To think that children's names should be spelt roughly how they sound

[cleggy36]

There's a boy in my Cub pack who has a name which sounds like a very common boy's name but which has what I assume is a traditional Gaelic spelling. As a result it is more than twice as long as the more common spelling and has only the first letter in common. There is no possible way that anyone not familiar with the name could get even close to pronouncing it correctly. And it's not one I've ever come across before, such as Niamh, which is also tricksy, but slightly better known.

I just think that as a child life has enough challenges without being lumbered with a name which almost everybody is going to pronounce or spell completely incorrectly just to satisfy the parents cultural identity.

I changed dd1's spelling to Tegan, So actually left out a couple of letters and dd2 is Sidney, changing the y to an i. I don't think i have broken any rules

In a twist on this, me and my other half can't agree on how my daughters name is pronounced, so we have agreed to differ and she answers to either now.

It's people like the OP that made me hate my name as a child (another Irish one, tis also used in Scotland with different spelling).

People can be incredibly rude, I get comments along the lines of "that's a stupid way to spell it", "what made them call you that?"
"oh, I can't say that, I'll call you XXXX instead".
I used to wish I was called Sarah or Lisa and even now, if I'm in a situation where I won't meet the people again I will lie and give a "normal" name.
But it's actually not my job to have an "easy" name, it's the job of others to not be rude. I did a public facing job for many years where I dealt with people from a huge variety of cultural backgrounds and sometimes I didn't have a clue how to pronounce or spell a name, but I ALWAYS ASK, nicely! And even if I think I know, I check.

Manners cost nothing (grr).

People generally spend some time choosing names for their children and presumably have very valid reasons for choosing those names - and I can't see what the OP s problem is - if you're not sure how to pronounce just ask - just good manners surely.

For what its worth I've a very simple four letter first name which is constantly spelt wrong. Ithink its great to see the variety in names and names moving from being usual in just one culture to others.

I'm in two minds about the OP as I have an extremely unusual name. People always think that I have spelled my own name incorrectly and mangle the pronunciation. Except for DH and my midwife who pronounced it correctly the first time they saw it as they have studied Latin.

Growing up, I hated my name, especially at school and learned to put up my hand when I saw the teacher's face cloud over as he/she got to my name on the register. And I loved the name Jane (still do) as it was so simple to pronounce and spell.

OTOH, once people know how my name is pronounced and spelled, they very rarely get it wrong again and often tell me how lovely it is, and I do like that I never get mistaken for someone else.

However, DH and I have decided to give our small one (due December) a first name and a middle name that are usable names so that they can have a choice as to which one they prefer. I never had the choice to have a more normal or unusual name so I want my children to have it.

Sorry for the waffle. Guess I can see both sides.

You are so right, OP.

Calls for an instant ban on Thomas, Michael, Chloe and Phoebe etc. How do we know it's Chlo-ee and Pheebee rather than Chleee and Phoy-bee; there's nothing in the spelling to show, is there? And absolutely nothing to show that Thomas is pronounced with a T and not a TH. Oh, but you've learnt that? Well, then you can learn a few more names too.

I have an unusual English/French name with the traditional spelling that can be pronounced several different ways. Have spent my life correcting peoples pronounciation and spelling. Hey-ho. Don't consider myself to be hard done by.

I live in the North of Scotland. In my daughters school there is Cailean, Coinneach, Sheamus, Ruariadh, Eilidh, Innes, Aonghus, Sine to name a few. All perfectly normal traditional gaelic names.

Best not move up here eh Cleggy?

Actually Innes isn't gaelic but seems to be less common the further south you go.

There is a huge difference between Irish names (eg Siobhan & Aoife) and Tray-C, so on behalf of the Irish & the Welsh etc YABU

I have a very normal name which is easy to spell and is spelt the way it sounds and people still get it wrong on a daily basis.

The thing is, the name is probably spelt exactly how it sounds, in the gaelic alphabet. Like any non-English names or even words for that matter. So YABU.

D

My name is also a very 'normal' name with common spelling - still no one could spell it properly until Rachel Green came along.

The most interesting thing about this thread is seeing how people's local accents affect their phonetic perception.

eg I wouldn't say Mary as "May-ray" I would say it as "mair-ree"

SEE ANN for Sean and Sian.

The fury is upon me. A few years ago (actually 20 years ago, jeez) I worked in a place where there were 2 Ciara's.

One pronounced it properly - Keer-rah and the other SEE ARE RAH.

Keer-rah used to go proper eye roll-y mad whenever someone even mentioned SEE ARE RAH.

haha

The Irish for Irish is Gaeilge!!! The English for Gaeilge is Irish. My sister who lives in England gave her children very Irish names which her Indian inlaws find very difficult. Just as difficult as I find some of theirs when I visit. Good manners to learn though.

The Irish for Irish is Gaeilge!!! The English for Gaeilge is Irish. My sister who lives in England gave her children very Irish names which her Indian inlaws find very difficult. Just as difficult as I find some of theirs when I visit. Good manners to learn though.

"And I loved the name Jane (still do) as it was so simple to pronounce and spell."

Except, of course, knowing if its Jane or Jayne. :o

Would the Spanish pronounce Jane as Hain? In the manner of Juan? Or Jesus?

good point Deliaskis...Names like SIOBHAN are said exactly as they are spelled, its not our fault if people can't read Irish is it?

SoupDragon Ah. Point taken. Bear in mind though, I was going by literary tradition(Jane Banks from Mary Poppins, Jane Bennett , Jane Eyre, etc). And, with my judgypants on, given that literary tradition, why would you spell it with a 'y'?

SuePurblybilt Good question. I think, though, from the spelling, it would quite obviously be a non-Spanish name just as Juan or Jesus are not English names. Whether or not something is self-evident in pronunciation may depend, as BonniePrinceBilly points out, on whether or not one speaks the language from which they originate.

I'm finding this thread quite interesting especially as DH and I are enjoying ourselves contemplating names for the small one due to arrive in December.

Not only are my sons called Rhys and Siôn, my daughter's middle name is Angharad and my DH's name is Dylan... you can see why this subject gets my back up can't you?

Re. the pronunciation of Caoimhe - in Ulster Irish (spoken in Donegal and the six counties of N. Ireland) it would be "Kee-vah"; in Munster and Connacht Irish (spoken everywhere else on the island) it would be "Kwee-vah".

Suepurblybit - the Spanish would actually pronounce it Ha-nay because they pronounce every vowel :)

Well although my DS' name has an Irish spelling I do think you have a bit of a point cos both my first name, though 'common', has a slightly unusual spelling (for a reason) and my surname always causes problems, sometimes with hilarious results.

I always have to repeat my names and spell them out letter by letter and yes that is tedious.

My DS' first name is a pretty common Irish name (and short) so that shouldn't give him too much trouble and he just has his dad's surname which is easy. I deliberately did not lumber him with my surname as he would spend his life spelling it out.

We could have spelt his first name the English way. But I just much prefer the Irish spelling -can't really say why.

megonthemoon (and others) - What a Spanish person would actually do, IME, if you were called Jane is ask your name, listen, perhaps ask you to repeat it, and then do their best to say it with the appropriate pronounciation.

At least, that's what they've always done in my experience - I'm not called Jane, but I have a common English first name that uses sounds not found in Spanish. And indeed dd has a first name starting with a J.

Alternatively you might choose (as I often did with older people, or when meeting people casually who we weren't likely to get to know well) to introduce yourself using the nearest Spanish equivalent name. (For dd we only used her 'proper' anglicised name at nursery, elsewhere we used the Spanish version, so she answered to the two interchangeably. )

[Of course, perhaps people then started threads on red-de-mama asking why people had these daft English names that were so hard to pronounce]