To ask my friend to better discipline her child

[MrsTwiceslice]

Namechange for this btw.
A friend and I regularly hang out at each other's houses on our days off, with our kids.
We have boys of similar ages, and the idea in the beginning was that they could play together.
We were "mum" friends initially-We met at a playgroup, but now we have become pretty good real friends. I like her a lot.

The trouble is her son. He is very physical which manifests itself at some point (every time we see them) in pushing or hitting my ds, or other agressive acts.

My ds used to find this very distressing,(he is a gentle soul) but he has sort of got used to fending off this child, and kind of puts up with it.

This makes me feel quite upset, because I don't think he, or anyone, should have to put up with being pushed over, having their hair pulled or whatever.

I feel powerless to stop it because I cannot discipline the child for my friend.

If I see the other boy do anything like this (or see he is about to) I just stop his hand and say a firm "no!"

If my friend sees it, she says "no pushing!" or "if you do that again you will have to go on the naughty step."

The things is she often gives him several warnings before anything happens.

The other day her ds pushed my ds into the side of a (stationary) bike, really viciously, and she just said to him "say sorry and kiss Joe"
Is it me, or does that warrant more than a "say sorry"?

This child obviously realises that he can do anything he likes, he just has to say sorry afterward.

My friend has made comments in the past about how "overexcited "her son gets to see mine, which is true, he does like my ds, and my son (inexplicably) likes him, otherwise I wouldn't bring him round at all.

I don't think it is just high spirits though, and if I were her he would go on the naughty step EVERY TIME he pushed or hit. (it happens with other children too, not just my ds)

Should I just stop hanging out with them (I feel myself about to blow and I don't want to create a bad situation) or should I try and speak to my friend about the way she (doesn't) discipline her son?

You can't say anything, it won't help.

I have had to drop friends cause their kids are snots. It sucks but there you go.

The first time I did this, I had said to DS that this friend and her DS were coming over to play and he burst into tears and begged me to not let him come. My DS is a tough nut, but this kid was just a brat, whenever he was there my DS ended up bleeding/bruised for a while I thought it was just kids but when DS said that I called the friend that day and cancelled.

From then on we were just not available for getting together with the kids. I did still invite her to adult only stuff and we did manage to pick up the friendship again once the kids were at school.

You can't tell her how to parent her kid, but you can parent your own by keeping him away.

I have a similar situation with my friend; my DS is coming up for 2, and hers is 4. Her DS is very spoilt and wont' share anything with DS when we go round there, and if he comes here he won't let DS play with any of his own toys either. If he thinks DS is going to touch anything he thumps DS or pushes him over or screams in his face. My friend just says "Share nicely boys" even though my DS is playing nicely and it's hers that is causing all the problems.

I like my friend a lot but have started limiting when I see her. Usually I try and make arrangements to meet at soft play or toddler group or similar, and then it's not as bad. Or I see my friend without the children in tow. And we don't meet up anywhere near as frequently as we used to.

I used to have exactly this situation with my sister's two boys who were slightly older than mine and ganged up on him relentlessly, snatched everything he touched, constantly pushed him over etc. I think because she had them so close together she struggled to stop them doing it to one another, and she seemed completely desensitised to it when they did it to my child. It eventually led to a massive row between us and she really did not take kindly to my questioning their behaviour and her parenting AT ALL.

Maybe you could try asking to see her only in the evenings without children for a while, and eventally she'll find it odd and ask you why. If you've had a few drinks and she is approachable enough you might be able to say 'Look, honestly, My DS and I are really fond of you both, but this is why, and we need to stay away for a bit until it changes.....'

Hopefully, if she's reasonable and you say it in the right way she'll take it on board. But you can never guarantee that something like this won't make the friendship go tits up I'm afraid.

Actually, upon reflection, it might turn inot more of a row if you've had a few drinks! It just depends on what she is like. I'd find it really hard to have a heart to heart like that without some Dutch courage though. I'd be more inclined to just gradually drop her, which is a shame.

I could have written this thread!

I think its very difficult to actually say something to her face without coming across as precious. (I dont think you are precious BTW)

I am in a very similar situation and I think you have to approach it with a bit of passive agression, much as I hate that term!

Can you orchestrate it so you meet at hers or somewhere like the park, then if her ds pushes ect you can say to him in a very sweet non cross way "oh dear if you push ds again WE are going to have to go home." Then follow this through and go home if he does push again - this will show your friend that you follow through with what you say.

Then its not like you are ordering them out of your house, but it has the same effect IYSWIM?

Its such a minefield and just because they are 3 does not mean they should be pushed, hit ect, this is not tolerated at schools and nurseries why should it in your own home?

I don't agree with her putting the child on the naughtly step everytime he hits, mostly because I had a friend who had the hitting problem with her ds and it just didn't work. What did though, was following him around and everytime he raised a hand to hit she stopped him and said firmly "we don't hit". Obviously if it escalated then further action would be needed.

It seems that part of the problem is that you don't agree with her parenting technique, well we all do it differently so there is no saying that you are right and she is wrong.

However I do agree that she needs to follow through on any punishments that she threatens.

The hitting does need to be sorted though (or at least you need to see an effort being made to sort it) otherwise the 2 boys won't be able to be friends anymore.

Perhaps next time it happens you could start a conversation about it. Perhaps make up an imaginary friend who had the same problem and how they dealt with it or recommend a book?

I wouldn't go in telling her what you think she is doing wrong (as you have here) as she will be extremely hurt and it will get her back up instantly. You could however tell her how upset your ds is getting about her ds hitting him. You could even say that your ds didn't want hers to come and play because of it or something.

My friend's son did this, and she had a very softly-softly approach to discipline that simply didn't work. Her DS liked inflicting pain and he liked getting his mum's attention. Another friend told her straight that unless she improved her discipline they couldn't hang out together anymore. I was rather shocked but I think she was right. I used to hover over the kids (while friend relaxed!) so that I could stop her DS hurting mine; my eventual approach was to stop seeing them, which worked for my DD. However, we maintained our friendship away from the kids and now (kids are 6) they really enjoy each other again.

The fact is that boisterous boys need discipline - and they also need lots of physical exercise. So I wouldn't meet at home - go to the park. Ask your friend how you can resolve the shoving situation and tell her that it has become too frequent to ignore. And keep a close watch on the boys for the early signs of frustration, so you can step in quickly and hopefully stop the shoving. It's less enjoyable for you if you have to do the hovering rather than sit down with a coffee - but at least you protect your DS.