To not give my children the swine flu vaccine?

[wintersnow]

I decided not to last year as I wanted to wait and see how safe it was but am reconsidering this year after several people have died. Did you give it to your children and what were your reasons to give/not give it?

StataLover you obviously believe vaccinations are good. You've admitted you are no medical expert, but you believe it. Why don't you read some of the threads in the SN section. There are some mothers there whose children became ill within hours of receiving certain vaccines. Some have not recovered, but there are some miracles, where after 9 months, all of the autistic symptoms disappeared. Read what real people have experienced.

bruffin is right, I was wrong, the Amish do vaccinate, but at a lower level than the rest of the population due to distrust and religious reasons. Older Amish have lower vaccination rates, but younger ones have higher rates.

amishamerica.com/do-amish-vaccinate-their-children/

No, more a case of organisms that are too specialised and do not mutate fast enough, making it easier for a species to overcome them. Your flu viruses mutate quickly and jump the species barrier, which massively aids their survival.

and the rate of autism is nothing like 1 in 15000,a recent study shows 1 in 271

yes I found that figure of 1 in 271. Do you know what the rate is in the general population?

duchesse- not sure I understand your comment. I accept that the flu virus mutates, but the decline of bubonic plague is not to do with it not mutating but the fact that it is a bacterial and not a viral disease. That, and the fact that it was carried by rats were the critical differentiating factor in terms of human ability to control the disease.

this year i've had the jab (frontline NHS) and will be immunising my two daughters (2 and 5) who both have asthma.

this year and last year i dealt with hundreds of adults and children with severe breathing difficulties as a result of flu/swine flu and i can honestly only recall 1 or 2 who had severe reactions to the flu jab.

that's not a balanced/scientific study, i understand, but my own personal 'risk assessment' would conclude that it's very worthwhile to immunise.

Stats,
Before I dip out of this completely can I just put a few lines down to try and explain from my point of view?

You are asking in effect what would change minds about vaccination and compare it, not positively, to religion.

For me I think it would take some acceptance of the fact that vaccination issues do exist.
My mother had a massive lump on her arm and was very unwell after smallpox vac. I still have scars on my arms following vaccination and I too was very unwell. In bit instances we were effectively tufted at.
Ds1 had his vaccinations and was unwell but again I was told it was not a problem and I had huge faith in the whole vaccination programme so had ds2 vaccinated.
His health increasingly crumbled and he was really unwell after the batch at 18 months and never recovered. He has many problems now including autism.
My nieces were then vaccinated and one had a very serious seizure whilst still in the doctors surgery. Literally as she was being treated the nurse was trying to insist to my brother that this was simple coincidence.

I could add many other things from my family but I won't bore you, but it seems to me that something about my family and vaccinations doesn't mix.

I am content that we are in an unfortunate minority and also that we are a bit weird
But what would be really helpful would be for the science/medical community to not treat me like a twat .. Or indeed some kind of guidable, foolish zealot.

I would love someone to actually look at my child and try and figure what happened and why we can't just get vaccinated without it being a problem.

Dealing with ds2 is tough and, having had dd the decision to not vaccinated her remained tough. It is much tougher when I constantly have to endure the sort of stupid twatty judgement and the threats of her being denied schooling or forced to leave the country by people who feel I should not be allowed to parent this issue according to my very vivid family experience.
It rather makes me question who the zealots are.

I would love to ve the mum who just rolls up to baby clinic and has no qualms. But I genuinely believe that anyone who would vaccinate my dd would be putting her health at great risk. Because funnily enough, having not been vaccinated she has not the healthbproblems that bothered her brothers nor does she have any asd or sn issues.

You compared the parents of unvaccinated children to a religious cult. From where I sit the medical community responding to my children with ' it didn't happen, you just imagined it, it is just co-incidence' are far more cult like, in particular in their refusal to accept and different opinion without abuse and name calling.
It is quite hard to take sometimes tbh.

I hope you can read in my tone that I am not seeking to be combative. But you seem to be trying to understand. I am just trying to explain why my choices, as a parent, have to be different from mainstream. And why the name calling. -be it cult members or fools or twits who believe any shit on the Internet - is challenging for me.

The likes of Andrew Wakefield etc weren't in it for a profit
You just chose to be skeptical when it agrees with your theories.

your answer proves , you have seen the evidence of the paternt for a new mealses vaccine but you complete deny it. There is also the need for fame and power, it doesnt have to be a monetory reward.
That is why nobody will take you seriously Leonie, your evidence is one sided and most of it completely without foundation.

"The Amish are not vaccinated. 1 in 15000 Amish has autism. 1 in 75 non-Amish Americans have autism."

Are you actually kidding? Truly watertight scientific argument there.... LMAO!

The vaccination programs exist because the potential side effects of these "harmless" childhood diseases, are truly awful.

All the chat about autism as if there has beena scientifically PROVEN link (Wakefield's paper was utter baloney) is really p*&sing me off.

At the end of the day it comes down to personal choice. I just think that those who choose not to have their child(ren) vaccinated are placing not only their children but others at great risk (e.g. immunocompromised, infants too young to be vaccinated).

Leonie

Andrew Wakefield was punished because his research was massively flawed and his erroneous and fraudulent conclusions have resulted in a massive loss in confidence in the safety of vaccines. That represents misconduct and by doing so he brought his profession into disrepute.

You need to read the facts this page

I have read the patent, youo are in denial!!!!!!!!
It says there is a need for a safer vaccine and I have invented it!!!!!!!!

I am not repeating Brian Deer, but at least he backs up his sources with evidence ie the actual patent, transcripts etc

The patent

The most important part, is I have invented a new vaccine (which I can sell and make millions) but I have to create a scare story first so that people will no longer want MMR and buy my new vaccine.
Patent was 1997 scare story and research 1998