To think that children's names should be spelt roughly how they sound

[cleggy36]

There's a boy in my Cub pack who has a name which sounds like a very common boy's name but which has what I assume is a traditional Gaelic spelling. As a result it is more than twice as long as the more common spelling and has only the first letter in common. There is no possible way that anyone not familiar with the name could get even close to pronouncing it correctly. And it's not one I've ever come across before, such as Niamh, which is also tricksy, but slightly better known.

I just think that as a child life has enough challenges without being lumbered with a name which almost everybody is going to pronounce or spell completely incorrectly just to satisfy the parents cultural identity.

red-de-mama :o

at the Spanish Janes. Good to know.

Why not just substitute the word 'Asian' for 'Gaelic' to see how unreasonable you're being? Words, names and their spellings are living history and shouldn't be homogenised to an Anglo-Centric bland-o-rama spelling for anything.

Diamondback Ni Dubhtaig

PS, I have quite a few foreign students with unusual names and I ask them how to pronounce it - it's called being polite.

You mean like Siobhán(shiv-awn), Fionn(fyunn), Clíona (clee-in-a), Sadhbh(sive), Sinéad (shin-aid), Síoda(shee-id-a), Saoirse (seer-sha), Catríona (cat-ree-ina), Odharnait(oar-nay), Aine(on-ya), Gearóid (gar-ode), Tomás (tum-awse)

OK - I could go on and on and on and on

I think Gaelic names are beautiful in their original spelling, look horrible when spelt in an alternative way.

Actually, Op, I think I understand what you mean. Some parents are pretentious, and pick an extreme Irish name, like Caolfhionn (ceel-hinn) just to sound great and it's hard for the child.

Dubhfhíosa (doo-fee-sa) and Oníosa (own-eesa) Gormlaith (gorm-la) are other examples...

OP not gone, just busy at work. I didn't expect many people to think that IABR but one or two have said they grew up hating their names, and I wonder what that must be like. Maybe worth it in the end, but then again, maybe not for some children.

I grew up hating my name and it is a bog standard, very common, properly spelt English name.

OP, you remind me of my MIL. When introduced to one of the Chinese students who would be lodging with her, she wrinkled her nose and asked him "Do you have an English name that we can use instead?"

If it was Rory / Ruaridh maybe the OP has a point.

IMVHO they are different names (I am Scottish). Rory is (RO- RY) and the other is RU-RAY......

I know of one who is spelt Ruaridh and pronounced Rory and quite frankly I think that is just wrong.

I have also come across other kids with the gaelic spelling of names and an anglicised pronunciation - to my mind it should be all or nothing eg. Mhairi as already alluded to is pronounced Vari but I know several whose parents want it said as Mairi which is actually a different name.

Hope I've not confused too many people.

Mairi isn't a different name to Mhairi, it's a different case of Mairi. Mairi becomes Mhairi if you're speaking about Mairi. Similar things happen with other words beginning with M (Mor/Mhor).

That is one of the reasons why I gave up learning Gaelic. Insane language.

Although you are right, you still don't pronounce Mhairi as Mairi. It's just one of the few things I remember from my Gaelic lessons!

Full marks to the OP for coming up with a truly original thread! A rarity on MN!

I'm sure I won't be the first to point out that English is only one of the languages to grace our wonderfully varied planet, and that it's because of the rich international heritage that English itself is not phonetic. And nor are many English names. So yes, YABU!

chipmonkey, why do I remind you of your MIL? I pronounce his name as his parents do and write it as his parents do, it would be wrong for me to do otherwise. As I said in my last post, what I wonder is what life is like if you are one of the children (a few of whom have posted here) who don't like their own name. The child I am talking about may love his name, I've never asked.

We met a Caoimhe on holiday this year. Thanks to my education on MN, I was able to pronounce it correctly, which was pretty much the first time that had ever happened.

What can I say though, I have kids named the same as missing girls, ark builders and cats

I haven't read this thread other than the OP so sorry if repeating. But I just felt compelled to respond. What an utterly idiotic subject title. Now as I say I haven't read the rest of the thread so it's quite possible that you redeem yourself later on. But I just read the title and was immediately seething. Is it just (childrens) names that you think should be spelt roughly how they sound? Why just names? Why not every single word in the english language? How should we spell them, phonetically? Let's just reduce the entire human race back to grunts and snorts shall we? What a ridiculous statement to make!

We decided to call our daughter Aoife. It's an irish name and is pronounced 'Eefa'. I think that if spelling or pronouncing her name to other people is the hardest thing she has to accomplish in her life than she is very very lucky and very very limited.

You sound totally blinkered and ignorant and i wonder what your child is called.

How funny, i know a Mhairi and a Caoimhe.

I hate my own name, which is Greek and beloved of 'lovely old lady names' threads. I love the Scottish names though, they must be due for a general popularity?

Apoplogies, cleggy! In fact I really shouldn't compare anyone with my MIL, she is quite mad!

I suppose what I meant was, that it seemed that you thought these Gaelgeoirs should conform to British society norms so that their son should fit in. And my MIL felt the Chinese guy should change his name to fit in with us Irish folk.

I have a difficult Irish surname and a not so difficult Irish first name. I have to spell my surname everywhere I go, even in Ireland but you know what? It's no big deal at all and sometimes can even be a conversation-starter.

I also deal with a lot of "forriners" in work and although I sometimes think "Jeez, where are the vowels?" when presented with an Eastern European name, I would never think that person should change the spelling of their name to make life easier for themselves for for me. Your name is part of your identity and your cultural heritage and no-one should ever feel the need to change it, no matter where you live.

Rolergirl1, based on your rant I don't even think you actually read my OP. And incidentally SpeedyGonzales gave me full marks for coming up with an original thread, so maybe YABU as well.

chipmonkey: I'm totally with you. I don't see why having to spell your name is a big cumbersome thing. And I also think it can be a natural thing that may just set you apart from others when older.

I am struggling to understand why someone would want to change their name or need to. Unless they were an actor/actress and wanted to.

Sorry for not engaging with the debate (OP YAB so so U), but these Englsh names make me laugh so I'm pasting them in so you can share my laughter at The Posh.

Featherstonehaugh - Fanshaw
Beauchamp - Beecham
Cholmondely - Chumley
Fotheringay - Fungee
Woolfardisworthy ? Wolzi
Belvoir - Beaver
Marjoribanks - Marchbanks
Magdalene - Maudlin
Menzies - Mingiss
St John - Sinjun
Bohun - Boon
Colquhoun - Cahoon
Ralph - Raif
Smellie - Smiley
Wriothesley - Rizli
Mainwaring - Mannering
Beaudesert - Belzer

Thank you for your reply, chipmomkey. The nub of my OP is that when parents name their children they should think about how it is going to be for the child, who has to live with the name (which they have no choice about) every day and not just what they like themselves.

I appreciate diversity. I once worked with a lady whose name was lakhdesha which in her language meant "one hundred thousand stars" which I thought was beatiful. I just think my point above still applies, although obviously when you name a baby you can't tell what they are going to think of their name.

are you havinga laugh,is it because you are unable to pronounce and spell gaelic names

applying your logic
siobahn=shevawn
aoife-efa