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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think that £4.92 per hour is ridiculous?

149 replies

Chocolocolate · 03/01/2011 00:03

My DSil has recently completed her NVQ in childcare and works full time in a nursery.

She is 19. My DBro is 21. They pay all of their bills etc between them.

Their rent is £500 per month for a rubbishy little flat (although they have made it their own).

DSil told me over Christmas that she only gets paid £4.92 per hour - the national minimum wage for 19yos. AIBU to think this is very low? Not just for her - the national minimum wage is low.

Why is it less for a 19yo than a 21yo? They have all of the same responsibilities etc of an older couple.

If she wasn't with my DBro (who gets paid barely more than the national minimum wage himself) how could she afford a place to live?

They are both v. hardworking people, as are many who get national minimum wage, should this not be higher?

OP posts:

BaroqinAroundTheChristmasTree · 03/01/2011 01:14

is the issue here not the fact that a 20yr working for minimum wage will be on £4.92 and hour, while a 21yr old with the same qualifications in the same job will be earning £5.93 (correct on my last post didn't realise the "adult" minium wage had gone up)

16-17yr olds in a "minimum wage" job will be on £3.64

newwave · 03/01/2011 01:15

NG2 the minimum wage is far to low and only a Tory would think otherwise.

BaroqinAroundTheChristmasTree · 03/01/2011 01:18

I think it's too low as well - however it's not as simple as "put it up" - as it has a knock on effect (not all positive).

But I think the issue here is one of fairness why does the level 3 NVQ childcare worker who is 21 get paid £1 more an hour than 20yr old with the same qualifications.

That's nearly £2000 a year difference in wage.

newwave · 03/01/2011 01:21

It is just as simple as put it up, not suggesting a big increase but £7-50 an hour maybe a bit more in London.

Dont forget all tax payers are subsidising poor wages which suits big business.

montysorry · 03/01/2011 01:21

Well why is the 16yr old tax payer not allowed to vote?
This is similar to the ' no taxation without representation' theory.

montysorry · 03/01/2011 01:23

Mind you, not as crazy as some US states where you're deemed old enough to buy a gun at 16 but have to wait another 5years before been deemed old enough to buy a beer.

BaroqinAroundTheChristmasTree · 03/01/2011 01:27

no it's not just as simple as put it up.

You put the minimum wage up to £7.50 - then the workers in your company who are on £7.50 now will have to have their wage increased. And the ones on £10 an hour have to have theirs put up.

Just putting one minimum wage (40hr per week) workers pay up to £7.50phr would cost the employer an extra £3200 a year. It would send smaller businesses our of business if they have to increase wages of all their workers (which is what they'd have to do).

Monty - the age of being able to do stuff legally is madness.

You can be tried for a crime as an adult at 10
You can have sex, leave school, and get married (with your parents permission) at 16
But you can't drive a car until you're 17
Can't vote or drink until you're 18
And can't have a "adult" minimum wage until you're 21

.......

Niceguy2 · 03/01/2011 01:28

NG2 the minimum wage is far to low and only a Tory would think otherwise.
Erm, wrong. All those people working for the minimum wage would disagree.

They may WANT more money, hell I'd like a payrise. But my pay is not too low....otherwise I'd be doing something else.

ninah · 03/01/2011 01:29

like .. oh yup jobseekers plasma special innit. that's what else. ffs

BaroqinAroundTheChristmasTree · 03/01/2011 01:30

Niceguy - so it's not too low?

So why do so many people working full time on a minimum wage still qualfy for so many state handouts to increase their income to a liveable on income??

newwave · 03/01/2011 01:31

no it's not just as simple as put it up.

You put the minimum wage up to £7.50 - then the workers in your company who are on £7.50 now will have to have their wage increased. And the ones on £10 an hour have to have theirs put up.

This is the same argument as the Tories used to oppose the introduction of the minimum wage, it was wrong then and it is wrong now.

Poverty wages are just wrong.

Just a point but i would agree to the introducton of a maximum wage level.

Original poster

Chocolocolate · 03/01/2011 01:34

Ooo, an extra little question for you all, slightly off topic but about the same people.

One of my cousin's (who is 17 and in full time educatios) mother has just moved away. My cousin is at college and couldn't move so is currently living with my DSil & DBil. DBil has got her a few shifts at the bar where he works but it doesn't bring much in.

As my cousin is in full-time education would they all be entitled to any help? Would my cousin's mother still be receiving child benefit/ CSA payments for my cousin?

Thanks

OP posts:

Niceguy2 · 03/01/2011 01:34

Because the state has decided that certain sectors of society deserve more help than others.

So let's hypothetically say it is deemed a 2 adult family with 2 kids needs say £10 per hour as a livable wage.

If you put the minimum wage at £10 an hour, what about all those other people who would have been able to work for less? You are paying them way more than you need to. Great if you are that single person with no bills. But wait....employers will probably think "hmmm £10 an hour. I can't hire 20 staff. I'll hire 2 instead". or worse still "I can't hire ANY staff. I'll just go bankrupt and claim benefits!"

And then what happens? The 2 adult family with 3 kids start moaning that they need £15 an hour to survive.........

ILoveItWhenYouCallMeBoo · 03/01/2011 01:36

the mum is probably still receiving CB for the girl. i think the girl can apply for EMA aswell, although maybe that has changed. not sure.

BaroqinAroundTheChristmasTree · 03/01/2011 01:37

I don't think it's wrong.

I used to work nights in a care home - I was a (not even qualified and no previous experience ) care worker. I was on £5.50 an hour.

The night mananger, a woman with 20yrs experience, NVQ3 and in charge of all of the night carers was on £7.80 at the time.

If minimum wage had been increased to £7.50 then I would have been on 30p an hour less than a manager with qualifications - which is ridiculous.

Are you suggesting that it would have been right (or fair) that a manager with years of experience and qualifications should have earned just £52 a month more than an experienced, unqualified care worker??

newwave · 03/01/2011 01:41

Baroq, no the night manager was being exploited by her employer in paying such shit wages.

Her wages were crap and so were the wages of those below her.

I am amazed that anyone on here supports poverty wages and the explotation of those on crap wages.

ninah · 03/01/2011 01:42

I just think it's wrong that a well connected and personally prosperous government inc non dom until recently chancellor are watching the rest of us scrap over a few pounds an hour like fecking jackals

Original poster

Chocolocolate · 03/01/2011 01:42

That's a point, she may be receiving EMA.

Thanks.

I'm a little suspicious and have a feeling that my cousin's mother may be receiving child benefit plus mandatory CSA payments from my cousin's bio father and voluntary payments from her ex-step-father - now that's complicated and an entirely different issue.

Niceguy2 do you think it's fair that a 20 year old gets £1 less per hour than a 21 year old? Out of interest.

OP posts:

BaroqinAroundTheChristmasTree · 03/01/2011 01:42

A single man working 40hrs a week on minimum wage would still be entitled to just over £15 a week in top ups. (in my area - low LHA rates) so no - not as much as a family of 5 would be getting - but still regarded as needing those top ups.

ILoveItWhenYouCallMeBoo · 03/01/2011 01:44

is the mother paying anything to your Dbro and DSIL for her DD's keep? I'm not sure but i think your Dbro would have to have guardianship or something to eb able to apply for teh child benefit. not sure how it works with CSA payments though.

BaroqinAroundTheChristmasTree · 03/01/2011 01:45

but you just told me the argument against having to put everyone's wages was the one the Tory's used to opppose minimum wage.

Or are you suggesting that we should both have been on (random figure plucked out of the air) £10per hour???

newwave · 03/01/2011 01:47

ninah, 100% spot on, no limits for the Tory scum and their supporters the poverty line for the weak and vulnerable.

UnderTheRadar2212 · 03/01/2011 01:49

She can earn £6.12 an hour in Asda, my son of 17 did.

LMAO!

Lucky boy.

My lad of 19 applied for a job stacking shelves at Asda after leaving school - he was applying for anything and everything he could at the time - his application was rejected as he 'didn't have the right qualifications or experience' that they were looking for.

He got a job a week later with a local Engineering company, due to him having a triple distinction in BTEC Engineering Level 2, plus 11 GCSE's.

He's now on £2k a month.

Up yours Asda!

Original poster

Chocolocolate · 03/01/2011 01:50

Nope ILoveItWhenYouCallMeBoo - no money for keep, but no-one wants to rock the boat with her as she has my younger cousin and we would all like to continue seeing him.

Well, I suppose it's me moaning on their behalf, they don't complain - just get on with it. I just can't get over a) how low the minimum wage is and b) the difference in the minimum wage at different ages.

OP posts:

ILoveItWhenYouCallMeBoo · 03/01/2011 01:52

undertheradar, it sounds liek he didn't have the right qualifications tbh. not sure why you think he should have gotten a job he wasn't right for

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