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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think that this woman was selfish and quite cruel

122 replies

MistletoeMush · 15/12/2010 21:05

This has probably been done before and I know it is quite a controversial subject. I was just reading an article in Grazia about a woman who was expecting triplets and had two of them aborted. The reasons she gave included financial ones, not wanting to be a stay at home mum, wanting to give more attention to her individual child and not wanting to be bed-ridden during pregnancy when she wanted to be working. Her partner was initially against the abortion but came around. She says she doesn't regret what she did and one day will tell her surviving son about it. She wasn't on the breadline at all, she was working and describes herself as middle class.

Aibu to think that she was very selfish and that son may not be impressed when he is older and she tells him?

OP posts:
Lulumaam · 16/12/2010 13:11

yes, agreed selling your story is not the best move. however, there is a vast market for real life stories on tv and in the papers. someone is reading it

belgo, if she is in the US, it makes even more sense, where medical bills can bankrupt you

ChippingIn · 16/12/2010 13:41

Selling her story to the magazines/papers is cruel & I hope she tells her son before he finds out from someone else. (I haven't read the story). I think it has the potential to be very upsetting for him and create a wedge between them, but it's not a given. I think if she had kept quiet about it and told him when he was an adult, then it would have been better for him.

As for the termination - I honestly don't know. I am pro-choice (in that I don't think we should be dictated to whether we are allowed or not allowed to have an abortion), but I don't think having an abortion should be done lightly (as an 'Oh dear I'll have my 5th abortion, I don't like condoms'), so I guess I am judgemental of women who do make that decision lightly. However, if someone doesn't want a baby - for any reason - then surely it's better that they aren't brought into the world. In an ideal world they would be carried and adopted out, but in reality, they would be brought up by a mother who didn't want them and I think that's much worse than having an abortion. It's not black & white.

I suppose I support her right to do it, even though I wouldn't have done it myself. but I don't condone her behaviour (going to the papers etc).

TondelayoSchwarzkopf · 16/12/2010 13:48

YABU

As many people have pointed out multiple pregnancies carry very high risks and she was making the choice that was right for her particularly if she is in the US with their healthcare and welfare systems.

She has a right to sell her own story. That does not make her 'a silly cow'.

I remember the UK couple who were expecting octuplets (extreme example) who sold their story and were strongly advised to have some of the embryos terminated but didn't. They lost all of them. Sad

It is a very hard decision to make, just as any decision about proceeding with a complicated pregnancy with high risks. Sad Sad Sad that posters are so judgmental.

LouCracker · 16/12/2010 14:03

ClareNasir - i take it you are not having IVF in the UK? I went through IVF 3 times and have never heard of anyone being offered selective reduction.

I know that selective reduction goes on in the USA as routine as there is no limit on the number of embryos replaced but in the UK a maximum of 2 embryos are put back so why would anyone have selective reduction? This makes me so mad. If you don't want the chance of having triplets then don't have 3 embryos transferred!!!

I think this is a very emotive subject and we don't really know the full facts in this case but OP I would be of the same opinion as you if I had read this article.

ClareNasir · 16/12/2010 14:12

Hi Lou, yes, we're doing our IVF in the US. We did a cycle a few weeks ago, unfortunately it was unsuccessful. However, we are back in January for another cycle.

Lulumaam · 16/12/2010 14:15

you can have triplets with two embryos .. one can split into identical twins.

LouCracker · 16/12/2010 14:19

Lulumaam - yes that is true but I know it's pretty rare. The huge majority of IVF twins are non-identical.

ClareNasir - so sorry to hear about your unsuccessful cycle. I will keep everything crossed for success in January x

holyShmoley · 16/12/2010 14:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

JaneS · 16/12/2010 14:29

Lou - but that's what she claims happened to her.

kitstwins · 16/12/2010 14:41

Selective reduction for higher multiple pregnancies is offered in the UK although not widely broadcast as it's usually a private and difficult decision. I haven't read the Grazia article, or Grazia come to that, but I would imagine that the woman is feeling rightful and defiant as she feels the need to defend her actions. Who knows why she feels that way - maybe because she knows that people will judge her (and have judged her?).

I can't say what I'd feel like if I got pregnant with triplets. I have twins and I help run a twins club with a lot of members so I have come across triplet mothers - we have a few in the club (IVF and spontaneously conceived) and I'm under NO illusions about how hard parenting triplets is. There are no extra handouts or extra support for three babies - you're on your own. I suspect I'd feel sick to the pit of my stomach.

I wouldn't dream of questioning someone's decision to terminate a pregnancy. Their decision. My experience is that just because something can feel 100% right for you at that time doesn't mean that it's an emotionally easy or straightforward decision to make. Sometimes the right decision for you at that time can be acutely painful. People tend to forget that and just assume that abortion is chosen because someone wants to be able to fit into their tight jeans for their friend's 30th or other such trivialities. I mean, only shallow, cruel, heartless women actually have abortions don't they? They can't be considered, agonised, grieved over, accepted but painful?

I do question the Grazia lady's wisdom in writing about it so openly - on the one hand maybe it's good to get the subject out there and in the open, but on the other hand there's a large part of me that considers abortion/termination to be a private matter. There's a surviving 'triplet' to consider. Perhaps she's being brave about it, I don't know. Maybe it's the thought that she's being paid for the article (is she?) in which case it just turns into some sensationalist journo saga. Let me wave my banner and spew my emotional guts for $300 and pretend it's for the greater good.

As for hereditary/non hereditary, non identical twins are non hereditary and just the random splitting of an egg that no external or biological factors, inherent or otherwise, can influence. Non identical twins are hereditary as they occur from 'double ovulation' i.e. both ovaries producing an egg during a monthly cycle. If your mother, Grandmother (paternal or maternal), etc. were prone to double ovulation then there is a chance you will too and will conceive non identical twins. Triplets can be conceived naturally, either by a single embryo splitting three ways (producing identical triplets) or, more commonly, a double ovulation resulting in two embryos, one of which then splits into identical twins. NB: in a selective termination of triplets it is usually the identical twins of the pregnancy that are terminated, leaving the single embryo. You're more likely to conceive twins over the age of 35 - something to do with the body getting ready for menopause and 'dumping' eggs through double ovulation and if you live in East Africa - the latter is thought to influenced by an oestrogen-rich diet. Also if you're tall. It's also worth considering that twins are more likely to survive early pregnancy i.e. before 12 weeks due to women routinely taking folate supplements before and during pregnancy. The body, faced with having to build a central nervous system twice over, is more inclined to sustain a pregnancy that it has the building blocks to support.

Sorry for the long waffle. There's a lot of total crap spouted about twins/triplets which really annoys me. Top irritation is "Are they really harder than two singletons" but that's a whole other post.

kitstwins · 16/12/2010 14:43

Sorry - typo. IDENTICAL TWINS are non hereditary. Put 'non' in too often.

LouCracker · 16/12/2010 15:03

kitstwins - not waffling at all, a great post.

LRD - yes, it obviously does happen. I am pro-choice but find something about selling a story about selective termination on lifestyle choice grounds pretty shocking.

JaneS · 16/12/2010 15:12

lou, I didn't like it either - and it was written in a really unpleasant style clearly designed to annoy. Very similar to their 'I won't have babies as I don't want to get fat' story recently, though obviously more upsetting.

I just don't really see the point of discussing what's the most likely way to become pregnant with triplets when she did say how she got pregnant, though.

TheSmallClanger · 16/12/2010 15:16

Triplet pregnancies are really risky. I don't think what she did was even that unusual, especially if it was an odd multiple fertilisation scenario with embryos of differing ages.
I haven't read the article, but I suspect that it was heavily edited to make it more polarising and sensational. They usually do that.

TandB · 16/12/2010 16:01

I am not sure what I think about this happening. I certainly couldnt do it for non-medical reasons.

However, I think she was completely and totally wrong to go to a magazine about this. I do not think this story should have been told even to the surviving child, never mind every man and his dog. There is no need for the child to know that he could easily have been aborted and it was sheer chance that he was not ne of the embryos selected for termination. The only person who might feel any benefit from that disclosure would be the mother and I think that this is a secret that would have been best kept. Honesty is not always the best policy when it has the potential to hurt someone so badly.

midori1999 · 16/12/2010 16:07

I am not pro choice nor pro life really. I hate the idea of termination, but do accept there are circumstances where a termination is best for all concerned and that that isn't always a medical reason. I can't stand of women taking it lightly though and the fact is, some do.

I really don't like the idea of someone choosing to become pregnant and then deciding they don't want all the babies they concieved so aborting some. Surely we all know, however unlikely, that there is a chance of multiple pregnancy for all of us.

I agree with what Chippingin said too.

BuzzLightBeer · 16/12/2010 16:10

She doesn't need to justify it, nobody does. How can you hate the phrase your body your choice, unless you think someone else should control your body instead of you?

Theres no BUT with pro-choice.

MrsTittleMouse · 16/12/2010 16:18

I love the posters on here who know exactly what they would do in any given situation. Seems to crop up a lot in threads about infertility treatment, I find.

jessiealbright · 16/12/2010 16:22

Maybe she thinks being open about it will help other women?

I don't know what I would have done in her situation, and I hope I never have to find out.

People often make jokes to me about "trying for triplets" next time. Every time, I shudder internally. I can't imagine how the parents of triplets cope. Pregnancy must be unbearable, and then with a long-term stay in SCBU likely to follow.

jessiealbright · 16/12/2010 16:23

huh, cross-post with MrsTittleMouse.

BalloonSlayer · 16/12/2010 16:29

I doubt it was sheer chance if there was a set of identical twins and a larger single foetus. I don't think it's possible to selectively abort one identical twin, so it sounds like the larger single baby was "chosen."

BuzzLightBeer · 16/12/2010 16:39

Why wouldn't it be chance?

Strictly · 16/12/2010 16:41

Frankly I think it horrifying. I cannot imagine in a million years deciding which babies to abort and which one to keep alive Xmas Shock

As for selling her story. WTF! Is she actually proud that she aborted 2 babies in one go? It's like those 'people' in America who ran a website asking people to vote on whether she had an abortion. Some people are just warped.

hifi · 16/12/2010 16:42

awful

BalloonSlayer · 16/12/2010 16:47

Why wouldn't it be chance? Because the non-identical twin baby would have been chosen as more likely to survive.