concepts. I absolutely do not dispute that. But I do know it's a phrase that has hurt some parents because of what it unwittingly implies.

And I have heard people trotting out a glib 'happy mummy, happy baby' as they do something that makes them extremely happy but is ill advised and potentially unhappy-making for their child. I could insert here a tale of a woman I know who says it as she skips out the door, heavily pregnant, to have a cigarette. Now I'm not criticising the woman for having an addiction (though I wish she'd get the support to quit) but her saucy wink and chirruped platitude is just plain nonsense.

spidookly · 17/01/2011 14:17

"I definitely don't know best! I hate the fact I am meant to trust my judgement or instincts somehow."

But you have to. That's your job now. Your baby is relying on you to do it.

"DS is 9 weeks and I don't even know why he's crying half the time."

Half the time probably neither does he. But if you pay attention you'll learn. And you probably still know a greater percentage of the time than anybody else.

MamaMary · 17/01/2011 14:19

ShowOfHands, I agree that it can be trotted out to cover a multitude of sins - and your story of the smoking mum testifies to that.

But surely that's the exception and the majority of mums instinctively want what's best for their baby? To the extent that in certain cases they can put their own health (physical and mental) at risk when they should in fact be thinking of themselves, in order to be in a fit state to look after their children? In some circumstances, a happier mum would be a much happier baby.

spidookly · 17/01/2011 14:23

"Happy mum, happy baby" is a world away from "mother knows best"

I think Hassled is quite close to the truth on that one - being a good, responsive parent is tiring and sometimes stressful.

Although I know I am a better parent when I am less tired, less stressed, in better form. I have more patience and come up with more creative ways to deflect toddler tantrums, the DDs and I have more fun together.

I work because I don't think I'd make a good SAHM and I think my general fulfilment makes me a better parent when I'm parenting. In an ideal world I think it is probably nicer for babies and toddlers to be at home with a parent, but I didn't choose that, largely because of how I felt about doing it.

Hassled · 17/01/2011 14:25

I do see your point - and also I guess the unhappy/PND suffering mother just feels guilty and so gets more unhappy every time she hears the phrase trotted out. In which case, let my experiences with DS1 be a cheering tale. And with the benefit of a lot of hindsight (DS1 is 23), the "personality" of a baby in that first year really bears no relation to how their personalities turn out in the end.

BuzzLightBeer · 17/01/2011 14:29

I've got 3 children and I still know fuck all. I generally lurch through the day trying to kill anyone and then occasionally hope that my haphazard parenting and inability to do much properly won't turn any of them into serial killers.

TruthSweet · 17/01/2011 14:30

Unrulysun - the reason adults have to put their masks on first is that if the adults have passed out from lack of oxygen who will help the children off the plane etc?

Sometimes an adult has to make sure they are safe so they can then help the child - it doesn't sound the right way to do things but it is.

Doesn't work for all things but oxygen masks in aeroplanes is definitely one of them.

ShowOfHands · 17/01/2011 14:32

I find it reductive. I've had a think about it. That's what I don't like. Some sort of cause and effect when it's never that simple. We rail against it all the time in other ways. I've seen it hundreds of times on a bf thread. We couch things in terms of 'should do this' or 'this is better' and people say 'no that wasn't true for me'.

And I heard it all the time when dd was little. As an excuse, a platitude, a silence filler.

The woman in the bed next to me after I had dd was having terrible trouble latching her dd on and there was beggar all bfing support. She'd been trying all night and was in tears, her baby was screaming. She had a bottle thrust at her by a midwife and was placated with 'come on, happy mummy, happy baby'. It was crap frankly. It implied a whole truck load of stuff that wasn't fair or true. That her baby was unhappy because she was, that if you say something or excuse something in simple terms it simplifies a situation. That she could improve her situation if only she would do more, as opposed to them offering her support.

I understand why people say it and I support the sentiment that encourages a parent to be happy in all walks of life, but it still irks me to hear it trotted out without thought.

WimpleOfTheBallet · 17/01/2011 14:34

It's bandied about in a silly way but the basis of it lies in truth...there is an instinct which seems to be only a Mother's.

Unrulysun · 17/01/2011 14:43

Truthsweet I understand why adults should put their mask on first on a plane. I am disputing the application of this maxim to parents putting their own needs first when no-one is going to be dying.