To think that too many people rely on Tax Credits?

[workhardplayhard]

Reading many of the threads on Mumsnet it seems that a large proportion of contributors rely on Tax Credits to top up their incomes.

I don't know anyone who claims Tax Credits IRL but if I did I don't think it would change my opinion - I think people should be fully responsible for providing for their own offspring without any benefits.

I have stated on a previous thread that I DO believe that people should get some assistance if their circumstances change ( Redundancy/Ill Health) but only for a set period.

I don't think the government should pay for people to have multiple children that they can ill afford to provide for.

I would be interested to hear other views.

I totally agree that if wages were more in line with the cost of living then there would be no need for TC. With my DP wage and our TC's we manage, just.

We have not debt, so no credit cards, no finance etc, so very luck in that respect. We don't go on holiday, we don't drink or smoke, we don't eat out and very very rarely have a take away, neither of us has the latest mobile phone the most extravagant thing we have is a PS3 and a little collection of Blu Rays (so shot us)

For us not to have to claim TC's my DP would have to earn £12ph (obviously that's before tax) That's nearly double what he is on now, minimum wage!

Newgolddream & bupcakesandcunting - Only 69.5 and 70 inches! You're both doing it wrong! We used our tc to buy a television that is so big it won't fit into the house, we have to peer through the sitting room window to watch it.

TallyB Can I come rnd to yours to watch your HUGE cinema sized TV that you so cheekily bought with TC's that you and your large family of chavs had the nerve to claim and spend how you wanted!!!

Tax credits are a subsidy by us (the tax payers) for employers to pay minimum or poor wages. Totally bizarre to have people working, but claiming lots of benefits just to have a living wage (and I absolutely would claim if I was entitled). I don't think this is about having children you can't afford, as the OP suggests, as you may well have children and then your circumstances change, but I find it so odd when I hear about people only working less than 16 hours a week on purpose so they still get their TC's. So, at a structural level, I believe this to be wrong, on an individual level, lots of poorly paid people have no choice but to claim.

Tax credits should be scrapped and they should just make the tax free income band bigger or make the basic rate of income tax lower, and then increase the top rate if necessary to compensate.

I personally would like to see a £10k tax free band so if you earn min wage for a 40 hr week you only pay minimal tax.

Far simpler, far easier to administer.

Onetoomany - you can't get WTC if you work less than 16hrs a week. - and the limit is higher for couples (or is going to be)

And Working Tax Credits top out at £16,190/annum (slightly higher if you are disabled or have a disabled child). Gross. For both singles and couples.

And yes, you need to be working at least 16 hours/week to claim there (as a singleton).

The problem seems to be that the minimum wage is not a proper living wage. I like the Green Party's idea of making it something like £8.50, and then phase out benefits.

Sorry for the confusion, I know my single mum neighbour didn't want to work much more than 16 hours a week as it affected her benefits, I assumed it was her tax credits. So, she deliberately kept her hours down and stable for this reason. Great she was working, but not great that she wouldn't see any reward for working more.

I agree with BaggedandTagged, I would like to see no tax on the first £10,000 of earnings and seems much better than taxing people on the minimum wage, then giving them credits to live on.

gotta do school run but will come back and post later.

the problem is if min wage goes up so will the costs of what they are producing.
If a cashier in the supermarket was on £10 per hour then you can bet your life the extra cost would be added to the products being sold so even though the cashier was earning more her cost of living would go up as well.

Cantspel, this is a problem many years in the making. Yes, a big jump in the minimum wage would mess with the economy, but this is a problem years in the making, as the minimum wage was kept down in the face of inflation.

But the even if someone on a full time (40hrs) a week wage wasn't taxed it isn't enough to live on. It's 12334 before tax is taken off (so if you have even one child you're going to struggle with no tax creditz).

She'd be stupid to work less than 16hrs a week - unless it's a really really good pay. She'd lose her IS, but wouldn't qualify for any WTC or childcare help.

i have nothing more to say other than to echo all those who say if employers paid a reasonable living wage people would not need to rely on TC's. but they know they can get away with paying shit wages as the state will top up :(

also agree that cost of living is ridiculous ie rent, fuel, food etc which doesnt help.

i seriously worry about the future and what kind of horrible world i have brought kids into.

Maybe if the government were concerned about ensuring people received a living wage and fairly distributed the tax burden there wouldn't be any need for credits.

VAT on fuel, the recent VAT rise that Cameron admits is permanent and the way corporate tax avoidance is treated show that successive governments don't really give a shit.

YABVU You are obviously one of the more better off people in this world who is fortunate to have achieved a high enough wage not to need to claim for them.
You have an I'm alright Jack attitude.

Tax credits are also payable to those who do not have children, it also supplements their low income.

I earn 10k pa working 30hrs pw as a lone parent. Even tax free, this is not enough to live on. It works out as about £800 a month gross (£700 net). I am lucky enough to live in social housing. £330 pm. that leaves £370 for water (£54pm-SWW is one of the most expensive in the UK), council tax (£77), electricity (£40 approx), gas (£35), running the car to get to work (rural area with useless public transport), childcare (£135) not to mention food, clothing, and repairs of household goods etc...

Without WTC we would be in abject poverty.

I need to be able to care for my DS, to spend time with him and not be worn out by work, and never around especially as his df hasn't played any part in his life for over 4 years.

I am not a lone parent by choice,it just happened that way. I'd love to find a lovely man who could earn enough so that between us we wouldn't need WTC to afford a basic standard of living. Unfortunately, this type of man doesn't seem to exist, most blokes round here earn minimum wage or live on benefits completely.

I don't think it is fair to deny people a family life just because so many jobs don't pay a living wage. If you are working, you should be able to have a family without suffering poverty.

So OP, you are annoyed because poor working people aren't paid enough?
Don't more than 80% of familes claim tax credits.I wonder how you know that nobody you know claims them??

Have looked up tax credits now. It isn't about topping up incomes it's about reimbursing tax that has been deducted from earned money. The principle is that there are times when people simply cannot afford to pay all of their tax - it is money they have earned and should not be expected to contribute.

I have read this thread. It is absolutely disgusting that some of you have to manage on so little when you are working. Now that is something that MNet has taught me. I'm not as blinkered as the OP (if she's real) but I do appreciate what I have and I feel bloody embarassed.

onceamai - often tax credits that people get is more than they pay in tax

Why worry about who gets tax credits and who doesnt? Im far more concerned about the bankers ripping us off, MPs dishonestly claiming expenses, and wondering how long Im going to have to work to help support my 2 kids thru Uni now that EMA, which was allowing them to live like mini kings and queens so great was that sum in comparison to bankers' bonuses, has now been cut. I work and raise 2 children, and rely on tax credits to buy some essentials. It doesnt enable me to live in the lap of luxury. Ive always worked and paid tax so if theres any money out there that Im legally entitled to, then Im claiming it. God forbid we should go back to the old dark ages days when people got no support at all - that great big divide between the 'have and have nots'..or, were they the good old days, hmm?

Its not the tax credits I object to its the idea that the government is doing you a favour "giving" you a benefit. If they taxed people on low wages less(kept the 10%tax, less income tax/stealth taxes), allowed them to keep more of their earnings it would foster a lot less of this dependency culture we've seen during the last 13 years, but thats exactly what the tax credits were for to ensure some people voted for a government who gave them "benefits"

I would vote for the government that tackles poverty whether it takes the form of tax credits or keeping all your wages/less stealth taxes/higher wages etc.It's a disgrace the term 'working poor' even exists.