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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to wonder why some charities are seen as more compulsory than others?

62 replies

SparklingExplosionGoldBrass · 04/11/2010 23:33

There are, after all, shitloads of charities, all needing donations, and no one has enough spare income to support them all. Yet it seems like some are so extra special that unless you're visibly supporting them, you can get harassed for it.
OK this is partly inspired by this thread, but I was also remembering a fuss a few years back when some or other TV presenter was seen on TV in early November NOT WEARING A POPPY and you'd think he'd shat on a box of babies or something... About the only other charity I can think of that triggers this level of near-bullying among the stupid is Comic Relief - anyone else got any candidates?

OP posts:
2shoes · 05/11/2010 08:27

well I have never had trouble getting money of charities for dd. I think, child, disabled, cute is a winner.
but I imagine that when she is 20 something, it will be impossible as she won't be "cute" anymore.

sarah293 · 05/11/2010 08:31

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

Threaders · 05/11/2010 08:33

I think the difference with rememberance day is that every single man, woman and child who lives in the UK today is directly affected by the actions of those who served in WWI and WWII.

Quite why anybody would choose such a time to make a moral stand is quite gobsmacking to me. The RBL do not fund current or future wars, they provide support services to ex-servicemen and women regardless of age, and as an ex-serviceman myself I sincerely hope they will still be around for many years to come.....

That's not to say that I think they are worthy of more publicity than other charities. Not in the slightest. I just think it's pretty obvious as to why they receive so much exposure at a certain time of the year. Just like Children In Need does, and indeed Comic Relief.

Suda · 05/11/2010 08:36

I hate the emotional blackmail aspect of it. Like when you go in a supermarket and some smug young girl says 'Would you like to help children with terminal illness ?' or 'Would you like to help starving children?'.

I mean what are you supposed to say - 'NO' ??

I've started challenging this as it is obviously a deliberate ploy IMO.

I now say 'Yes of course - who wouldnt ? - and walk off. Then if the more cocky ones follow me and ask if I'm contributing then - I will say - 'Oh I see - that was a loaded question - you actually want money - you should have said so !' Then I walk away again. [evil]

LoopyLoops · 05/11/2010 08:45

I don't agree with the Poppy fund for many reasons.

Firstly, I don't think ex-servicemen and women should have to rely on charitable donations. They were sent into combat by our government, and the government should pay for care if they are injured. The Poppy Fund has become a convenient excuse for the government to avoid dealing with their responsibilities properly.

Secondly, I do not want to celebrate war. I feel for those who were drafted in the wars, especially those who lost their lives as it was not their choice. Those who choose to join the military do so through free will. They don't have my sympathy (or respect tbh.). For this reason, I wear a white poppy when I can find one. I find it bizarre that people object to white poppies when they were introduced before the red ones, and symbolise a similar thing, though with the emphasis on peace.

Thirdly, when appeals like the Poppy Fund, Comic Relief etc. come out, people seem to think that they can donate a little to that and forget all other charities for a while. As already discussed, other charities need donations too. I prefer to donate to those less high-profile ones.

Threaders · 05/11/2010 08:51

LoopyLoops - I'm just wondering how you equate poppy day with "celebrating war"?

laweaselmys · 05/11/2010 08:58

I am not hugely happy with poppys either.

I tend to buy ANZAC biscuits, because the money goes to the same people but no poppy.

War is an attrocious thing, where horrible decisions get made. WW1 & 2 are particularly bad for having used soldiers as cannon fodder and distractions which gets forgotten. Civilian and enemy (often young indoctrinated or forced) victims are forgotten too.

I would welcome a day which remembers all the victims of war - not just celebrating the victors.

SuePurblybilt · 05/11/2010 09:15

If I don't wear a red ribbon on World Aids day, nobody assumes I don't want a cure or speculates that I don't donate in private. I don't wear a poppy, or a red nose or any ribbons but I donate, more than I can afford. Tbh I'm tired of being told that this makes me unsupportive or disrespectful to those who died in the wars. It really doesn't.

LoopyLoops · 05/11/2010 09:17

It celebrates war by commemorating only those who fought. Civilians, the 'enemy', their civilians and other victims of war are forgotten, as leweaselmys notes, in favour of those who actively fought. Veterans are seen to be brave and valliant. I'm sure many are/were, but not all. Some did hideous things because they were in positions of power. Civilians are able to show courage just as well as soldiers.
If remembrance day was to remember all those who have been hurt or killed in wars, without the emphasis on the military, I would be much happier.

Anniegetyourgun · 05/11/2010 09:24

It makes me angry when it makes you angry that other people choose, eg, animal charities over human, overseas charities over homebased (or vice versa), children over old people etc. The fundamental point is that it is just that: charity. Nobody "has" to give a brass farthing to any one of them, but they all (arguably) do a vital job which otherwise wouldn't get done. Furthermore we all have our own priorities. It is not for one person to dictate to another what should be considered more worthy (which I think was, at least in part, SGB's original point).

So, say you see me popping a spare quid into the RSPCA box (which actually I wouldn't, before Valhalla looks at me funny!). You might feel like nudging me and hissing "psst! There are children starving in Africa, you know!" Well, there's a fair point in there; but for a start, you don't know I didn't bung two quid into the Oxfam box in the previous shop. And to carry on with, some people think charity begins at home. You might think I should show species loyalty; I might think that animals are suffering because of what human beings do to them, and I for one would like to redress the balance. Supposing I really couldn't care less about people suffering in other countries (as unfortunately many don't), the alternative is not that I bung the money into a starving children box; it is that I keep all my money to myself,.

You might see me bunging a quid into the NSPCC box, and again the nudge and whisper "The NSPCC have plenty of money, what about supporting a less fashionable charity?" To which I could reply "As long as the NSPCC have a job to do, they need all the money they can get". Or "I can't be naffed to research unfashionable charities, but here's a box and I feel like putting my spare change into it, what's your problem?" Again the alternative is not that the local burns unit, a lonely old person, a mentally disturbed teen or a flooded African village get the money instead, but that the money stays in my purse and probably ends up contributing to the annual profits of Messrs Rowntree and to another inch on my already ample hips.

I could put this well-travelled coin into a missionary box because I believed strongly that bringing the joy of Jesus's love to those living in sad ignorance is a truly charitable act; that saving an immortal soul from damnation is more important than saving their bodies from earthly discomfort; or even (in the teeth of the evidence!) that spreading the Gospel contributes to world peace. Should I then have a right to insist you do the same? It would be so clear to me that if you teach children about the love of God they will not grow up to shoot their neighbours, I just couldn't understand why you would want to focus narrowly on one parochial, superficial issue like adults with facial scarring. On the other hand you believe that Churches peddle pernicious nonsense, and that the joy you can personally bring to one young woman by restoring her disfigured face is what charity is all about.

Could go on, of course (and on, and on...), but the point is, you have to give to what you believe in. If you have a cause you support passionately, it is up to you not only to give it money, but to spend time and effort raising its profile. People who give to the "wrong" charity aren't depriving yours, they're giving where they see a need. It's up to you to persuade them your charity's need is greater!

LoopyLoops · 05/11/2010 09:34

Brilliant post Annie.

For what it's worth, the people who say they don't understand prioritising animal charities over human ones make me want to never donate to hum ones again.
Why the bloody hell do animal charities exist? Because humans are cruel, wasteful bullies. Protecting entirely innocent creatures from barbaric, spiteful and arrogant humans is far more important to me than subsidising the pensions of people who chose a particular career.

Threaders · 05/11/2010 09:35

I think some people are missing the point - choose who you want to remember, but make sure you do remember. And don't judge those who want to pay their respects to the soldiers of our country and it's allies who fought an enemy for the freedom of this country and the rest of the democratic world - I think you've got a cheek if you begrudge those that wish to do so.

I can see this thread could get derailed by the arguments for and against poppies, so perhaps we should leave it there.

LoopyLoops · 05/11/2010 09:36

('hum' should be 'human')

Threaders · 05/11/2010 09:39

Annie - very well said. You are right - you should feel the freedom to give to whoever you see fit, whoever you want, absolutely. The sheer act of giving to those who need it should be enough, regardless of who it may be. But as you pointed out, folk shouldn't cast shadows over the choices of others, specifically in this case those who choose to wear a red poppy.

LoopyLoops · 05/11/2010 09:39

I don't understand "make sure you do remember". Are you saying we must ll remember something war-related on armistice day? I am too young to remember WWI or II. All I have to remember is the unnecessary and cruel invasion of other countries, the destruction of their infrastructures and loss of life at the hands of our military. A poppy won't help me commemorate those victims. However, if other people choose to wear their poppies that is fine by me, I won't begrudge them that.

Threaders · 05/11/2010 09:48

Well yes, I think you should remember considering it's almost inevitable that you have direct family (grandparents, great grandparents) who fought and possibly died to protect our liberties. Is it really too much to ask that you spare a thought, even if just for a moment, for the millions of lives lost (on both sides if you wish) whether you agree with the reasons for war or not? I don't really care if you wear a poppy or not, of course I would like as many donations to the RBL as possible but I would never hound you for not donating - thats your personal choice, and freedom of choice is precisely what those men and women fought for.

littleducks · 05/11/2010 09:54

I do understand the ops point, i no longer wear a poppy as to me it had always symbolised the sacrifice in WW1 and WW2 but seems increasingly to have become blurred with the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan that I opposed. I went on anti war marches etc and felt totally ignored by the goverment, to me they are immoral and illegal wars.

It also angers me that there is need for the 'Help our Heroes' and similar charities, why are injured soldiers sent to fight by our goverment relying on charitable donations for medical treatment and rehabilitation. The cost of this should be included as a 'war expense' and budgetted for (as should proper equipment).

As a charity the Royal British Legion always seems one of the better ones but the whole campaign does seem to be hijacked by a political/media element that you must wear a poppy for appearance sake.

I always try to support small charitys, with proper volunters not ones that are run like businesses with large numbers of paid staff, especially blooming chuggers accosting you in the street or charity shops with really high prices as the costs need to cover the manager and staffs wages (yes British Heart Foundation i mean you).

If anyone knows of good carity desperate for support they should post and i will put them on my list, i think places like childrens hospices struggle to be known outside a small area.

curlymama · 05/11/2010 09:59

Well said annie

As long as people give where they can to a cause that they support, how can they be reasonably critizised for that.

Personally I can't abide Comic Relief and others like it because all those slebs raise their own profiles by spending huge amounts of money climbing Kilamanjaro or whatever, when if they actually gave a toss they could simply give the money. I also hate the way I am almost forced to give to these charities, otherwise my child gets left out of some exciting event at school, or is made to feel bad by not donating. Angry

FreeButtonBee · 05/11/2010 10:06

I don't wear a poppy - growing up in Northern Ireland in the Eighties gives you a rather different view of the British army and I'm afraid that I just can't support its veterans. I wish them no harm but I'm not interested in actively supporting the poppy appeal. Bank station in London is a bloody nightmare at the moment though - have been dodging sergeant major types bellowing "Poppppyyyy" at the top of their voice for the past 2 weeks now.

No one has ever commented on it other than my DH (English). We've discussed it and he understands my view and we agree to differ.

LoopyLoops · 05/11/2010 10:10

Oh I do think about people who have lost their lives Threaders, but that is not limited to war veterans. I don't feel obliged to wear a symbol of heroin addiction, suicide, cancer or other awful things that have killed people I know. I also think of the citizens of Coventry, for example, who died unnecessarily in the bombing when our leaders knew it would happen. I 'remember' the millions of slaves and prisoners who were used to build our empire, and their wives and children who were raped and pillaged so that our country could be more glorious. The problem is, there are so many things to 'remember' that to me, being a soldier isn't so much of a priority.

On another note, what I really hate is when people want to go skydiving or whatever because it sounds fun, then ask others to fund it by claiming it is for charity. I always refuse to sponsor people for those kinds of things unless they pay the amount it costs to actually partake in the event.

Threaders · 05/11/2010 10:21

Loopy - am in complete agreement on the skydiving thing, I share your views entirely on that one

Vallhala · 05/11/2010 10:22

Annie - :o

I'd taken a deep breath, looked at you funny and was just about to yell "DON'T"! :o

Great post, which sums up how I feel only far more eloquently.

(Oh, and P.S., put your spare animal-benefitting pennies in a no-kill animal rescue box please folks, and NOT the murderous, hugely over-funded RSPCA).

SuePurblybilt · 05/11/2010 10:28

YY to the Skydivers. Pay for your own jollies, then we'll talk sponsorship Grin

Anniegetyourgun · 05/11/2010 11:01
Grin

Don't worry, I know that one. Among other things I'm told they are rather quick to put down black and black-and-white cats because they are harder to home (people aren't interested in "common" colours apparently). Both our beautiful (rescued) cats are black-and-white so it makes me a bit ill to think of it.

Shameless plug for www.anim-mates.org.uk/ btw!

tethersend · 05/11/2010 11:23

Interesting article