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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

I didn't challenge my colleague on this horrible thing she said AIBU?

79 replies

bupcakesandcunting · 16/12/2010 11:46

I have a work colleague who I thought was a really nice girl. She is younger than me, only 24 and she seems really level-headed and intelligent. However, we were chatting at work yesterday about our respective partners/husbands and how we worry about them getting involved in fights when out in groups. I said that I feel that men tend to attract negative attention just for being men and that girls are less likely to be physically attacked than men. Then my colleague said this;

"Yeah it's more rape with girls than fights. But most of them ask for it." Shock

I did a shocked face and went quiet and carried on working. Then she went "They go out in belts. That's asking for it."

I was in shock. Honestly shocked. I didn't challenge her on it and I feel angry at myself because I won't see her now until after christmas and I don;t feel like almost 3 weeks later I can go up to her and go "you know what you said about women who get raped asking for it? Well you're wrong..." But I am so cross Angry It took me totally by surprise. Was notm expecting that from her.

OP posts:
JenaiMarrsTartanFoxCube · 16/12/2010 13:29

People on here regularly describe girls and their clothing as looking like "mini-hookers", "dressed like sex workers" and the rest.

As long as people connect clothing (including that of children, which baffles me completely) with sexual availability, you'll get ridiculous statement such as that your colleague made.

I feel for you though OP - it's horrible when you get floored by someone's statements like that.

xstitchsnowscene · 16/12/2010 13:32

When someone says that to me I look in their eyes and say 'Please explain what I did to ask for it so I don't do it again'

Before anyone asks, anyone who has met me will know I cover up.

diddl · 16/12/2010 13:32

"The victim is often made to feel like the onus is on her to prove that the rape happened."

That´s the thing though, rape does have to be proved for the man to be found guilty.

insolsticecat · 16/12/2010 13:33

My Short Skirt
From The Vagina Monologues
By Eve Ensler

My short skirt is not an invitation
a provocation
an indication
that I want it
or give it
or that I hook.

My short skirt
is not begging for it
it does not want you
to rip it off me
or pull it down.

My short skirt
is not a legal reason
for raping me
although it has been before
it will not hold up
in the new court.

My short skirt, believe it or not
has nothing to do with you.

My short skirt
is about discovering
the power of my lower calves
about cool autumn air traveling
up my inner thighs
about allowing everything I see
or pass or feel to live inside.

My short skirt is not proof
that I am stupid
or undecided
or a malleable little girl.

My short skirt is my defiance
I will not let you make me afraid
My short skirt is not showing off
this is who I am
before you made me cover it
or tone it down.
Get used to it.

My short skirt is happiness
I can feel myself on the ground.
I am here. I am hot.

My short skirt is a liberation
flag in the women's army
I declare these streets, any streets
my vagina's country.

My short skirt
is turquoise water
with swimming colored fish
a summer festival
in the starry dark
a bird calling
a train arriving in a foreign town
my short skirt is a wild spin
a full breath
a tango dip
my short skirt is
initiation
appreciation
excitation.

But mainly my short skirt
and everything under it
is Mine.
Mine.
Mine.

theevildead2 · 16/12/2010 13:34

Apologies for this being form the dailymail but I'm too hormonal tired to look for any proper news

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-369262/Women-blame-raped.html

That's in the UK. 1/3 think she might be repsonsible.

In other countries rape is almost a way of life for some women. I do think unfortunately there seems to be some part of most people that just doesn't get it.

MsKalo · 16/12/2010 13:35

curiousmama I hope the lovely Chinese lady spat in his food!

JenaiMarrsTartanFoxCube · 16/12/2010 13:35

Thank you for posting that, insolsticecat Xmas Smile

mamadiva · 16/12/2010 13:35
:o

It's on all the time here and I think it is does give out quite a good message.

FWIW my mum went out one night, had 2 drinks phoned my brother saying she was coming home just before 12am... police knocked on door at 3.45am to tell my brother my mum was in hospital as she had been found unconcsious in town centre down an alley. Turns out she was attacked all caught on CCTV, the bastard was seen pinning her up against a wall and putting something in her mouth (what was assumed to be GHB) watching her collapse and dragging her kicking and screaming down an alley. Luckily police walked past and heard her but he was just trying to get her trousers off and had his undone.

He got done for GBH, robbery and let off with a 2 year probation. My mum still has no recollection of it but still has injuries.

Shocking is'nt it?

Now point out the fact that she was wearing jeans, a smock top and a shrug.

Would that be classed as asking for it or should he have attacked someone else?

Answer after all that would be NO because... no one deserves to be attacked!

Sorry for ranting but I have had people asking what my mum was wearing, was she drunk and was she out opn the pull Shock. Sick of this type of attitude )not you I know)

MsKalo · 16/12/2010 13:35

curiousmama i hope the lovely Chinese lady spat in his food!

StealthPolarBear · 16/12/2010 13:37

"BUT from mine + my sis + mates' experiences tell your DDs to never be alone with a man"
Sorry to hear this is from your experience, but no - this cannot be right. Most men are not rapists :(

HuwEdwards · 16/12/2010 13:40

I know it's a serious subject and I'm very puerile, but pmsl at "I declare these streets, any streets my vagina's country."

LaraJade · 16/12/2010 14:30

StealthPolarBear - most men are probably not potential rapists. But some men are; and IME some men just seem
to misread the situation they are in.

BranchingOut · 16/12/2010 14:39

Horrible. Maybe it is worth thinking carefully about what you want to say then bringing it up with her in a quiet moment.

I was in my local hardware shop and a man was going on at the owners (Indian) about how rubbish India was, everyone who came from it and how it really should still be ruled by the British...The shop owners were answering back but clearly on a losing battle as he was just making one ignorant remark after another. I had been listening quietly to this from the back of the shop but then came to the front and said that as far as I was concerned, he sounded like a racist and that if he wasn't one then he had really better stop talking like that as that was the impression he was giving.

He was flabbergasted and couldn't say a word.

altinkum · 16/12/2010 14:42

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

grumpypants · 16/12/2010 14:45

I think the consequences of you bringing this up again and attempting to re educate your work colleague should be weighed up against the possible damage it will do to your working relationship. A lot of people have a lot of weird, silly believes, that, actually, they just parrot from the DM/ their parents etc. You just need to decide when it is worth stepping in to say something.

tinkertitonk · 16/12/2010 14:53

Maybe put this in the general context of violent crime and then translate "asking for it" into "putting yourself in harm's way". It is foolish to put yourself in harm's way but at the same time your doing so does not excuse the criminal who robs or rapes you. Not one bit. From this pov the OP's colleague is saying that wearing a short dress to a nightclub full of drunks is putting yourself in harm's way. In this world that is a reasonable thing to say. I wish it weren't but it is.

lorelilee · 16/12/2010 15:28

I don't think anyone 'asks' for it and, of course, no will always mean no. However, I heard someone make the point once that you would never leave all your windows open in your house when you went out because that may prove hard to resist by an opportunist.

JenaiMarrsTartanFoxCube · 16/12/2010 15:50

Do you mean that wearing a short skirt is like leaving your windows open, lore ? Confused

Curiousmama · 16/12/2010 15:57

seems she is Hmm

God I'm so glad my RL friends and family are normal. I could blow a fuse at some of the idiots on here Angry

sethstarofbethlehemsmum · 16/12/2010 16:00

it is a ridiculous analogy.
Do you seriously think that the only women who get raped after going out drinking are the ones in short skirts?
does a long skirt somehow physically prevent rape and a short one make it easier? If it did there might be a case for the 'windows open' comparison.
If you go out clubbing there will be hundreds of women in short skirts. If a man sees you and later tries to rape you, there could be any reason why he picked on you but it is extremely unlikely it is because the shortness of your skirt beckoned to him across the room.

BertieBottlesOfMulledWine · 16/12/2010 16:14

I hate it when someone says something that makes you go Shock and want to challenge it loudly but you don't for whatever reason.

I was with XMIL in a coffee shop the other day when she suddenly started going on about this "coloured chap" who had got quite aggressive at the shop where she worked. Her teenage DD was clearly embarrassed and kept saying "Mum, ssh" but she kept coming out with this crap "Oh he was black as black, you know. I'm not racist but..." Hmm

The most infuriating part was that she'd brought up this guy for the sole purpose of comparing his behaviour to that of her idiot son (XP) - who is in fact white - so her argument made NO SENSE at all as well as being bigoted.

madonnawhore · 16/12/2010 16:15

This fascinating piece on what women were wearing when they were sexually harrassed was posted on Jezebel a while ago. Really interesting reading...

xstitchsnowscene · 16/12/2010 17:34

OK those who say women are asking for it please tell me what did I do to deserve to be raped? I really would like to know.

Goblinchild · 16/12/2010 17:52

She's young and has limited experience, so my bet is that she feels that girls who do certain things, say certain things, visit certain places will be raped because they are asking for it, but she's being a good girl so it won't ever happen to her. It's a form of mental defence, bad stuff won't happen if I...(insert talisman of choice)
So if it does, she will find it hard to survive the experience.