Child Protection over Friends Only Facebook Pics

[HarrietSchulenberg]

At the nursery Christmas play parents were asked not to put photos on the internet in order to respect the privacy of other parents and children. I take internet security VERY seriously due to my paid work and that of my H, which requires absolute confidentiality. I am also a School Governor.

I put some pictures of my son on Facebook. My photos and profile are accessible only to my Friends, which comprise of a very small group of personal friends and family. The photos did not contain any reference to the school, the children (other than my son's first name), year group or other identifiable information. I never tag photos.

I received a phone call from the Child Protection officer from the School today. My photos had come to their attention and I was formally reminded of the need for internet security.

Through a process of elimination of my Facebook Friends (wasn't hard) I have worked out who is responsible. I am very hurt and surprised that this person has put me in this position, seeing as her own internet security is, at best, lax.

Have I been very stupid, or AIBU to think that I have not breached any child protection measures? I could just have well have printed the pics and shown them round at the school gates.

And so that's why some schools have blanket bans, because to try and get a whole group of adults to reach a consensus on an emotive topic is often near-impossible. Most parents think of their child first and foremost, some refuse to consider any other point of view is valid.
Schools have an equal responsibility for all their children, and perceived threats to their safety.
Niceguy, re eating nuts? Yes, many schools ban peanuts and peanut-based products on the premises.

thanks maryz I didnt realise the thread was so long and I see that now. And yes publishing the pics on FB is a little different to a bunch of snaps in a family album.

At least next year when no-one is allowed to take any photos you'll understand why. Well done for ruining it for everyone.

You should resign. You put photos of other children on FB without the permission of their parents. You don't have a leg to stand on and you know it.

I think its already clearly been stated that it doesn't matter if OP had a photo of just her own child or a bunch of other kids. She is legally entitled to do what she likes with them. Yes including put them on facebook or even....shock Flickr!

Yes, school asked her not to do something but they cannot compel her to.

Maryz, the answer is quite simple. Because that's life. Everybody is different and has different circumstances. I mean extending your logic, surely no child should miss out on knowing what its like to have a father's love? Therefore we either should ban all father's from school or they look in yellow pages under "father's for hire" and hire one for every child of a single parent family. Or are you arguing that I'm being unreasonable and little Johnny should go without a dad when everyone else has one?

More concerning to me is the complete death of common sense nowadays. We're bringing kids up in a world where simple games like conkers are banned or must be played as an organised activity complete with goggles. We CRB check not only teachers but even the bloody plumber. Nobody wins or loses at our primary school sports day. I have never seen such a boring event in my life.

We're bringing up a generation of dysfunctional kids who cannot take any knocks both physically or emotionally because they've never been allowed to. We've taught them that the world is such a dangerous place that we can't even take photos of them. That peado's lurk at every twist and turn. Ready to do....well....we never tell them that do we?

MrsBonkers, the only reason why next year no-one is allowed to take photos is because people are now too scared to use their common sense. We have fear drilled into us so deep now that we are willing to give up our rights for "protection".

Niceguy makes some good points.

Niceguy2, I'm stunned by your idea of logic.

If I don't want my child's picture to be posted online, that's my choice. I expect my decision about my child's right to privacy to be respected. You can speculate over the reasons I might have for that and find your own counter-arguments, but that's all in your own head.

FWIW, new guidelines issued by Directgov emphasise that parents are free to take pictures at school events as long as they are only for personal use.

Erm, yes it is. Publishing photos on facebook is a right. It's called freedom of speech. Even though its technically a photo. If OP has take photos legally and therefore owns the copyright then she can do what she pleases.

In fact, you could go up to a policeman right now, take a snap of his cheerful demeanour and post it on the internet. There's NOTHING he can do. Not unless he had reasonable suspicion that you are a terrorist.

Why is having a photo of a child published not good for children? Go to google now, search for children then hit images. Are you seriously arguing all those poor children are potential child abuse victims? What must the parents be thinking eh?

Coming back to the original topic for a moment, what we are talking about is the 21st century equivalent of taking some photos and sharing them with some of your friends. I'm not seeing whats wrong with that. If OP had printed the same photos out out, stuck them in an album and shown every single one of her facebook friends privately in her living room, would there be a problem? No, i should think not. So why is this any different?

If I don't want my child's picture to be posted online, that's my choice.

My child would be participating on the basis that people keep to the rules. I'm currently in the process of reviewing our school's policy on this, (it's currently banned) and I'd called myself arrogant for thinking some people might choose to flout guidelines.

Imagine.

Well Breacon. Let me suggest this as a sensible policy for your school

1. Send a letter asking if anyone has any objections to photos being taken. And if so they can discuss concerns with teacher/head
2. If yes then parents are informed and asked not to bring cameras
3. If no then party time.

Look I'm not unreasonable or uncaring. If there is a real issue I'd happily forgo taking some photos. BUT what irks me is the whole "THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!" brigade. They claim its in the interests of child protection but usually there is none and I argue that their misguided cotton wool namby pambyism does more harm than good.

Like I keep saying, the tail should not wag the dog. You'll probably find every parent is as pissed off as the next that they can't take photos. Imagine eh? A parent wanting to take photos to remember their child's nativity play? How dare they!?!?!

"If I don't want my child's picture to be posted online, that's my choice"

Oh no it isn't. It's the choice of the owner of the photograph.

"Well if people carry on being so disrespectful to everyone else's wishes, we will end up not being allowed to take photographs anywhere."

Well, no only in a very small section such as schools and LA owned buildings / land.

Unless there's a massive change in the political system in this country the rules around photography in public spaces are unlikely to change - that's why they're called public.

If you don't want your kids to appear in other people's photos then don't leave the house. Simple enough.

And personally I'm not about to ruin the carefully composed and crafted photo I have of my kids playing in the park by blocking out other kids faces just in case some idiot parent gets prissy about their kid's "image".

I also think the OP is being unreasonable however. If she is a Governor she should set an example and follow the rules - no matter now idiotic they may be.

A public place is very different from a school. A school is not a public place and can be identified and a child located by joining the dots.

Turn it around slightly: why should I be prevented from taking pictures of my child at school events because others can't be trusted to use the images responsibly?

IMO YANBU.

However, speaking as a childminder, I have a policy of never puting any pictures of anyone on Facebook - especially other people's children - without their expressed permission in writing. In reality, I rarely load up or put pictures of anyone else but myself and my children.*

To quote one poster from other similar thread regarding Facebook is "Avoid, avoid, avoid."

*Going off on a tangent her, I have 32 Facebook friends. My privacy setting are on "friends only". My mother is not a Facebook friend. However, she managed to obtain photos and the tale of the event that I had yet to inform her of, but of which I had shared on Facebook.

It turns out that one of my Facebook friends from my school days, had "saved as" the pictures on to her computer/hard drive, and printed them out and showed them to several other people who did not have access to a computer (her own parents for example) nor access to my Facebook. Of course, word got back to my mother, as did the pictures.

From that one incident, I learnt that however 'private' you attempt to make your Facebook, assume that everything you load on Facebook - and indeed anywhere on the web/internet - will be accessible to everyone.

"Amazing how these things snowball." Correct and this is why I will quote your experience as a cautionary tale about Facebook.

I just meant it isn't "good for children" as in it isn't something they need for their well-being.

new2cm. A good example. And may I ask what the end result was?

Did a peado come out and kidnap a child?

Did an old some mythical adoptive parent see and demand to see the child they gave up years ago?

Or did a few people take a moments pleasure out of looking at some photos which they've now probably totally forgetten about?

To those that have said that "Newspapers need permission from every parent of a child in the photograph" is not true. - at my old school, and where my sister currently attends, at the start of every new school year, a data collection sheet is sent round to confirm emergency details/faith etc and attached to this is a media request form that basically says photos may be taken throughout the school year by the school or parties instructed to do so by the school. Do you give permission for Your child to be photographed.
If you have signed this and given permission (which, as it is a very sporty school, with photos in newspapers most week) then the school can release them to get published.

I still don't really understand the child protection issues with putting pictures on facebook.

In the case of avoiding birth parents, unless the child has their own profile under their own birthname (in which case all bets are off anyway), for the birth family to come across the pictures, they would have to be friends with someone who posted the picture (or a friend of a friend, or a friend of a friend of a friend etc. - though the likelihood of each of those showing up on a news feed reduces the more steps away you are)

It's extremely unlikely that the birth family are just going to stumble across these pictures.

Are there any documented cases of this actually happening?

I would have thought there was a greater risk in going to the shops.

I think it's mainly paedo-paranoia - the thought that some dirty old man somewhere is having a wank over pictures of your kids. No actual harm is done, of course, and it's extremely unlikely, but who said parents had to be rational?